Margaret Thatcher was no poster girl for gay rights

[Ed Anger]

Week?

[katmai]

Century

[viper37]

OK then what's the underlying cause common to most teen suicide?

I don't know, but given that many non gay teens commit suicide, it would seem homosexuality is not the cause, no?
A majority of teens committing suicide are depressed.  Like all mental disease, it's only been recently really researched.

Maybe there's an hormonal change that increases the risks, I remember reading something along that some time ago.  With hormonal imbalance may create depression in subjects.

Aside that, medicine and psychology aren't my field of expertise.  I just think focusing only on the gay issues would let us miss other issues.

Except that it could very well be for a given teen that his sexuality was the reason he committed suicide.

It's odd as you had a whole post about different types of people commuting suicide because of a perceived in adequacy, then said that focusing on any of the many reasons would be ignoring an underlying common cause. Now you're saying that you've no idea what that is.

Can you affirm with reasonable certainty that 95% of teenage suicides are caused by sexual orientation?
If no, why focus 95% of resources on teenage sexual orientation?
Why should gays get preferred treatments to other teenages?
Wouldn't it be counter-productive to adress the suicide problem as being mainly dependant on sexual orientation for teenagers who are not lgbt?
And assuming that most suicides affect the lgbt teenage community, can we affirm with 95% certainty that their sexual orientation was the cause and not another problem?
What if the insecurities of being a teenager had nothing to do with presumed sexual orientation but another cause that we ignore so far because we are determined to focus on sexual orientation?

I do not have all the answers.  But I know for sure sexual orientation is not the main cause of teenage suicide.

[derspiess]

That's what you took away from this article?

Um it is right there in paragraph 1.  Besides what the article is condemning her of doing is essentially supporting US policy.  We were, above all, the ones who decided to support very sketchy regimes in the service of stopping Communism during the Cold War.  This is hardly new information.

And if this is all being viewed thru an LGBTLOLWTF prism, it's worth adding that the USSR & the East Bloc were not typically very tolerant of homosexuality.

[garbon]

Can you affirm with reasonable certainty that 95% of teenage suicides are caused by sexual orientation?
If no, why focus 95% of resources on teenage sexual orientation?
Why should gays get preferred treatments to other teenages?
Wouldn't it be counter-productive to adress the suicide problem as being mainly dependant on sexual orientation for teenagers who are not lgbt?
And assuming that most suicides affect the lgbt teenage community, can we affirm with 95% certainty that their sexual orientation was the cause and not another problem?
What if the insecurities of being a teenager had nothing to do with presumed sexual orientation but another cause that we ignore so far because we are determined to focus on sexual orientation?

If anyone was advocating the things you are suggesting, then you might have a point.

[Malthus]

That's what you took away from this article?

Um it is right there in paragraph 1.  Besides what the article is condemning her of doing is essentially supporting US policy.  We were, above all, the ones who decided to support very sketchy regimes in the service of stopping Communism during the Cold War.  This is hardly new information.

And if this is all being viewed thru an LGBTLOLWTF prism, it's worth adding that the USSR & the East Bloc were not typically very tolerant of homosexuality.

Heh, reminds one of "Queers for Palestine". 

[viper37]

Don't you agree though that when school workers are specifically prohibited by law from addressing one of the common reasons for teen suicide, this may increase the number of teens committing suicide for that reason?

because we all know that a first thing a teenager does, when he has problem, is consult the school psychologist who has a 3 months waiting list.

[Martinus]

That's what you took away from this article?

Um it is right there in paragraph 1.  Besides what the article is condemning her of doing is essentially supporting US policy.  We were, above all, the ones who decided to support very sketchy regimes in the service of stopping Communism during the Cold War.  This is hardly new information.

And if this is all being viewed thru an LGBTLOLWTF prism, it's worth adding that the USSR & the East Bloc were not typically very tolerant of homosexuality.

Heh, reminds one of "Queers for Palestine". 

Perhaps, if I ever claimed that I'm in any way a fan of the USSR, the East Bloc or Poland, that would be a valid criticism.

[The Brain]

Peter Tatchell weighs in:

Having a vaguely similar name doesn't make you an expert.

[crazy canuck]

Peter Tatchell weighs in:

Having a vaguely similar name doesn't make you an expert.

[viper37]

If anyone was advocating the things you are suggesting, then you might have a point.

Aren't they?  The articles posted by Marty stop short of blaming Thatcher for teenage suicides.

[garbon]

If anyone was advocating the things you are suggesting, then you might have a point.

Aren't they?  The articles posted by Marty stop short of blaming Thatcher for teenage suicides.

Be serious. Which of your listed questions correspond with things that the posted articles suggest.

Can you affirm with reasonable certainty that 95% of teenage suicides are caused by sexual orientation?
If no, why focus 95% of resources on teenage sexual orientation?
Why should gays get preferred treatments to other teenages?
Wouldn't it be counter-productive to adress the suicide problem as being mainly dependant on sexual orientation for teenagers who are not lgbt?
And assuming that most suicides affect the lgbt teenage community, can we affirm with 95% certainty that their sexual orientation was the cause and not another problem?
What if the insecurities of being a teenager had nothing to do with presumed sexual orientation but another cause that we ignore so far because we are determined to focus on sexual orientation?

[viper37]

One the writers complain that the UK did not invest to support the LGBT teenage community at a time where there was an AIDS panic and that caused suicide on a vulnerable community.

That's a big shortcut:

Despite the fact that no one was ever prosecuted under it, the law made teachers feel they could not tell kids that if they were gay, it was OK. It effectively scared them from talking about being gay even when children were being physically attacked.
[...]
Maybe Thatcher didn't hate gay people that she knew. This makes it more despicable that she was willing to throw us – including kids like me, desperate for help in 1988 when section 28 came in – to the wolves for the sake of a few poll points. What she did do was inflict huge damage on a community that desperately needed support, and smashed down any possibility of supporting confused children or educating them about how to not catch HIV.

I still fail to see how Thatcher's policies would have been worst than the rest of the world, or how cuddling gays would suddenly solve the problematic of teenage suicide specifically for gay teens.  AFAIK, even in the US, there's a lot more tolerance to gays than there used to be in the 80s, gay actors&actresses come out, there are gay characters in most tv shows and yet... Gay teenagers are still more likely to kill themselves, apparently.

Maybe, just maybe, going at it on the grounds of sexual orientation is not the way to go, for heteros as well as gays?  Teenage suicide wasn't that much heard of in the 40s&50s.  Were gays more socially accepted at the time?

[Eddie Teach]

Oh, I think it was that suicide was less socially acceptable in the West at the time. Also, people had less free time to wallow.

[crazy canuck]

Oh, I think it was that suicide was less socially acceptable in the West at the time. Also, people had less free time to wallow.

We just had another tragic case of a teen committing suicide because of social media.  I think people had just as much time to wallow back then.  Its just that their time of wallowing now can entail extreme scrutiny by their peers.  Before stupid stuff we did was forgotten within days/hours.  Now it lives on within the internet forever.