Pope Benedict XVI 'is to resign'

[Zanza]

Exactly. One of the things that got to me when I first ventured on the Interwebs was how Americans would constantly define people by their religious denomination. It was so very alien.

In what sense?  Unless somebody is super religious, like old school Fahdiz, I do not really think we do this.

I got the impression from following American media that religious affiliation is mentioned considerably more often for politicians than here and seems to play a much bigger role in defining political positions too. Our previous federal chancellor left out the "So help me god" when he was sworn in for office. No one cared, whereas I would expect a major debate about it in America if Obama had done that at his recent inauguration.

[derspiess]

Yes you do (maybe not you personally). Quite a few times I see people described as Catholics, Mormons, Jews, Baptists and so on. You probably don't notice. I know don't anymore. But back then it was something that sounded strange.

Now I can sort of see that.  But keep in mind you guys are a lot more religiously homogeneous than we are.  Here in the US, different religions or denominations can be of cultural significance.

[Valmy]

Exactly. One of the things that got to me when I first ventured on the Interwebs was how Americans would constantly define people by their religious denomination. It was so very alien.

In what sense?  Unless somebody is super religious, like old school Fahdiz, I do not really think we do this.

I got the impression from following American media that religious affiliation is mentioned considerably more often for politicians than here and seems to play a much bigger role in defining political positions too. Our previous federal chancellor left out the "So help me god" when he was sworn in for office. No one cared, whereas I would expect a major debate about it in America if Obama had done that at his recent inauguration.

That would not be a major debate there would be outrage

But that is different from me going around defining people by their religious denomination.  Heck I have no idea what Obama's religious denomination is, besides the fact he attended black Christian church.  Baptist?  No idea.

But if there was a Jewish politician nobody in Euroland would care?  Heck people mentioned it about Sarkozy and it was not him but his father who was a Jew.

[alfred russel]

I gotta say that if you don't believe in the resurrection of Christ you can hardly call yourself a christian today.

I disagree. Many progressive christians are focusing more on the underlying message of Jesus (rather than the rest of the Bible) and putting aside the miracles, etc. When Rowan Williams was archbishop of canterbury he came under criticism by some senior members of the church for holding onto the specific belief in teh resurrection.

[Zanza]

But that is different from me going around defining people by their religious denomination.  Heck I have no idea what Obama's religious denomination is, besides the fact he attended black Christian church.  Baptist?  No idea.

I don't know either. But I do know that there was a debate about the preacher in his Chicago church who had extreme positions apparently.

Which is more than I know about the religious affiliation of just about any German politician. Merkel is supposedly Protestant, but I certainly can't tell from any of her political positions.

There was something about Bush being a born-again methodist or so and Carter renouncing baptism. Romney being a Mormon featured prominently in the campaign and Santorum's or Huckabee's overt religiosity played an instrumental role in their respective campaigns. Mentioning that Kennedy was the only Roman Catholic president so far or stuff like that just doesn't seem to be relevant here.

Could be that it is because of the much higher religious variance that derspiess mentions.

But if there was a Jewish politician nobody in Euroland would care?  Heck people mentioned it about Sarkozy and it was not him but his father who was a Jew.

The mayor of Frankfurt was elected recently and happens to be a Jew. That was mentioned when he was elected. However I would argue that it was mentioned not because of any religious implications for his policies, but rather because the Nazis had ousted the last Jewish mayor of Frankfurt in 1933 .

[Viking]

I gotta say that if you don't believe in the resurrection of Christ you can hardly call yourself a christian today.

I disagree. Many progressive christians are focusing more on the underlying message of Jesus (rather than the rest of the Bible) and putting aside the miracles, etc. When Rowan Williams was archbishop of canterbury he came under criticism by some senior members of the church for holding onto the specific belief in teh resurrection.

It seems that the words progressive, moderate and anglican are merely euphemisms for non-belief these days.

But on Williams

John Shelby Spong once accused Williams of being a 'neo-medievalist', preaching orthodoxy to the people in the pew but knowing in private that it is not true.[27] In an interview with Third Way Magazine Williams responded: "I am genuinely a lot more conservative than he would like me to be. Take the Resurrection. I think he has said that of course I know what all the reputable scholars think on the subject and therefore when I talk about the risen body I must mean something other than the empty tomb. But I don't. I don't know how to persuade him, but I really don't."[28]

He was criticized for hypocracy, in preaching one thing and believing another. His response was that he believed in the resurrection despite the rumors to the contrary.

Actual Christ Followers (those who deny the divinty of but advocate the philosophy of) Jesus Christ are unfortunately few and far between since apart from the nice stuff he says he is a millennial end of days prophet.

[alfred russel]

But that is different from me going around defining people by their religious denomination.  Heck I have no idea what Obama's religious denomination is, besides the fact he attended black Christian church.  Baptist?  No idea.

I don't know either. But I do know that there was a debate about the preacher in his Chicago church who had extreme positions apparently.

Which is more than I know about the religious affiliation of just about any German politician. Merkel is supposedly Protestant, but I certainly can't tell from any of her political positions.

There was something about Bush being a born-again methodist or so and Carter renouncing baptism. Romney being a Mormon featured prominently in the campaign and Santorum's or Huckabee's overt religiosity played an instrumental role in their respective campaigns. Mentioning that Kennedy was the only Roman Catholic president so far or stuff like that just doesn't seem to be relevant here.

Could be that it is because of the much higher religious variance that derspiess mentions.



But if there was a Jewish politician nobody in Euroland would care?  Heck people mentioned it about Sarkozy and it was not him but his father who was a Jew.

[/quote]

Lets not go too far with this. I've heard a number of Europeans bring up Romney's religion when explaining that he is unfit for office.

[Zanza]

But that is different from me going around defining people by their religious denomination.  Heck I have no idea what Obama's religious denomination is, besides the fact he attended black Christian church.  Baptist?  No idea.

I don't know either. But I do know that there was a debate about the preacher in his Chicago church who had extreme positions apparently.

Which is more than I know about the religious affiliation of just about any German politician. Merkel is supposedly Protestant, but I certainly can't tell from any of her political positions.

There was something about Bush being a born-again methodist or so and Carter renouncing baptism. Romney being a Mormon featured prominently in the campaign and Santorum's or Huckabee's overt religiosity played an instrumental role in their respective campaigns. Mentioning that Kennedy was the only Roman Catholic president so far or stuff like that just doesn't seem to be relevant here.

Could be that it is because of the much higher religious variance that derspiess mentions.



But if there was a Jewish politician nobody in Euroland would care?  Heck people mentioned it about Sarkozy and it was not him but his father who was a Jew.

Lets not go too far with this. I've heard a number of Europeans bring up Romney's religion when explaining that he is unfit for office.

They probably meant "Republican" and not "Mormon" when they referred to his religion though. 

[Iormlund]

Lets not go too far with this. I've heard a number of Europeans bring up Romney's religion when explaining that he is unfit for office.

I would never vote for someone if he openly talked about is religion either.

[Valmy]

They probably meant "Republican" and not "Mormon" when they referred to his religion though. 

They get enough Mormon missionaries over there to know to be wary 

[Valmy]

I would never vote for someone if he openly talked about is religion either.

Generally if you are part of an unpopular minority religion you are not going to allowed to just not address it at some point.  Believe me Romney did not go out to his way to show how Mormon he was.

[Caliga]

I would never vote for someone if he openly talked about is religion either.

You'd never be able to vote for an American politician then.   FWIW I would like to agree with you but as an American it does mean I'd never be voting for a mainstream candidate.

[garbon]

To put it into perspective, I have been at this job for five years and I don't know whether anyone at the place is religious at all. It hasn't come up even once.

Well to put it into perspective (), I generally have no idea if my co-workers are religious or not - simply isn't a topic that generally comes up.  Though there have been the exceptions of the one women that wanted me to come to her church events and the time a couple of us talked about the kind of churches we went to as children.

[Iormlund]

They get enough Mormon missionaries over there to know to be wary 

Personally I can't help but find deliciously ironic to see someone from the Americas trying to convert us for a change.

[Viking]

Lets not go too far with this. I've heard a number of Europeans bring up Romney's religion when explaining that he is unfit for office.

I would never vote for someone if he openly talked about is religion either.

I wouldn't rule out voting for somebody who's religious provided he could explain his beliefs in a coherent, rational and reasonable manner.