Russo-Ukrainian War 2014-23 and Invasion

[Threviel]

Anecdotally they teated the S-tank against its Soviet counterparts when the wall came down and apparently the armour might as well have been paper.

[DGuller]

Sure, it was paper, but it was heavily sloped paper.  Did that not help?

[mongers]

Anecdotally they teated the S-tank against its Soviet counterparts when the wall came down and apparently the armour might as well have been paper.

The S-tank's armour or the soviets?

[grumbler]

Anecdotally they teated the S-tank against its Soviet counterparts when the wall came down and apparently the armour might as well have been paper.

The S-tank's armour or the soviets?

The S Tank was virtually unarmored.  It was what in WW2 was called a tank destroyer; ambush and then di di.

[Zanza]

[HVC]

I would have thought France did more. UK is top 3 in two categories. Good for them.

[Syt]

I appreciate the graphic defining what they count as Armored Fighting Vehicles

[Admiral Yi]

Looks like we had a few M113s sitting around.

[Josquius]

I had no idea Turkey had been donating. Thought they were trying to position themselves as a neutral mediator.

Love the stay going round that Russia has lost a huge percent of its prewar tank force whilst Ukraine has more tanks than it started with.

[Sheilbh]

I had no idea Turkey had been donating. Thought they were trying to position themselves as a neutral mediator.

I know I'm a stuck record on this but Turkey isn't just trying to position themselves as a neutral mediator. When Russia and Ukraine need to talk (for example grain shipments), Turkey is the country they ask to facilitate. I think it's an important and valuable role - and I think Turkey is possibly the only country where both Ukraine and Russia trust them to do it (Israel was too for a bit but not anymore).

It's not hugely satisfying from a Western, pro-Ukrainian perspective. But my view tends to be to follow the Ukrainians - and they're not getting really annoyed and calling out Turkey in the way they do other countries they feel are not helping.

On those vehicles - I understand that like Bayraktars they're a piece of Turkish kit so wanting to help, but also an opportunity to raise the profile of Turkish equipment/get some orders in.

I would have thought France did more. UK is top 3 in two categories. Good for them.

France is almost certainly doing a lot more. The French are the least transparent about what they're giving and how much of all the big Western countries. We know bits and pieces of what they're providing, but don't seem to have much of a picture But I'd note that the Ukrainians seem pretty happy with the French.

I think the Ukraine Support Tracker is doing the best they can but it's difficult when some countries, like France, are being shady about what they're providing I'm not sure why the French are so vague/non-transparent about it though.

Also worth noting that that side of things is important - but in many areas just reflects size of the economy so size with the spend on military. They also have one on percentage of GDP and it is worth flagging the Baltics, especially Estonia and Latvia who are providing a lot of support (I mean Estonia is providing more in cash terms than, say, Italy) - and also facing some of the worst inflation in Europe because of energy. In a way it's expected, but it is really impressive - both the level of commitment and sustaining it in the face of a huge impact domestically (I think inflation's been running over 20% most of the year).

[Grey Fox]

Imo, the French are shady because of historical friendship with Russia. France and it's presidents always want to be the leaders of Europe and having Russia has a counter balance to Germany can serve that purpose.

Also, for some reason, Macron didn't want to humiliate Putin. Europe's elite is so charmed by Putin. The Germans, Berlusconi, the Swiss, the list goes on.

[Sheilbh]

Imo, the French are shady because of historical friendship with Russia. France and it's presidents always want to be the leaders of Europe and having Russia has a counter balance to Germany can serve that purpose.

Also, for some reason, Macron didn't want to humiliate Putin. Europe's elite is so charmed by Putin. The Germans, Berlusconi, the Swiss, the list goes on.

That may be it - Macron's statements are a lot better than they were but he still always feels the need to remind people that after the war Russia will still be there. It's like a long lingering echo of "Europe from the Atlantic to the Urals".

But from everything I've read even though they don't confirm what they're sending, France is a very important supporter of Ukraine materially.

[OttoVonBismarck]

Lot of reporting coming out this week from various British MoD and U.S. DoD sources on the increased Russian offensive in the east--they've made progress, but it seems like the scale of Russian casualties and offensive ineptitude is almost beyond belief. Reports of entire brigades completely destroyed, units at Vuhledar where "any survivors are considered deserters" by the Russians. A Russian news agency interview a guy who was one of like 3 survivors of his entire company, and he said he wished he had been captured by the Ukrainians.

It's also been reported this week that Russia is believed to have lost in total 50% of all of its main battle tanks in the last year.

I get that Russia, manpower wise, can in fact just keep spewing bodies into this grinder, but this seems incredibly stupid and destructive.

[Josquius]

I wonder how many it'll take before we start seeing a demographic echo in the Russian population pyramid off the war.

[OttoVonBismarck]

My guess is a bigger demographic impact is the # of Russian men who have emigrated and probably won't ever return in order to avoid this.