Russo-Ukrainian War 2014-25

[Barrister]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

The Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy

The Irrelevant Example

Edit: ok I partially take it back, could be just British indeed

We used to have a Royal Canadian Air Force, Royal Canadian Navy, etc.  Now it is just the Canadian Armed Forces 

OK breaking radio silence.

https://www.canada.ca/en/air-force.html

https://www.canada.ca/en/navy.html

While both the RCN and RCAF are part of the overall Canadian Armed Forces, they reverted to their traditional names under Harper.

[crazy canuck]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

The Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy

The Irrelevant Example

Edit: ok I partially take it back, could be just British indeed

We used to have a Royal Canadian Air Force, Royal Canadian Navy, etc.  Now it is just the Canadian Armed Forces 

OK breaking radio silence.

https://www.canada.ca/en/air-force.html

https://www.canada.ca/en/navy.html

While both the RCN and RCAF are part of the overall Canadian Armed Forces, they reverted to their traditional names under Harper.

Ah, thanks for the correction.  That makes me feel better. 

[Barrister]

More broadly - it is interesting how some military gets referred to by specific names, whereas others don't.

Off the top of my head - the IDF and JDF (Israeli/Japanese Defence Forces).  Bundeswehr gets used for Germany (also Luftwaffe).  This might not be the most common but in the pro-Ukraine circles I see plenty of references to AFU - Armed Forces of Ukraine.

But on the other hand... I have no idea what the Mexican army is called, or any number of European forces.  "Finnish Army" would seem to be sufficient, for example.

[Josquius]

The JDF will come out of its constitutional status as honestly not an army, seriously, and the heavy role the US had in setting it up and governing it.

I guess the IDF has historic reasons, an outgrowth of settler militias, as I don't think there's any constitutional restrictions there.

But yes. Funny the Germans in ww2 keep the German names.

[Sheilbh]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

Well also of course the Kaiser in English refers to Kaiser's in unified Germany, not the Austrians - but also a bit weird that they get Kaiser and Russian's the Tsar (or, indeed, Persians the Shah) while, say, the French, Mexicans, Japanese, Ethiopians all have emperors.

I don't think there's a reason - I wondered if it might almost be the opposite of what you suggest, to emphasis otherness, but I'm not so sure - beyond what gets picked up in English and becomes part of the language.

I could be totally wrong but in my head Churchill and the BBC at the time referred to the Luftwaffe and the Nazis which is probably part of it in terms of shaping English usage. 

Off the top of my head - the IDF and JDF (Israeli/Japanese Defence Forces).  Bundeswehr gets used for Germany (also Luftwaffe).  This might not be the most common but in the pro-Ukraine circles I see plenty of references to AFU - Armed Forces of Ukraine.

PLA too.

Or use "Nazi" instead of "German". That always gives me the impression that people want to see the Nazis as some kind of clique that committed all the crimes instead of a broad responsibility by the German people.

As mentioned by Noel Coward in Don't Let's be Beastly to the Germans (his satirical war song that many people, including Churchill, thought was serious and borderline treasonous)

I'd add that I think the greatest British film ever made is The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp which is in part about the good Germans v the Nazis. I think it tends to be a fairly common distinction - and not a million miles from often seeing "Putin's war" nowadays.

[Josquius]

It low-key bothers me that in WW2 vernacular, we seem to be unable to say "German Army" or "German Air Force"...no...we gotta be all edgy and throw out the "Wehrmacht" and "Luftwaffe".  While not giving that courtesy to other non-English militaries. 

Well also of course the Kaiser in English refers to Kaiser's in unified Germany, not the Austrians - but also a bit weird that they get Kaiser and Russian's the Tsar (or, indeed, Persians the Shah) while, say, the French, Mexicans, Japanese, Ethiopians all have emperors.

We recognise the HRE as the legitimate heir of Rome? :p


The non European ones of course derive their emperorness from a totally different source.
(though not sure on Ethiopia?)

[Norgy]

I think the Mexican emperor scored low on voter confidence, yes. My God, European countries have had a lot of weird foreign interventions. "Hey, let's put an emperor in Mexico". "Sure, just let me drink my absinthe first".

More broadly - it is interesting how some military gets referred to by specific names, whereas others don't.

Off the top of my head - the IDF and JDF (Israeli/Japanese Defence Forces).  Bundeswehr gets used for Germany (also Luftwaffe).  This might not be the most common but in the pro-Ukraine circles I see plenty of references to AFU - Armed Forces of Ukraine.

But on the other hand... I have no idea what the Mexican army is called, or any number of European forces.  "Finnish Army" would seem to be sufficient, for example.

In Norway the ground forces are just "Hæren", or "The Army" directly translated. And, well, so is "Marinen". The Navy. Not that we have much to show for in either case.

[celedhring]

More broadly - it is interesting how some military gets referred to by specific names, whereas others don't.

Off the top of my head - the IDF and JDF (Israeli/Japanese Defence Forces).  Bundeswehr gets used for Germany (also Luftwaffe).  This might not be the most common but in the pro-Ukraine circles I see plenty of references to AFU - Armed Forces of Ukraine.

But on the other hand... I have no idea what the Mexican army is called, or any number of European forces.  "Finnish Army" would seem to be sufficient, for example.

I think that's because those armed forces have got involved in widely reported conflicts so the media naturally ends up using specific names for them instead of generic "xxxish army". That's not the case for the Germans/Japan, but they had a bit of a branding inssue hence the new names being pushed 

[viper37]

I liked that
https://tinyurl.com/37u99r3j

[Zoupa]

The Syrian opposition is moving on Aleppo and has taken a big swath of surrounding territory.

Judging by tactics, the use of fpv drones and even the kit their soldiers use, they definitely got trained by Ukrainians.

[Barrister]

The Syrian opposition is moving on Aleppo and has taken a big swath of surrounding territory.

Judging by tactics, the use of fpv drones and even the kit their soldiers use, they definitely got trained by Ukrainians.

I was reading something about that.

Quite frankly - the ongoing civil war in Syria is something I know almost nothing about (other than it's not over).

Who are the opposition?  They're bound to be better than Assad, but is it primarily Islamist?

[Syt]

Also, how much support are the Russians still providing? How much of their personnel has moved to Ukraine to plug gaps?

[Zoupa]

The Syrian opposition is moving on Aleppo and has taken a big swath of surrounding territory.

Judging by tactics, the use of fpv drones and even the kit their soldiers use, they definitely got trained by Ukrainians.

I was reading something about that.

Quite frankly - the ongoing civil war in Syria is something I know almost nothing about (other than it's not over).

Who are the opposition?  They're bound to be better than Assad, but is it primarily Islamist?

They're not the Taliban, but they're in the same ballpark. Mostly an offshoot of Al Qaeda, but they denounced them and repudiated affiliation. They keep the schools and university, general services in Idlib, north west Syria. Judicial system (such as it is) is based on Islamic law. I'd still take them over Assad. They (mostly) negotiate with other syrian factions instead of straight up murdering everyone like Assad does.

So all in all, not exactly good guys.

[Zoupa]

Also, how much support are the Russians still providing? How much of their personnel has moved to Ukraine to plug gaps?

Diminished but still present. Most of the air assets have been moved back to russia proper, which is probably why we're seeing movement now.

[Josquius]

The Syrian opposition is moving on Aleppo and has taken a big swath of surrounding territory.

Judging by tactics, the use of fpv drones and even the kit their soldiers use, they definitely got trained by Ukrainians.

Wow.
Didn't expect any movement there. I thought the regular opposition was basically beaten now and just held on sort of in a few fringe places.