NCAA football, 2013-14

[Berkut]

Imagine a fanbase made up entirely of Bill in Sinton type people.

E: Focused.

It would be a fan base very similar to one made up entirely of D4H type people.

Yes, the SEC is the best, and it is the best because, well, because WE, the fans, are the best.

That's right.

[Berkut]

So Dorsey, since you seem to put a reasonable amount of stock in Mr. Sagarin and his ratings, did you notice that he has the Pac-12 overall rated higher than the SEC this year?

CONFERENCE          CENTRAL MEAN    SIMPLE AVERAGE  TEAMS      WIN50%

   1  SEC-WEST            (A) =  83.73      83.17  (  1)      7      83.74  (  1)
   2  PAC-12(NORTH)       (A) =  82.67      81.33  (  2)      6      82.80  (  2)
   3  PAC-12(SOUTH)       (A) =  82.28      81.28  (  3)      6      82.05  (  3)
   4  SEC-EAST            (A) =  78.14      77.89  (  4)      7      78.12  (  4)
   5  BIG 12              (A) =  78.13      77.34  (  6)     10      78.01  (  5)
   6  BIG TEN-LEGENDS     (A) =  76.67      77.36  (  5)      6      76.78  (  6)
   7  ACC-COASTAL         (A) =  74.22      73.15  (  8)      7      73.69  (  7)
   8  BIG TEN-LEADERS     (A) =  73.25      72.64  (  9)      6      73.21  (  8)
   9  ACC-ATLANTIC        (A) =  72.57      74.56  (  7)      7      71.95  (  9)
  10  AMERICAN ATHLETIC   (A) =  65.15      66.51  ( 10)     10      65.37  ( 10)

[Eddie Teach]

Berkut, you may have forgotten this, but Dorsey is an ACC fan.

[Berkut]

Berkut, you may have forgotten this, but Dorsey is an ACC fan.

Don't let the facts get in my way.

Besides, southerners are all the same anyway. At least when it comes to football.

[sbr]

It doesn't hurt that the best SEC teams rarely play the best teams from the other SEC division.  4 OOC cupcakes, 6 games against division opponents and 2 games against the worst 2 teams in the other division makes for a nice schedule.

[Rasputin]

Of course. The SEC is better just because they are better and have better fans. Uh huh.

I am sure nearly every SEC fan believes that, and just about nobody else.

If your claim was true, then NCAA football would not be the national draw that it is - it would just be a regional sport. And if that were true, the SEC would have dominated college football for the last 100 years instead of just the last 20 or so.


And yeah, I am also sure that non-SEC schools would love to play the absolute patsy bullshit OOC schedules that the SEC does, but again, they just don't have the fan dedication to allow that to happen.

Berk I am an acc fan. I hate the sec arrogance and have to suffer through it more than most. I was glAd FSU drew the sec champ instead of Ohio state because a victory over anyone other than the sec champ would not shut them up.

You can chose to ignore the reality that I have set forth (there is no mid America school that puts 80k per game into a stadium the way that South Carolina did even before spurrier) but dismissing what I said because you claim I'm an sec homer is a flawed premise.

[Eddie Teach]

It doesn't hurt that the best SEC teams rarely play the best teams from the other SEC division.  4 OOC cupcakes, 6 games against division opponents and 2 games against the worst 2 teams in the other division makes for a nice schedule.

Georgia plays Auburn every year. I realize 8 wins isn't that great, but hardly bottom 2 SEC East. 

Also, they play Georgia Tech every year, but I know you're not talking about Georgia's schedule. 

[Berkut]

I am dismissing what you say because it is patently and obviously not true.

There are plenty of schools that draw fans to every game at some point or another, and yet still schedule tough.

The idea that the SEC is replacing a conference game with a patsy because their oh so awesome fans don't mind, is just ridiculous.

What is interesting is that this is changing - the SEC is apparently directing their schools that they should be shooting for 10 quality games per year. Of course, that assumes that all eight conference games are "quallity", and then a bowl game and they are raising the bar from 0 non-patsies per team to 1 non-patsy per team. Heady stuff!

[alfred russel]

Right, so you admit that they don't play 9 conference games, like the serious BCS conferences. Good.

Of course, it isn't just about not playing 9 games - it is about who they replace that conference game they are dodging with - are they taking that 4th non-con game and finding a good match up?

Err....no. So yeah, it is most definitely an extra win each year. Replacing a BCS quality opponent with some patsy is a HUGE difference. Plus it allows for even more careful scheduling to make sure the SEC's designated "BCS title game" contender can dodge the other top SEC teams.

However, the Big 12 doesn't have a championship game, so a Big 12 team plays the same number of conference games as an SEC division champ (which is what we are generally talking about among conference title contenders).

We are not talking about conference title contenders, so no, you don't get a pass there.

Also, most major SEC teams scheduled a major out of conference opponent. Auburn, Texas A&M, and Missouri are exceptions.

Some of them do, plenty of them do not, and since they get an extra game every year, you would think they would schedule more than one...but no.

Here are the conference champs strength of schedule from Sagarin:

Why would we only look at the conference champions?

So if you want to brag about the Pac 12, go ahead. But the SEC is not the outlier. I'd also point out that there are reasons the Pac 12 is the only conference with a 9 game schedule and a championship, and they aren't all love of competition. A lot relate to money and TV. Pac 12 fans seem to love Larry Scott for the money and exposure he brings to the Pac 12, but he is getting that by crashing his teams together in a way no other conference does.

That is because almost every other conference has followed in the footsteps of the SEC to schedule more and more and MORE patsy schedules to guarantee they jam as many teams into bowl and NC games as possible. Which proves my point about how the SEC, while they've won the meta game of college football, is harming the sport in the process.

I'm focusing on division champs because I can only think of one exception a non division champ (from a conference with divisions) got into the championship game. If you want to argue that it isn't fair that the SEC can sometimes get its fourth place team into the Cotton Bowl while the fourth place Pac 12 team goes to the Sun Bowl, the floor is all yours. (although bowl games matchups, outside of the championship game, really about ticket sales and ratings, not fairness)

Auburn played as many conference games as any team in college football not named Arizona State or Stanford. While Auburn played a crap OOC schedule, Alabama, LSU, Florida, UGA, Tennessee, and South Carolina do not. Besides, if they take the 4th OOC game and schedule a complete joke of a team, why should they be penalized for that over a Big 12 school, that actually plays one less game? (and no, I don't think you should get credit for beating a Sun Belt or FCS school).

It is crazy to think that the SEC invented scheduling management. It has been around for a long long time. Bobby Bowden cited it as a reason to join the ACC, and he just said what every team considers.

[alfred russel]

Imagine a fanbase made up entirely of Bill in Sinton type people.

E: Focused.

It would be a fan base very similar to one made up entirely of D4H type people.

Yes, the SEC is the best, and it is the best because, well, because WE, the fans, are the best.

That's right.

Christ. What is the point of replying to Berkut when he never reads what you write?

I've not said that the SEC is the best because the fans are the best. The major factor is being located where the best recruits are. Everything is secondary after that.

As I distinctly remember saying a few hours ago, Miami has won more national titles (5) since 1980 than any other program, under 4 coaches and in 3 decades. All with the smallest and most fickle fanbase of any major program. Why? Because it is located in probably the best recruiting location in the country.

[alfred russel]

So Dorsey, since you seem to put a reasonable amount of stock in Mr. Sagarin and his ratings, did you notice that he has the Pac-12 overall rated higher than the SEC this year?

CONFERENCE          CENTRAL MEAN    SIMPLE AVERAGE  TEAMS      WIN50%

   1  SEC-WEST            (A) =  83.73      83.17  (  1)      7      83.74  (  1)
   2  PAC-12(NORTH)       (A) =  82.67      81.33  (  2)      6      82.80  (  2)
   3  PAC-12(SOUTH)       (A) =  82.28      81.28  (  3)      6      82.05  (  3)
   4  SEC-EAST            (A) =  78.14      77.89  (  4)      7      78.12  (  4)
   5  BIG 12              (A) =  78.13      77.34  (  6)     10      78.01  (  5)
   6  BIG TEN-LEGENDS     (A) =  76.67      77.36  (  5)      6      76.78  (  6)
   7  ACC-COASTAL         (A) =  74.22      73.15  (  8)      7      73.69  (  7)
   8  BIG TEN-LEADERS     (A) =  73.25      72.64  (  9)      6      73.21  (  8)
   9  ACC-ATLANTIC        (A) =  72.57      74.56  (  7)      7      71.95  (  9)
  10  AMERICAN ATHLETIC   (A) =  65.15      66.51  ( 10)     10      65.37  ( 10)

I actually think that the Sagarin ratings are complete shit, especially after he changed the formula this year. But I've seen you refer to them, and there aren't many great sources for strength of schedule ratings.

But if you want to argue the Pac 12 has the best middle and lower tier teams in the country, I will probably agree with you. Depending on the definition of "best conference", that could make the Pac 12 the best.

[alfred russel]

It doesn't hurt that the best SEC teams rarely play the best teams from the other SEC division.  4 OOC cupcakes, 6 games against division opponents and 2 games against the worst 2 teams in the other division makes for a nice schedule.

???

They play 1 rival and 1 rotating opponent.

The rivals of the good teams:

LSU - Florida
Alabama - Tennessee
Auburn - Georgia

Granted, Tennessee sucks right now (and UF just had a down year), but they seem to be matching up the best programs as rivals.

[katmai]

I blame the SEC scheduling for Huskies adopting that A,B,C scheduling.

Saturday Aug. 30    at Hawaii Rainbow Warriors
Aloha Stadium, Honolulu, HI    

Saturday Sept. 6       Eastern Washington Eagles
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA    

Saturday  Sept. 13 Illinois Fighting Illini
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA    

Saturday Sept. 20       Georgia State Panthers
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA

[alfred russel]

I blame the SEC scheduling for Huskies adopting that A,B,C scheduling.

Saturday Aug. 30    at Hawaii Rainbow Warriors
Aloha Stadium, Honolulu, HI    

Saturday Sept. 6       Eastern Washington Eagles
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA    

Saturday  Sept. 13 Illinois Fighting Illini
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA    

Saturday Sept. 20       Georgia State Panthers
Husky Stadium, Seattle, WA

That is "everybody sucks" scheduling.

[katmai]

Yes and I blame the SEC for it.