The Great Debate Megathread! Black Lincoln versus whiter, richer Douglas!

[merithyn]

I didn't realize that the office of the President was supposed to be some sort of indicator of social growth.  Why is it such a horrible thing if a man wins the office?

I didn't say it was. I said it would be bad if ONLY men won the next 4-7 elections. It would be even worse if ONLY white men won. The country is made up of more than that, and it would be nice to see that diversity at the highest eschelon of our nation. It will indicate that gender and race are no longer stoppers when running for The Big Office here. (And please don't try to claim that it hasn't been in the past nor that it won't be in the future.  )

[Habbaku]

(And please don't try to claim that it hasn't been in the past nor that it won't be in the future.  )

[Neil]

A hispanic woman in the White House?  I suppose the US government could cut costs by using illegals as maids.

[derspiess]

diversity

[merithyn]

diversity

Help me understand why that's a dirty word.

We are a diverse nation with a variety of perspectives. The fact that the vast majority of those leading our country have been of a single demographic is a major issue for me, regardless of what demographic that is. It would distress me if we had only been led by only Hispanic women or Asian men or Samoan transsexuals for that matter during the course of our history, too.

[Jacob]

Damn you, debate scheduling!

One time showing of Black Narcissus at the art house downtown tonight at the same time. 

Why would you be interested in the debates?  You already know who to vote for, and you have everybody's soundbites down by heart.  I'm sure if Romney steps on his own dick again, it'll dominate the news cycle for the next week, so what's the big deal about catching it live?

Same reason it's more fun to watch your sports team play live than it is to watch the highlight reel on the sports and news shows later.

[Valmy]

Look I think diversity is great as a goal.  Naturally our institutions should be open to all who have the ruthlessness and lack of ethics required.  But I just think it is a bit overplayed as a virtue.  Like somehow our institutions will be more sensitive and more virtuous once we have everybody represented.  I really doubt it will make a bit of difference in how those institutions operate.  The assholes who run them may look different but they are basically the same sort of creature.  Nancy Pelosi and Obama may be of different race and gender but they seem identical to the white dudes who preceded them in every important respect that I can see.

[Ed Anger]

White men über alles. Or failing that, men über alles.

[derspiess]

diversity

Help me understand why that's a dirty word.

We are a diverse nation with a variety of perspectives. The fact that the vast majority of those leading our country have been of a single demographic is a major issue for me, regardless of what demographic that is. It would distress me if we had only been led by only Hispanic women or Asian men or Samoan transsexuals for that matter during the course of our history, too.

Valmy pretty much covered it.

[FunkMonk]

Look I think diversity is great as a goal.  Naturally our institutions should be open to all who have the ruthlessness and lack of ethics required.  But I just think it is a bit overplayed as a virtue.  Like somehow our institutions will be more sensitive and more virtuous once we have everybody represented.  I really doubt it will make a bit of difference in how those institutions operate.  The assholes who run them may look different but they are basically the same sort of creature.  Nancy Pelosi and Obama may be of different race and gender but they seem identical to the white dudes who preceded them in every important respect that I can see.

I don't think meri is arguing diversity for diversity's sake. She's saying that minorities getting elected to high offices reflect the positive social changes the country has gone through.

It will indicate that gender and race are no longer stoppers

[merithyn]

Look I think diversity is great as a goal.  Naturally our institutions should be open to all who have the ruthlessness and lack of ethics required.  But I just think it is a bit overplayed as a virtue.  Like somehow our institutions will be more sensitive and more virtuous once we have everybody represented.  I really doubt it will make a bit of difference in how those institutions operate.  The assholes who run them may look different but they are basically the same sort of creature.  Nancy Pelosi and Obama may be of different race and gender but they seem identical to the white dudes who preceded them in every important respect that I can see.

Oh, absolutely! But the nation will have grown enough to vote based on who was the most ruthless/ethically devoid rather than on who wore high heels or who needs suntan lotion or not.

[Valmy]

Oh, absolutely! But the nation will have grown enough to vote based on who was the most ruthless/ethically devoid rather than on who wore high heels or who needs suntan lotion or not.

And may we all live to see that day.

[merithyn]

Oh, absolutely! But the nation will have grown enough to vote based on who was the most ruthless/ethically devoid rather than on who wore high heels or who needs suntan lotion or not.

And may we all live to see that day.

Hey, I'll take what I can get. 

[crazy canuck]

Look I think diversity is great as a goal.  Naturally our institutions should be open to all who have the ruthlessness and lack of ethics required.  But I just think it is a bit overplayed as a virtue.  Like somehow our institutions will be more sensitive and more virtuous once we have everybody represented.  I really doubt it will make a bit of difference in how those institutions operate.  The assholes who run them may look different but they are basically the same sort of creature.  Nancy Pelosi and Obama may be of different race and gender but they seem identical to the white dudes who preceded them in every important respect that I can see.

There is a fair amount of literature regarding how law schools became more tolerable places once Female students and then professors came on the scene - they were simply unwilling to put up with the kind of bs males were willing to put up with and dish out all those years in the absence of females.

Take that example and multiply it across society.

[garbon]

Nancy Pelosi and Obama may be of different race and gender but they seem identical to the white dudes who preceded them in every important respect that I can see.

I'm not sure I'd even describe Nancy Pelosi and Obama as similar.