The Government Shutdown Countdown Lowdown MEGATHREAD

[Malthus]

I love the notion that octogenarians are going to gate-crash monuments exactly like illegal immigrants crossing the border. 

[lustindarkness]

They needed a bigger fence, like the one in WWZ movie.

[Malthus]

They needed a bigger fence, like the one in WWZ movie.

Those fences also didn't work. 

The elderly will just form human pyramids to get into those monuments.

[garbon]

I have to admit the bottom part has always confused me. If the gov't holds the belief that those individuals are here illegally, I'm confused why they aren't rounded up when they agitate for rights.  I remember being in California and there were illegal immigrants protesting for driver's licenses. Whole event was being televised and I was like shouldn't they be concerned that the authorities now know who they are?  I suppose that some of the protesters are actual citizens but then that's what ID checks are for.

[Valmy]

I have to admit the bottom part has always confused me. If the gov't holds the belief that those individuals are here illegally, I'm confused why they aren't rounded up when they agitate for rights.  I remember being in California and there were illegal immigrants protesting for driver's licenses. Whole event was being televised and I was like shouldn't they be concerned that the authorities now know who they are?  I suppose that some of the protesters are actual citizens but then that's what ID checks are for.

Good question really.  Right to assembly?  I suppose if you could round them all up for suspicion of lawbreaking for that I guess you could always just do that if you can come up with a pretext?

Probably something like that

[lustindarkness]

They needed a bigger fence, like the one in WWZ movie.

Those fences also didn't work. 

The elderly will just form human pyramids to get into those monuments.

You got a point there, hopefully they have those tennis balls on their walkers and they slip and fall.

[derspiess]

I love the notion that octogenarians are going to gate-crash monuments exactly like illegal immigrants crossing the border. 

Funny you should mention that.  The gubmint apparently green-lighted an illegal immigrant rally & concert on the mall, while still trying to keep old people out of the WWII Memorial.  #washingtonmonumentsyndrome

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/10/08/government-shutdown-immigration-rally/2942257/

[garbon]

I have to admit the bottom part has always confused me. If the gov't holds the belief that those individuals are here illegally, I'm confused why they aren't rounded up when they agitate for rights.  I remember being in California and there were illegal immigrants protesting for driver's licenses. Whole event was being televised and I was like shouldn't they be concerned that the authorities now know who they are?  I suppose that some of the protesters are actual citizens but then that's what ID checks are for.

Good question really.  Right to assembly?  I suppose if you could round them all up for suspicion of lawbreaking for that I guess you could always just do that if you can come up with a pretext?

Probably something like that

But then why don't they just wait on the perimeter of protest and wait to arrest them? After all, you have at least some of the people stating on video that they are "illegals".

[Admiral Yi]

Illegals only get deported if they're caught entering or if they commit crime (a felony I think, not sure) here.

[garbon]

Illegals only get deported if they're caught entering or if they commit crime (a felony I think, not sure) here.

So do we just assume they spontaneously appeared here? Isn't their presence evidence of a crime?

[Jacob]

Question: how do we know that the people at the rally are illegal aliens?

[garbon]

Question: how do we know that the people at the rally are illegal aliens?

On the anecdote I shared, some of the people interviewed at the rally said that they were.  However like I said above, there probably are people that attend that are not -after all Nancy Pelosi will be speaking at this current one - but it seems odd to just give it a carte blanche if you think illegal immigration is a problem.../if you are the gov't and say that illegal immigration is a problem and people shouldn't do it.

[katmai]

Alright now i'm pissed! 

Shutdown means no new beer from craft brewers

Published: October 8, 2013 Updated 9 minutes ago


By CARRIE ANTLFINGER and TODD RICHMOND — The Associated Press

MILWAUKEE — The federal government shutdown could leave America's craft brewers with a serious hangover.

Stores will still offer plenty of suds. But the shutdown has closed an obscure agency that quietly approves new breweries, recipes and labels, which could create huge delays throughout the rapidly growing craft industry, whose customers expect a constant supply of inventive and seasonal beers.

Mike Brenner is trying to open a craft brewery in Milwaukee by December. His application to include a tasting room is now on hold, as are his plans to file paperwork for four labels over the next few weeks. He expects to lose about $8,000 for every month his opening is delayed.

"My dream, this is six years in the making, is to open this brewery," Brenner said. "I've been working so hard, and I find all these great investors. And now I can't get started because people are fighting over this or that in Washington. ... This is something people don't mess around with. Even in a bad economy, people drink beer."

The Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau, or TTB, is a little-known arm of the Treasury Department. The agency will continue to process taxes from existing permit holders, but applications for anything new are in limbo.

"One could think of this shutdown as basically stopping business indefinitely for anyone who didn't have certain paperwork in place back in mid-August," said Paul Gatza, director of the Brewers Association, which represents more than 1,900 U.S. breweries.

A woman who answered the phone Oct. 2 at TTB's headquarters in Washington abruptly hung up after explaining that the government was shut down. Assistant Administrator Cheri Mitchell did not respond to telephone or email messages.

The shutdown began Oct. 1 after a group of House Republican lawmakers blocked a budget deal in a last-ditch effort to stop funding for President Barack Obama's health care law.

The closing isn't expected to have much effect on industry giants such as MillerCoors or Anheuser-Busch. They can continue to produce existing products as usual. But the shutdown poses a huge problem for craft brewers, who build their businesses by producing quirky, offbeat flavors and introducing new seasonal beers, sometimes as often as every quarter.

Craft brewers around the country say TTB was taking as long as 75 days to approve applications before the shutdown. Now they're bracing for even longer waits. And tempers are flaring.

Tony Magee, owner of Lagunitas Brewing Co. in Petaluma, Calif., posted messages on his Twitter account this week ripping the shutdown.

"(Expletive) Feds are gonna shut down the already incompetent .Gov while hundreds of small breweries, including us, have labels pending. Nice." That was followed with "Wanna regulate? Perform or get out of the way."

Lagunitas Chief Operating Officer Todd Stevenson called the TTB shutdown a "headache." He said the company was planning to submit an application to package its autumn seasonal Hairy Eyeball in 22-ounce bottles instead of 12-ounce bottles but can't move forward.

"It's just aggravating," Stevenson said. "It is frustrating that government can't do its job. Doing what they're doing now is unprecedented."

Bryan Simpson, a spokesman for New Belgium Brewing in Fort Collins, Colo., said his brewery has three recipes and five new labels awaiting approval. The company is especially worried that the release of its new spring label, Spring Blonde, could get pushed back. More delays might force New Belgium to shell out extra money to speed up the label printing and rush the beer to market, he said.

"Everybody is frustrated in general," Simpson said. "The whole way this has played out has been disappointing for the entire country."

Lakefront Brewery in Milwaukee has applications pending for new packaging of its IBA dark ale and for permission to offer a sour cherry dark lager called John, a brewery employee's own concoction.

The brewery hopes to launch the IBA packaging in November and John in December, but nothing is certain now. If the shutdown causes delays, the brewery will probably have to rush the beers to market, he said.

"If we lose that first month, we lose out on a good chunk of money," brewery spokesman Matt Karjnak said. "Right now, it's only been a week so it's not too bad. Two weeks, three weeks is when we're really going to start sweating here."

Brenner said politicians don't seem to care how much damage they're causing.

"For them it's just another day," he said. "They are still getting paid, but I'm losing $8,000 a month."

[derspiess]

Local brewers here have been crowing about this since day 1 of the shutdown.  Some of it is a bit exaggerated, with one claiming that he might have to pour out some seasonal beer because people "might not want it" if it comes out too late.  Somehow, I doubt that.  If it tastes decent enough, then sell it at a discount and it will go fast.  People buy seasonal beer out of season all the time.

It's not affecting my favorite brewery at all, since as a more established brewery they've had all their recipes & labels approved for quite a while.  Sucks for some of the recent start-ups, but if they were a little less schizophrenic in the first place and focused on establishing a solid core for their beer lineup, they'd be a lot less impacted.

edit: As a side-note, it's silly that beer recipes have to be approved by a federal authority before the beer can be sold.  The labels I can understand.

[merithyn]

The school district here has been going back and forth with the teachers for a contract. To the point that they've been coming closer and closer to a strike, and they brought in a federal mediator. Of course, now the federal mediator is out of the picture.

The strike is expected to take place next week.

Can't blame the shutdown, specifically, if they go on strike, but it certainly isn't helping the situation.