The EU thread

[Zanza]

So apparently:

President Donald Trump's administration has told allies in the UK and Europe that it wants them to buy American weapons and military equipment in order to maintain the NATO alliance, European officials familiar with the matter said.

https://financialpost.com/pmn/business-pmn/trump-tells-europe-to-buy-american-weapons-to-keep-nato-strong

Same procedure as last time.

[Valmy]

So apparently:

President Donald Trump's administration has told allies in the UK and Europe that it wants them to buy American weapons and military equipment in order to maintain the NATO alliance, European officials familiar with the matter said.

https://financialpost.com/pmn/business-pmn/trump-tells-europe-to-buy-american-weapons-to-keep-nato-strong

That seems like a particularly bad idea. But I guess this is how Donald Trump can destroy NATO and blame the Euros for it. The Euros should call his bluff. He does not have the best interests of the security of Europe at heart.

[Norgy]

Vice president/Crown Prince Jack Daniels Vance gave Europe a lesson about how to treat immigration today.
It was of course sorely needed, as there are hardly any anti-immigration Europeans.

[Valmy]

Vice president/Crown Prince Jack Daniels Vance gave Europe a lesson about how to treat immigration today.
It was of course sorely needed, as there are hardly any anti-immigration Europeans.

Pretty sure Greta Thunberg shut down every anti-immigrant voice in Europe.

[Norgy]

Damn women!

[Richard Hakluyt]

Very interesting that Vance finds women so terrifying that he ranks a Swedish schoolgirl as a similar threat in scale to an amoral megalomaniac thrashing about in the heart of the USA's administrative machinery 

[Jacob]

It's pretty clear to me that significant elements within the Trump regime see the EU as an enemy. Whether it's true of the whole administration, time will tell. But a pivot to ally with Russia against the EU, and be frenemies with China does not seem impossible right now.

I wouldn't be super surprised if Trump lets China have Taiwan either.

[Valmy]

Very interesting that Vance finds women so terrifying that he ranks a Swedish schoolgirl as a similar threat in scale to an amoral megalomaniac thrashing about in the heart of the USA's administrative machinery 

Him mentioning her randomly years and years after her saying something about global warming is wild. Obviously daring to say something Vance doesn't like means you are a bigger threat to Europe than Russia. Even years later.

[Barrister]

It's pretty clear to me that significant elements within the Trump regime see the EU as an enemy. Whether it's true of the whole administration, time will tell. But a pivot to ally with Russia against the EU, and be frenemies with China does not seem impossible right now.

I wouldn't be super surprised if Trump lets China have Taiwan either.

He's sees the EU as a possible threat to US world power, and as such wants to knock it down.

Russia - obviously he's on the one hand more cordial to Russia/Putin as he respects Putin as a brutal dictator not afraid to kill people, but knows that Russia is also kind of weak.

China - he's said a lot of negative things about China though, but again respects Xi for being "tough".

[Jacob]

He's sees the EU as a possible threat to US world power, and as such wants to knock it down.

Russia - obviously he's on the one hand more cordial to Russia/Putin as he respects Putin as a brutal dictator not afraid to kill people, but knows that Russia is also kind of weak.

China - he's said a lot of negative things about China though, but again respects Xi for being "tough".

Yeah, I think Trump would like to see the US, China, and Russia carve the rest of the world up as sphere's of influence so he can bully his former allies more thoroughly. And, I think, he expects the US to be stronger than Russia and China so he's okay with letting them expand their power a bit - as long as he can expand his power more.

How that intersects with the tech-fascists Yarvinist post-national network states remains to be seen.

[Sheilbh]

I don't think Trump sees the EU or any Europeans as a threat. I think Trump's a bully. If someone's weak or depends on/needs him - he will bully and humiliate them. If they don't he will treat them with some respect.

I think his view of the EU and Europeans generally is basically the way he viewed "establishment" Republican Senators.

It is in Europe's hands how weak and dependent on Trump it is.

But I agree he basically thinks of the world in sphere of influence terms (and, of course, for all the talk of alliances it is always worth remembering that most of the Western hemisphere has not experienced America as an ally) carved up between states with the power to do it.

I was listening to a podcast I listen to fairly regularly which is all China specialists. They were talking about a wider vibe shift in the US on views on China but said that they are hearing more and more in conversations with China specialists that they actually think a Trump administration might be better in toning down the stance towards China than Harris and developing a functioning relationship with Beijing. One said their expectation is quite possibly a Xi-Trump deal on trade by the end of the year - we'll see.

[Valmy]

Based on what? Wishful thinking?

[Sheilbh]

I don't think so.

In part just how confrontational DC got, particularly the Jake Sullivan part of the White House (with Yellen in particular as a moderating factor), on China which seemed to be locked in on Harris' team too.

China wasn't a major focus for Trump on campaign trail, the tariffs that have been announced were lower than were expected. He's got backers (like Musk - but not only him) with major business interests and dependencies in China and I think an executive for TikTok US had dinner with Trump before he announced his decision on that. As I say we'll see but I can see the argument.

[Valmy]

Yeah we are always just fucking minutes away from discovering everything was 5-D chess after all.

After a decade I have only so much patience for this bullshit.

I will believe it when I see it. A million dollars has a better chance of magically appearing in my bank account than Donald Trump working out some great deal with China.

[Jacob]

What do you mean?

I can totally see Trump working out a deal with China.

He'll sell out some technology and weaken the commitment to Taiwan. He won't care about China bullying its neighbours. Those are all worth some sort of concessions from China. And, of course, those concessions will primarily go into the pockets of oligarchs whom the PRC will have ways to make "bend the knee".