http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/foreigners-dont-like-muslims-only-their-money-turkish-president-erdogan.aspx?PageID=238&NID=74893&NewsCatID=338
QuoteForeigners don't like Muslims, only their money: Turkish President Erdoğan
"Foreigners" are unable to solve the problems of the Middle East because Western states "don't like us" and are more interested in just following the cash, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan said on Nov. 27.
"Only we can solve our problems. I speak openly; foreigners love oil, gold, diamonds, and the cheap labor force of the Islamic world. They like the conflicts, fights and quarrels of the Middle East. Believe me, they don't like us," said Erdoğan during an address to the Standing Committee for Economic and Commercial Cooperation of the Organization of Islamic Cooperation (COMCEC) in Istanbul.
"They look like friends, but they want us dead, they like seeing our children die. How long will we stand that fact?" he added.
Erdoğan said Middle Eastern countries could solve their problems by themselves without any help from the West.
"The only condition to overcome the crisis in the Islamic world is unity, solidarity and alliance. Believe me, we can resolve every problem as long as we are united. Islamic countries, which have developed economically recently, have been experiencing the biggest humanitarian and political crisis in their history simultaneously," the Turkish president said.
"If we act together, we will end the loneliness of Palestine which has continued for nearly one century ... It is possible to end the bloodshed in Iraq and killing of Syrian children if we unite," he said.
'Ego complex'
He also savaged critics of his remarks that Muslim explorers traveled to the Americas before Columbus as suffering from an "ego complex," reaffirming his belief their purported feat was an historical fact.
"I have been the target of heavy criticism by the Western media. Just because I repeated a fact based on scientific research, I have been targeted by the Western media, as well as the foreigners within who suffer from an ego complex," he said.
Erdoğan stirred controversy earlier this month by declaring that the Americas were discovered by Muslims in the 12th century, nearly three centuries before Christopher Columbus sailed across the Atlantic. He did not elaborate as to why the claim is only found in some obscure sources and is not known more widely.
Erdoğan insisted the criticism was aimed at preventing Muslims from "questioning anything."
"They have been very disturbed by the fact that we have reminded them of some historical facts, the history of civilization, science, politics and war. They don't want us to question anything," he said.
Erdogan cited as evidence the claim that "Columbus mentioned the existence of a mosque on a hill on the Cuban coast," and asked to build a mosque at the site mentioned by the Genoese explorer.
Most history books say Columbus set foot on the American continent in 1492 as he was seeking a new maritime route to India. A tiny minority of Muslim scholars have recently suggested a prior Muslim presence in the Americas, although no pre-Columbian ruin of an Islamic structure has ever been found.
In a controversial article published in 1996, historian Youssef Mroueh referred to a diary entry from Columbus that mentions a mosque in Cuba. But the passage is widely understood to be a metaphorical reference to the mosque-like shape of the landscape.
Is this the week of crazy or something?
It's both amusing and scary.
The Pope will visit Turkey shortly and meet with Erdogan. That should be good.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:21:01 AM
It's both amusing and scary.
Why do you care? :unsure:
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:22:36 AM
The Pope will visit Turkey shortly and meet with Erdogan. That should be good.
Hopefully better than the meeting between JP II and Ali Ağca?
Quote from: Monoriu on November 28, 2014, 04:24:18 AM
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:21:01 AM
It's both amusing and scary.
Why do you care? :unsure:
Turkey is an important NATO country. It's one of the few that seriously take their military commitments.
Quote from: Monoriu on November 28, 2014, 04:24:18 AM
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:21:01 AM
It's both amusing and scary.
Why do you care? :unsure:
Considering the significant amount of people living in Vienna with Turkish roots, and a significant amount of them being Erdogan fanbois (last year we had thousands protesting in his favor during the Gezi protest thing, and more attending his election campaign rally here earlier this year) I find it useful to know what's going on in Turkish politics.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:30:44 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on November 28, 2014, 04:24:18 AM
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:21:01 AM
It's both amusing and scary.
Why do you care? :unsure:
Considering the significant amount of people living in Vienna with Turkish roots, and a significant amount of them being Erdogan fanbois (last year we had thousands protesting in his favor during the Gezi protest thing, and more attending his election campaign rally here earlier this year) I find it useful to know what's going on in Turkish politics.
Oh how I hate stuff like that. If the ruler of your country is such a great guy and he is so awesome you want to protest for him, the hell you are doing living in another country?
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:21:01 AM
It's both amusing and scary.
Like fucking a tiger?
A lot of them will have Austrian citizenship, so it's technically not "their country."
Is dual citizenship allowed in Austria? In Germany, it's allowed for EU nationals, and for others only till a certain age.
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on November 28, 2014, 06:30:22 AM
Is dual citizenship allowed in Austria? In Germany, it's allowed for EU nationals, and for others only till a certain age.
It's not. Supposedly the Turkish embassy is advising Turks getting their Austrian citizenship to come back afterwards to reclaim their Turkish passport as well. It was in the news this year, but there was not much follow up, so it might be that there's not many cases where this happens.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 06:47:38 AM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on November 28, 2014, 06:30:22 AM
Is dual citizenship allowed in Austria? In Germany, it's allowed for EU nationals, and for others only till a certain age.
It's not. Supposedly the Turkish embassy is advising Turks getting their Austrian citizenship to come back afterwards to reclaim their Turkish passport as well. It was in the news this year, but there was not much follow up, so it might be that there's not many cases where this happens.
So double citizenship, not dual citizenship. Mind you, it's not like all German civil servants have grasped the concept of dual citizenship.
OTOH, while in Austrian law, the foreign-born or foreign origin Turk naturalising individual automatically loses his previous Turkish status, that does not mean he loses it automaticaly in regard to Turkish law.
PS: shouldn't that be the Turkish consulate handling those matters (Turkish citizens) and not the embassy (state relations/diplomacy between Austria and Turkey)?
Embassy and consulate services are often rolled into one in here in the capital.
From the news story I understand that the consulate branch of the embassy would provide proof of the new Austrian citizen renouncing their Turkish citizenship, but still give them citizenship/passport afterwards.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 07:10:58 AM
Embassy and consulate services are often rolled into one in here in the capital.
With many Turks in Vienna, I thought they would separate premises for practical, efficiency reasons. Happens often in Paris. Turkish consulate there is in a close suburb, unlike the embassy for instance (usually both are in central Paris though, not far away).
Quote
From the news story I understand that the consulate branch of the embassy would provide proof of the new Austrian citizen renouncing their Turkish citizenship, but still give them citizenship/passport afterwards.
Seems a bit unorthodox, but I don't know enough about Turkish law to comment.
I don't think Polish law prohibits dual citizenship - but this may be limited to the Polish diaspora (which, incidentally, is bullshit, as these people frequently live abroad, but get to vote in our elections and often vote for the most outlandish parties because they have no idea what really is going on in the country).
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on November 28, 2014, 07:25:06 AM
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 07:10:58 AM
Embassy and consulate services are often rolled into one in here in the capital.
With many Turks in Vienna, I thought they would separate premises for practical, efficiency reasons. Happens often in Paris. Turkish consulate there is in a close suburb, unlike the embassy for instance (usually both are in central Paris though, not far away).
Well, in the case of Germany, when I got a new passport in 2007, the passport service was at the embassy proper. Last year they had moved that office to a few blocks away.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:30:44 AM
Considering the significant amount of people living in Vienna with Turkish roots, and a significant amount of them being Erdogan fanbois (last year we had thousands protesting in his favor during the Gezi protest thing, and more attending his election campaign rally here earlier this year) I find it useful to know what's going on in Turkish politics.
It'd be interesting to see the demographics of London and Vienna's Turkish communities (is ours a lot more Kurdish? yours a lot more Anatolian?) because here there were only very big pro-Gezi protests in Trafalgar Square that I know of.
QuoteI don't think Polish law prohibits dual citizenship - but this may be limited to the Polish diaspora (which, incidentally, is bullshit, as these people frequently live abroad, but get to vote in our elections and often vote for the most outlandish parties because they have no idea what really is going on in the country).
UK's fine with dual nationality too.
He's right on all three counts. I do.
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 28, 2014, 10:27:18 AM
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 04:30:44 AM
Considering the significant amount of people living in Vienna with Turkish roots, and a significant amount of them being Erdogan fanbois (last year we had thousands protesting in his favor during the Gezi protest thing, and more attending his election campaign rally here earlier this year) I find it useful to know what's going on in Turkish politics.
It'd be interesting to see the demographics of London and Vienna's Turkish communities (is ours a lot more Kurdish? yours a lot more Anatolian?) because here there were only very big pro-Gezi protests in Trafalgar Square that I know of.
A large part of the Turkish community here are from conservative rural areas, as those are traditionally the areas where guest workers were from. Their families later joined them. Integration has been bumpy, though it's become better with second and third generation immigrants IMO.
Quote from: Syt on November 28, 2014, 10:40:19 AM
A large part of the Turkish community here are from conservative rural areas, as those are traditionally the areas where guest workers were from. Their families later joined them. Integration has been bumpy, though it's become better with second and third generation immigrants IMO.
Interesting. Looking it up (and I should have known because this reflects my experience in London) about 50-60% of the British Turk community's originally Turkish Cypriot. The rest are from the mainland and were often brought over by the Turkish Cypriots to work in their businesses. Recently apparently there's a mini-trend of German and Dutch Turks moving to the UK.
Kurds started arriving later.
Really Shielbh? You go on about how Erdogan is not totally loony and then he says nonsense like this and you go on with random discussions about Turks in London?
You going to address how this insanity fits into your theories yet?
Quote from: Valmy on November 28, 2014, 04:47:24 PMReally Shielbh? You go on about how Erdogan is not totally loony and then he says nonsense like this and you go on with random discussions about Turks in London?
You going to address how this insanity fits into your theories yet?
My theory is and has been for a while that he's becoming like Putin. I don't see how anything he's said wouldn't fit with that. Historical revisionism and a persecution complex aren't exactly unknown in the Kremlin. Remember the person I'm comparing him to goes diving on holiday and returns with ancient Greek amphorae.
If my theory were Putin is slowly morphing into, say, Adenauer then I accept there'd be an issue.
But I don't think he's Turkmenbashi or one of the Kims, I don't think he's Khomeini and I don't think he's worse than a military coup that would lead to an even stronger Islamist backlash further down the line.
Ultimately I think either the Turkish opposition need to get their act together which is unlikely, or he'll end up being brought down when the economy goes down which it will given his policies.
I find the fact there are pro-AKP demonstrations in Vienna really striking because during Gezi I went through at least two absolutely massive pro-Gezi demonstrations in Trafalgar Square.
I've looked up last years protest: Der Standard has logged the number of participants at "ca. 8000" in June 2013. http://dastandard.at/1371170405902/Pro-Erdogan-Demo-Wien-ist-mit-dir
(Looking at the article pictures, I think I posted about it back then.)
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 28, 2014, 05:11:23 PM
My theory is and has been for a while that he's becoming like Putin. I don't see how anything he's said wouldn't fit with that. Historical revisionism and a persecution complex aren't exactly unknown in the Kremlin. Remember the person I'm comparing him to goes diving on holiday and returns with ancient Greek amphorae.
If my theory were Putin is slowly morphing into, say, Adenauer then I accept there'd be an issue.
But I don't think he's Turkmenbashi or one of the Kims, I don't think he's Khomeini and I don't think he's worse than a military coup that would lead to an even stronger Islamist backlash further down the line.
Ultimately I think either the Turkish opposition need to get their act together which is unlikely, or he'll end up being brought down when the economy goes down which it will given his policies.
I find the fact there are pro-AKP demonstrations in Vienna really striking because during Gezi I went through at least two absolutely massive pro-Gezi demonstrations in Trafalgar Square.
Or the best of all worlds: he can completely screws the pooch and Islamists acquire another object lesson in dumbass ideas.
If we wanted the muslims' money we probably wouldn't be giving them social assistance when the come to our countries.
Sheilbh is right, objectively speaking, but ignores that Turkey is a NATO member.
If Erdogan is "only like Putin" then it means he can invade a neighbouring state - which would be a much bigger problem for the West than whatever Putin does in Ukraine.
Quote from: Martinus on November 29, 2014, 09:39:19 AM
Sheilbh is right, objectively speaking, but ignores that Turkey is a NATO member.
If Erdogan is "only like Putin" then it means he can invade a neighbouring state - which would be a much bigger problem for the West than whatever Putin does in Ukraine.
Yes, because those alleged turks in Cyprus are local self defense forces who are just there to make sure there is a referendum. Any resemblence to Turkish Military units is incidental, anybody can get M-60 tanks, M-16s and 155mm guns at Cypriot Walmart.
Quote from: Martinus on November 29, 2014, 09:39:19 AM
If Erdogan is "only like Putin" then it means he can invade a neighbouring state - which would be a much bigger problem for the West than whatever Putin does in Ukraine.
I thought we *wanted* him to invade Syria. :hmm:
Quote from: Martinus on November 29, 2014, 09:39:19 AM
If Erdogan is "only like Putin" then it means he can invade a neighbouring state - which would be a much bigger problem for the West than whatever Putin does in Ukraine.
Depends who he invades to be honest. As Viking points out the Turks took over North Cyprus while they were in NATO, Turkey and Greece have had little conflicts while both have been in NATO. It isn't necessarily a problem unless the retaliation led to an attack on Turkey which would make things far more difficult.
Turkey's foreign policy in the Middle East is disruptive and not terribly helpful. But it's nowhere near as problematic as Putin's.
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 29, 2014, 11:16:30 AM
Quote from: Martinus on November 29, 2014, 09:39:19 AM
If Erdogan is "only like Putin" then it means he can invade a neighbouring state - which would be a much bigger problem for the West than whatever Putin does in Ukraine.
Depends who he invades to be honest. As Viking points out the Turks took over North Cyprus while they were in NATO, Turkey and Greece have had little conflicts while both have been in NATO. It isn't necessarily a problem unless the retaliation led to an attack on Turkey which would make things far more difficult.
Turkey's foreign policy in the Middle East is disruptive and not terribly helpful. But it's nowhere near as problematic as Putin's.
That said, he's ticking all the other boxes. He's adding conspiracy to paranoia to radical ideology to inventing his own facts and reality to identifying the jews as the enemy to a preference for the gigantic.
Fernandez-Kirchner, Putin, Erdogan and Chavez all share the traits of re-writing the constitution to stay in and expand their power, short term economic policies and instrumentalizing "the americans/the jews/the west" as the enemy. This never does turn out well. Crimea is merely an aberration by Putin, however that doesn't mean these proto-caudillo wannabes aren't like him.
Yeah. I've said before I think Putinisms danger is that it's an alternative to the Western model in a way that other models (China, Iran, North Korea) aren't in most cases.
And it's not one that I think is limited to the developing world. I'm alarmed by the polls in France and Ireland, by the rule of Orban, and by Podemos' links to the Venezuelan government. I find the stuff some of my Spanish friends come out with about the establishment alarming.
I think Nick Cohen's right, because it's not selling a positive alternative like Communism did, it actually preys on cynicism posing as worldliness and instilling a belief that politicians are all as bad as each other, and who are we to judge. It's trying to sap out the positive belief in a democratic system which can then be replaced with a post-modern democracy run by a genuinely corrupt elite.
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/10-issues-turkish-media-is-banned-from-reporting-on.aspx?pageID=238&nID=74904&NewsCatID=339
Quote10 issues Turkish media is banned from reporting on
Turkey's media organizations have been banned from reporting on a parliamentary inquiry into corruption allegations concerning four former ministers of Cabinet. Although the ban is unprecedented for a parliamentary inquiry, over 150 gag orders have been issued regarding the investigations of prosecutors in the last four years, according to Hürriyet reporter Zeynep Gürcanlı. Here are 10 of them:
1) Turkey's massive graft investigation
The corruption probe of Dec. 17, 2013 is the most controversial case for which a media ban has been adopted. The prosecutor of the case was quickly replaced by the authorities and in October, the new prosecutor decided not to continue with proceedings against 53 graft suspects, including former ministers' sons, the former manager of Halkbank and a controversial Iranian-Azeri businessman.
2) The ISIL raid on Turkey's Mosul consulate
Some 49 members of Turkey's consulate in Mosul and 31 truck drivers were kidnapped by the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) after the latter seized Mosul late on June 9. The 9th Ankara Court of Serious Crimes imposed a media ban on reporting about the kidnapping in a June 16 ruling.
3) The tapping of the Turkish Foreign Ministry
The audio recordings of a top-secret national security meeting on Syria in the offices of the Turkish foreign minister were leaked via YouTube on March 27. After this, the Supreme Council of Radio and Television (RTÜK) quickly imposed a media ban on the broadcast of the illegal recording and its content.
4) The deadliest terror attack in Turkey's history
Soon after the deadliest terror attack in Turkey's history, which killed 52 people in the southern town of Reyhanlı on May 11, 2013, a local court banned all aural, visual and written publications about the aftermath of the blasts.
5) The bugging of Erdoğan's office
The Ankara Prosecutor's Office imposed a media ban in February on the ongoing investigation into bugging devices allegedly found in the office of then-Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan.
6) The stopping of Syria-bound MİT trucks
In February, a ban was imposed on the publication of reports about a search of two trucks – allegedly carrying weapons belonging to Turkey's National Intelligence Organization (MİT) – that were bound for Syria.
7) Deadly attacks on security forces
In October, three Turkish soldiers and two policemen were killed in separate attacks. The Yüksekova Criminal Court of Peace ruled for a media ban on the killing of the soldiers on Oct. 27, days after a similar ruling by the Bingöl Criminal Court of Peace on the murders of the policemen.
8) The Uludere air strike
Air strikes carried out in the Uludere district of Şırnak province on Dec. 28, 2011 resulted in the deaths of 34 civilian villagers, who were allegedly mistaken for outlawed Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) militants as they smuggled goods into Turkey. Soon afterward, a media ban was imposed.
9) The worst mining disaster
RTÜK, Turkey's television and radio watchdog, warned broadcasters "to respect the feelings of the victims' families" after the worst workplace disaster of the country, in which 301 workers were killed in a mine accident in the western town of Soma in May.
10) The football match-fixing scandal
The 13th Istanbul Court of Serious Crimes ruled for a media ban in August 2011 on the publication of testimonies and audio evidence in a massive match-fixing investigation involving two professional Turkish football clubs.
If America hadn't been told about 9/11 then it would automatically Never Forget.
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 29, 2014, 02:21:08 PM
I find the stuff some of my Spanish friends come out with about the establishment alarming.
The Spanish establishment deserves all the shit it gets right now, to be honest.
It's a tough time for the establishment, in any country. The times are changing, and when your cozy relationship with business and labour resulted in plentiful work for all, it wasn't really all that egregious that you were skimming all kinds of cash and influence for yourself out of the system. But now that the environment has changed and new modes of business are producing unemployment (and thus poverty), the way that politics operate is starting to rub people the wrong way.
I heard the communists are gaining ground in Spain.
That can't be good.
They are very good at making everybody equally poor.
Quote from: Siege on December 07, 2014, 05:19:43 PM
I heard the communists are gaining ground in Spain.
That can't be good.
They are very good at making everybody equally poor.
Nonsense. The Nomenclatura get pretty rich.
Quote from: Siege on December 07, 2014, 05:19:43 PM
I heard the communists are gaining ground in Spain.
That can't be good.
They are very good at making everybody equally poor.
Even if that were true, it's not really any different to what we're seeing now, except it's the capitalists making the 99% equally poor.
Quote from: celedhring on December 07, 2014, 10:20:28 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 29, 2014, 02:21:08 PM
I find the stuff some of my Spanish friends come out with about the establishment alarming.
The Spanish establishment deserves all the shit it gets right now, to be honest.
It wasn't just the Spanish establishment though. For example a few of them think the Scottish vote was rigged which isn't something even the most lunatic wing of the nationalist movement think.
Quote from: Sheilbh on December 08, 2014, 01:34:00 PM
Quote from: celedhring on December 07, 2014, 10:20:28 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on November 29, 2014, 02:21:08 PM
I find the stuff some of my Spanish friends come out with about the establishment alarming.
The Spanish establishment deserves all the shit it gets right now, to be honest.
It wasn't just the Spanish establishment though. For example a few of them think the Scottish vote was rigged which isn't something even the most lunatic wing of the nationalist movement think.
Where are they from? Our nationalists are pretty lunatic.
Quote from: celedhring on December 08, 2014, 01:35:11 PM
Where are they from? Our nationalists are pretty lunatic.
That's what's weird. None are nationalists. They're from places like Cadiz or the Castilian bit of Navarre :mellow:
Quote from: Sheilbh on December 08, 2014, 01:38:31 PM
Quote from: celedhring on December 08, 2014, 01:35:11 PM
Where are they from? Our nationalists are pretty lunatic.
That's what's weird. None are nationalists. They're from places like Cadiz or the Castilian bit of Navarre :mellow:
Well, I've met Spaniards that would blame England for the existence of black holes if they could. Or even if they couldn't.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30468199
QuoteTurkey police raid opposition media with Gulen links
Turkish police have made at least 23 arrests during raids on a newspaper and TV station with close ties to US-based Islamic cleric Fethullah Gulen.
Those detained are accused of forming an illegal organisation and trying to seize control of the state.
Mr Gulen, the spiritual leader of the Hizmet movement, is a rival of Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan.
The raids come days after Mr Erdogan pledged a fresh campaign against Mr Gulen's supporters.
Among those arrested are journalists, producers, scriptwriters and a police chief in eastern Turkey.
Police attempted to raid the offices of the Zaman newspaper, one of Turkey's biggest, early on Sunday morning, but a crowd of protesters forced police to turn back before they could make arrests.
Staff at the paper also reported on the incident as it happened.
The paper's editor-in-chief, Ekrem Dumanli, tweeted a picture of himself at his desk, saying: "Officers [forced] back because of democratic reaction of my friends. I am at my place and wait."
But they returned and arrested him in a second raid in the afternoon.
Staff and supporters of the paper held placards and chanted "free press cannot be silenced" as police raided the building.
Mr Dumanli smiled and studied police documents before being led through the newspaper's headquarters to applause from staff crowded onto balconies.
"Let those who have committed a crime be scared," Mr Dumanli said as he was led away, according to Reuters.
"We are not scared."
'Disgrace'
The chairman of Samanyolu TV, which also has links to Mr Gulen, was detained in a separate raid in Istanbul.
Hidayet Karaca told reporters the operation was "a disgrace for Turkey" before his arrest.
"Sadly in 21st Century Turkey this is the treatment they dish out to a media group with tens of television and radio stations, internet media and magazines," the English edition of Zaman quoted him as saying.
Kemal Kilicdaroglu, the leader of Turkey's main opposition party, called the raids "a coup".
Staff at Zaman had been expecting the raid after details of the swoop were leaked by a Twitter user known as Fuat Avni, who has previously leaked advance details of police operations.
The police operation comes a year after corruption allegations against allies of Mr Erdogan emerged. He said it was a plot orchestrated by Mr Gulen supporters to topple him.
Mr Gulen denied this. He has lived in self-imposed exile in the US since 1999.
On Friday Mr Edogan vowed to pursue Gulen supporters "in their lairs".
Analysis by Mark Lowen, BBC News, Istanbul
The timing of these arrests isn't coincidental. It's almost a year to the day since the biggest corruption scandal in Turkey's modern history exploded. Recep Tayyip Erdogan, then prime minister, now president, was targeted, along with his inner circle. Four ministers were forced to resign. It was widely believed the government wouldn't survive.
Extraordinarily, Mr Erdogan managed to turn it around, declaring war on what he called a "parallel state": followers of his one-time ally Fetullah Gulen who he said were plotting a coup. He fired thousands of police officers and prosecutors, launching an endless tirade in the media that he's ensured is widely pro-government, and sidelined dissidents. This is stage two: arresting the critics.
Turkey already ranks 154th of 180 in the press freedom index compiled by Reporters without Borders. Human rights organisations raise concerns that freedom of expression is under attack in a country seeking EU membership.
But the Turkish government says it's a conspiracy against a country that won't tow the West's line. It talks of the "enemy within" which must be eradicated. Today's move will fuel international concerns of an eroding democracy here.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30484729
QuoteTurkey media arrests: Erdogan rejects EU criticism
Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has lashed out at the European Union after it criticised the mass arrest of opposition journalists at the weekend.
"The EU should mind its own business and keep its own opinions to itself," Mr Erdogan said, denying that the raids had infringed press freedom.
EU leaders have said the arrests were incompatible with "European values".
At least 24 journalists said to have close links with a US-based cleric are being held for plotting to seize power.
Sunday's raids targeted the Zaman newspaper and Samanyolu TV channel, which are described as close to Islamic cleric Fethullah Gulen, the spiritual leader of the Hizmet movement.
A former ally of Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, Mr Gulen - who lives in self-imposed exile - is accused of running a "parallel state" within Turkey.
'Dirty operations'
In a statement, EU foreign affairs chief Federica Mogherini and Enlargement Commissioner Johannes Hahn said any move towards membership depended on "full respect for the rule of law and fundamental rights".
The raids and arrests "are incompatible with the freedom of media, which is a core principle of democracy", the pair said in a statement.
But on Monday Mr Erdogan responded: "What do you [Europe] know about these operations to feel yourself competent to make such comments?"
"We have no concern about what the EU might say, whether the EU accepts us as members or not."
He added that the raids had been a necessary response to "dirty operations" by subvert the Turkish state.
Etyen Mahcupyan, chief advisier to Turkish Prime Minister Ahmed Davutoglu, told the BBC: "We have evidence that there was wrongdoing by some people in the Gulen movement. And we have evidence that these journalists are in the Gulen movement."
The raids come days after Mr Erdogan pledged a fresh campaign against Mr Gulen's supporters.
Over the past year Mr Erdogan - whose Islamist-rooted AK Party has won three general elections since 2002 - has accused so-called "Gulenists" in police and the judiciary of using corruption inquiries to try to topple him.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/04/AR2005100401745.html
Quote"E.U. membership is the means of realizing Turkey's claim of being a democratic, liberal, just and prosperous society," Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Tuesday told his ruling Justice and Development Party, which calls itself reformist
October 2005.
Quote from: Syt on December 15, 2014, 05:15:43 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/04/AR2005100401745.html
Quote"E.U. membership is the means of realizing Turkey's claim of being a democratic, liberal, just and prosperous society," Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Tuesday told his ruling Justice and Development Party, which calls itself reformist
October 2005.
I agree, turkey isn't democratic, liberal, just or prosperous.
It appears the arrested media people are going to be charged with "membership in a terrorist group." There's some news stories that a Turkish court has issued an arrest warrant for Abdullah Gulen.
Meanwhile, German police has arrested three Turks. They're charged with espionage against Turks living in Germany.
Well, this is an improvement for Erdogan, if he does spying Castro's way, as would say Comte Largent :)