Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

Started by Josquius, February 20, 2016, 07:46:34 AM

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How would you vote on Britain remaining in the EU?

British- Remain
12 (12%)
British - Leave
7 (7%)
Other European - Remain
21 (21%)
Other European - Leave
6 (6%)
ROTW - Remain
34 (34%)
ROTW - Leave
20 (20%)

Total Members Voted: 98

HVC

Quote from: Josquius on December 25, 2022, 10:09:32 AM
Quote from: HVC on December 25, 2022, 10:07:55 AMScience experiment for our British posters. Can you say Purple Burglar Alarm :D

:blink:
Yes?
I don't get it.

How far north are you from? You sure you're not a southerner? :P
Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.


HVC

Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.

Josquius

I'm not getting it. He seems to say it fine the first times but then gets in a muddle.
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HVC

I guess josq can't say it right either, just doesn't realize it :lol:


I also like watching Scotts yelling at Alexa or siri. Youtube recommended me frustrated scotts for Christmas
Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.

Sheilbh

Quote from: HVC on December 25, 2022, 10:17:27 AMI guess josq can't say it right either, just doesn't realize it :lol:
:lol: I'm not sure. North-Easterners don't roll their rs like Scots.

QuoteI also like watching Scotts yelling at Alexa or siri. Youtube recommended me frustrated scotts for Christmas
Machine learning can do so much, but can't crack Glaswegian :(
Let's bomb Russia!

Syt

Quote from: HVC on December 25, 2022, 10:17:27 AMI guess josq can't say it right either, just doesn't realize it :lol:


I also like watching Scotts yelling at Alexa or siri. Youtube recommended me frustrated scotts for Christmas

A classic: https://youtu.be/HbDnxzrbxn4
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.


Josquius

#23528
So, the Kings speech today was quite a hefty fuck you to the tories :lol:

Quote from: Syt on December 25, 2022, 10:33:50 AM
Quote from: HVC on December 25, 2022, 10:17:27 AMI guess josq can't say it right either, just doesn't realize it :lol:


I also like watching Scotts yelling at Alexa or siri. Youtube recommended me frustrated scotts for Christmas

A classic: https://youtu.be/HbDnxzrbxn4

The struggle is real.

Recently there was a pilot of a sitcom based in my hometown. It was Meh but cool to see representation.
One joke I do remember - the main character wants to ask Google to search for something, so switches to speaking posh temporarily.
Only for me I find I need a terrible American accent.

Quote from: HVC on December 25, 2022, 10:17:27 AMI guess josq can't say it right either, just doesn't realize it :lol:


I also like watching Scotts yelling at Alexa or siri. Youtube recommended me frustrated scotts for Christmas

https://youtu.be/7msoqnz2bcY
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Sheilbh

On a possibe new shift to a consensus around resilience I found this article striking. In particular the sourcing is really striking - it's by the Policy Editor not a political reporter and all of the sourcing is "senior Whitehall figures" so Whitehall/civil service not Westminster/politicians. The whole way the story's positioned and the context (warning to industry) seems like it might be the security services warning the private sector.

On the one hand probably good and necessary to start planning (but we won't), on the other it's sad that it's necessary and maybe a little worrying that we're at the stage of Whitehall privately warning industry. Also strikingly different from the tone in Europe who talk about this but also continued engagement. My reading of this is that whoever is briefing basically seems to think it's a matter of when and not if China invades Taiwan which is, again, worrying:
QuoteUK economy 'not prepared' for fallout if China invades Taiwan
Oliver Wright, Policy Editor | Didi Tang, Beijing
Tuesday December 27 2022, 12.01am, The Times

Britain is unprepared for the "catastrophic" economic consequences that would result from a Chinese invasion of Taiwan, figures at the top of government have privately warned.

The UK's most senior officials believe that a conflict in the South China Sea would cripple supply chains and lead to Covid-style shortages of vital imports.

Over the weekend Beijing's sabre-rattling reached new heights as the Chinese military flew a record number of warplanes close to Taiwan.

The British officials warned industry leaders to think "very hard" about where they source vital goods such as medical supplies, components for consumer goods and, in particular, semiconductors that are widely used, including in phones and advanced weapon systems.

"If you scale up to any sort of worsening relationship with China there isn't a single organisation whose supply chains will not be significantly to catastrophically affected where we're talking about sanctions and difficulties in trading," one senior Whitehall figure said. "I'm not sure we've really understood a future in which we are up against some of the greatest chess players in the world."

At the weekend China sent 71 warplanes near Taiwan in a 24-hour period after President Biden signed legislation to boost military assistance to the island. US military and intelligence officials have warned that President Xi has set a deadline of 2027 to retake Taiwan, which the Chinese government has never recognised as independent.

A report in the summer claimed that some in the US intelligence community believed that China could attack as soon as 2024.

Whitehall officials say that in the event of an invasion the West would inevitably impose heavy sanctions on Beijing and that trade with Taiwan would be wiped out.

Taiwan makes 65 per cent of the world's semiconductors and almost 90 per cent of the most advanced chips used in telecommunications and computers. This month the government announced a deal with Japan to improve collaboration on supply chains in technology, and the US recently allocated $39 billion for domestic semiconductor manufacturing.

Whitehall remains concerned that many UK businesses are not sufficiently prepared for the economic disruption that any conflict would cause. UK imports from China last year totalled £63.6 billion, or 13.3 per cent of all goods imported.

" 'Just in time' is absolutely wonderful in economic efficiency, but in times of crisis resilience matters an awful lot more," a senior Whitehall figure said. "Companies need to think ahead about their supply chains. Covid showed up the flimsiness of our supply chains in all sorts of areas and organisations."

Alicia Kearns, chairwoman of the foreign affairs select committee, said any decision to impose sanctions on China would affect every family in Britain. "If we think about the impact of the war in Ukraine on people in Britain that would be nothing compared with any conflict over Taiwan," she said.

Sir Iain Duncan Smith, the former Conservative leader, said Britain had "never been so dependent economically upon one country" who was not an ally "as we are upon China right now".
Let's bomb Russia!

Grey Fox

No one is ready, no one can be ready. Especially, since Taiwan plan seems to be to scuttle everything and leave China an empty husk.
Colonel Caliga is Awesome.

Tonitrus

The other option/possibility is that Taiwan instantly (or almost instantly) surrenders, WW2-Denmark style.  Then we get lots of potential freedom-seeking refugees (if they're able to leave), a PRC-stranglehold on the superconductor industry and a diplomatic fait accompli. 

We won't even have much to complain about diplomatically, since we recognize Taiwan as part of China...but I am sure a strongly-worded protest will come about nevertheless.   

Sheilbh

Quote from: Grey Fox on December 28, 2022, 10:21:53 PMNo one is ready, no one can be ready. Especially, since Taiwan plan seems to be to scuttle everything and leave China an empty husk.
I agree that no-one is or can be ready. The thing I find interesting is that a "senior Whitehall source" from the non-political bit of the state is apparently warning business to prepare.

Nothing imminent or detailed but British "most senior officials" warning business and reports that American intelligence figures think it's likely in 2024-7 seems a little ominous. As I say it feels a bit more when than if.
Let's bomb Russia!

Crazy_Ivan80

Putting a number of warships in range of the Malacca strait should help a lot with being ready.

Sheilbh

Another endorsement for Rest is History to go with Tamas' - but thing I thought was interesting here is the point about the podcasts that are relatively successful with millions of listeners.

Particularly because I've posted before that a star podcast producer and some very big BBC journalists were poached by a company that does podcasts (and commercial radio). I thought it was really interesting and counter-intuitive to see big broadcasters moving to podcosts/radio in 2022.

But I also wonder how this links with the BBC in general - I will moan to anyone who'll listen about the degree to which they've cut back pretty cheap arts, culture and history broadcasting. It's interesting to see that the commercial podcast model shows there is a pretty hefty demand for that sort of content and I wonder if it's something that'll give the BBC and Ofcom pause given their current strategy is to focus on less "educational"/"cultural" content and more on the "entertainment". Obviously podcasts are cheaper and wildly less researched. But, for example, given that culture broadcasting was often just plopping Waldemar Januszczak or Bendor Grosvenor into a gallery and them talking through it- that doesn't sound a million miles from their podcast.

I imagine those broadcasters now at Global have burned their bridges with BBC forever but I wonder if that could be the next iteration. In the same way as on entertainment the BBC is now working with Disney on Dr Who to give it global reach, if their way of doing cultural/history/arts broadcasting is to partner with podcast brands that are already established, which they know is accessible and they know there's a market (given that the BBC seems in a very risk averse mood at the minute)? :hmm:

Having said that I think Januszczak has probably also burned his bridges with the BBC because he is very vocal in his criticism of how they've got back on arts programming - although maybe not :ph34r:
QuoteI've not been this obsessed since I was 11
My love of The Rest is History podcast is far from unusual: it's proof that intelligent conversation sells
James Marriott
Wednesday December 28 2022, 9.00pm, The Times

'Did you listen to the episode about the Costa Rican civil war?" "Yeah, so good. Did you listen to the one about Churchill?" "Yeah, it was amazing. Did you listen to the one on Trafalgar . . . on Alexander the Great . . . on the last emperor of Brazil . . . on the history of the beaver?"

In 2022 my conversation, which I am sure once flitted suavely across books, music, politics and so on, has been reduced to only one subject: the podcast The Rest is History, hosted by the historians Tom Holland and Dominic Sandbrook. I am a helpless, devoted, pathetic fan. So is everyone I know.

The Rest is History takes the form of a series of witty, clever, informative conversations between Sandbrook and Holland on aspects of history as diverse as, well . . . the career of Churchill and the history of the beaver.

I must be near the epicentre of enthusiasm. I have not experienced such ubiquity of obsession since I was 11 and my friends wanted to know whether I thought I was a Ravenclaw or a Hufflepuff. (Now, we ask: "Are you more of a Holland or a Sandbrook?")

The sounds of The Rest is History drift from the bathroom whenever a flatmate takes a shower. Talking to strangers at parties is no longer a drag — sooner or later we will discover that we both love The Rest is History and from there the conversation will flow. ("Did you listen to the episode on the Costa Rican civil war?")

This is not a cult or niche thing. The Rest is History has been downloaded 50 million times — a figure you might instructively compare to the three million who watched this year's EastEnders Christmas special. At the time of writing, it is at the top of the Apple podcast charts, meaning (though Apple's calculations are secret) that it is probably the most listened-to podcast in the country.

Recall that there are podcasts on sex, podcasts on politics and podcasts hosted by footballers. The Rest is History, meanwhile, has cheerfully dedicated three (superb) hours to a discussion of the Battle of Trafalgar and another three to the early life of Churchill. This Christmas, historiographical problems attending the study of early Christianity got almost an hour.

You have to feel that rote laments about declining attention spans or the triviality of 21st century public discourse have missed something.

For years, arts broadcasting in Britain has been tending towards a kind of Dark Ages. Bright candles of learning burnt on at Radio 4 — Melvyn Bragg's In Our Time, Neil MacGregor's A History of the World in 100 Objects. But generally, elite estimation of public taste has never been lower — something that might be attributed to the cultural gulf opened up by inequality and declining social mobility.

The worst of this attitude was revealed on a recent episode of the BBC's only television programme about literature, Between the Covers, when a guest remarked, "I don't know how people find the time. They're long, aren't they, books?" — an observation greeted with sympathetic chuckles by the show's presenters. The attitude of cheerful hostility to anything "educational" is characteristic of much modern arts programming. The barbarians aren't at the gates. They are cracking jokes on air.

In this context, The Rest is History represents a revolution in intelligent broadcasting for a mass audience. Not that it is remotely worthy. I regularly find myself standing in Tesco grinning stupidly at, for instance, a discussion of the forgotten Olympic sport of "dwile flonking" or an account of ancient beliefs about beaver testicles. Sandbrook and Holland's old-school approach to history — battles and kings plus intelligent scepticism of political correctness and a sturdy antipathy to the French — has the effect of seeming almost anarchic in 2022.

The humour is a function of their enthusiasm, not an attempt to disguise it. The tone is two friends enjoying themselves rather than two presenters gurningly trying to distract their listeners from the fact that they are being covertly educated. And humour does not preclude historical seriousness (that discussion of the sources of early Christianity) or emotional seriousness (listen to the moving episode on Sophie Scholl and the anti-Nazi White Rose movement).

Modern producers underestimate their power. An intelligent public is not out there waiting patiently for instruction. To some extent, it must be created. How many thousands of The Rest is History listeners will have had no idea they were interested in the history of Portugal or the emperors of Mexico until hearing Sandbrook and Holland's witty expositions of those subjects?

We're too accustomed to the idea that each new technological innovation makes us shallower, our minds more glib. At its best, podcasting pulls in the other direction — longer, more in-depth, more intelligent. Do it well enough and the public will follow.

The Rest is History is not alone. Try Mike Duncan's epic, centuries-spanning Revolutions or the superb Waldy and Bendy's Adventures in Art, hosted by the art critics Waldemar Januszczak and Bendor Grosvenor, which desperately needs reviving for another series.

As a curious teenager in the early 2000s, I resorted to educating myself with old telly: Kenneth Clark's Civilisation, Robert Hughes's The Shock of the New, John Berger's Ways of Seeing. How I wish that I'd had The Rest is History.

I also wonder if, with the BBC, part of it is being trapped in its own legacy - they tried to re-do Civilisations (deliberately plural and with multiple narrators: Mary Beard, Simon Schama, David Olusoga etc). Maybe they need to aspire less to doing a new The Shock of the New and look at other content people are consuming instead.
Let's bomb Russia!