25 years old and deep in debt

[DGuller]

Maybe I'm overly traditional, but to me, college education is about more than just passing tests.  Any education, for that matter.

[Sheilbh]

How in the fuck does a law teacher research anything?  Their discipline is not only ridiculous and made-up, but also unscientific.

I have to say that after 12 years as a lawyer (and one who does deal with law rather than just tick boxes ono a due diligence spreadsheet), I have only ever read one academic paper. And that was useless.

I've read academic papers more frequently but yes, they tend to be useless.

Problem is that the function of an academic paper is divorced from real world applications, and only affects them tangentally. In the real world, people want answers to actual problems. Academic research tends to be about considering interesting questions.

Is this a common law thing? I've got the impression that academic papers are far more important and respected in civil law countries.

[Ideologue]

College Degree, No Class Time Required

University of Wisconsin will grant bachelor's degrees based on a person's knowledge as demonstrated in online tests, not on class time or credits, the first such offering from a public university system.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323301104578255992379228564.html

Under the Flexible Option, assessment tests and related online courses are being written by faculty who normally teach the related subject-area classes, Mr. Reilly said.

Officials plan to launch the full program this fall, with bachelor's degrees in subjects including information technology and diagnostic imaging, plus master's and bachelor's degrees for registered nurses. Faculty are working on writing those tests now.
...
Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker has championed the idea, in part because he left college in his senior year for a job opportunity and never finished his degree. He said he hoped to use the Flexible Degree option himself.

"I think it is one more way to get your degree. I don't see it as replacing things," Mr. Walker said.

Beth Calvert, a 35-year-old registered nurse at a Milwaukee hospital, hopes to enroll in the program to earn her bachelor's in nursing. Between working overnight shifts and caring for her 3-year-old daughter, Ms. Calvert said she has little time to move beyond her associate degree but knows that it increasingly is important to her employer, which she said offers a pay raise to nurses with higher degrees.

"The biggest thing is job opportunity," she said. "It looks better for a hospital to have nurses with bachelor's degrees. On a day-to-day basis, I feel I have the education I do need."

Lol, so they're throwing to the roadside the last signifier that higher education actually bestows upon a graduate, i.e. they have at least demonstrated the ability to go somewhere and do things for several years.

[Ideologue]

How in the fuck does a law teacher research anything?  Their discipline is not only ridiculous and made-up, but also unscientific.

I have to say that after 12 years as a lawyer (and one who does deal with law rather than just tick boxes ono a due diligence spreadsheet), I have only ever read one academic paper. And that was useless.

I've read academic papers more frequently but yes, they tend to be useless.

Problem is that the function of an academic paper is divorced from real world applications, and only affects them tangentally. In the real world, people want answers to actual problems. Academic research tends to be about considering interesting questions.

Is this a common law thing? I've got the impression that academic papers are far more important and respected in civil law countries.

It's certainly an American thing--the legal academy is often criticized for scholarship that costs each student an average of about $10,000 (depending on how you break it down) but which is usually poor, often ignored, even within the academy, and almost never used by practicioners.  I don't think it's quite as completely worthless as some feel, but it's definitely not worth the cost to students and increasingly taxpayers, and if 9/10 of it disappeared tomorrow, I doubt anyone would notice.

[Eddie Teach]

College Degree, No Class Time Required

University of Wisconsin will grant bachelor's degrees based on a person's knowledge as demonstrated in online tests, not on class time or credits, the first such offering from a public university system.

That's similar to what my school does, most of the class credits depend on going out and passing a test for certifications.

[CountDeMoney]

Maybe I'm overly traditional, but to me, college education is about more than just passing tests.  Any education, for that matter.

Yeah, but at a certain point in certain disciplines, experience laps anything you can get in a classroom.  Not all of them, but in practical vocations like nursing, I can appreciate that.

[stjaba]

It's certainly an American thing--the legal academy is often criticized for scholarship that costs each student an average of about $10,000 (depending on how you break it down) but which is usually poor, often ignored, even within the academy, and almost never used by practicioners.  I don't think it's quite as completely worthless as some feel, but it's definitely not worth the cost to students and increasingly taxpayers, and if 9/10 of it disappeared tomorrow, I doubt anyone would notice.

I read or skimmed literally hundreds of law review articles when I was a law student and 90%+ were practically useless or the equivalent of academic spam. Tons of articles on constitutional interpretation that were interesting, but unlikely to be of help to anyone.

Now that I'm practicing, I've found maybe 1 or 2 articles that were helpful. Legal encyclopedias or practice aids are much more helpful.

[Phillip V]

Money Issues Drive Down Law Schools' Applications

'Law school applications are headed for a 30-year low, reflecting increased concern over soaring tuition, crushing student debt and diminishing prospects of lucrative employment upon graduation.

As of this month, there were 30,000 applicants to law schools for the fall, a 20 percent decrease from the same time last year and a 38 percent decline from 2010, according to the Law School Admission Council. Of some 200 law schools nationwide, only 4 have seen increases in applications this year. In 2004 there were 100,000 applicants to law schools; this year there are likely to be 54,000.

Such startling numbers have plunged law school administrations into soul-searching debate about the future of legal education and the profession over all.'

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/31/education/law-schools-applications-fall-as-costs-rise-and-jobs-are-cut.html

[Admiral Yi]

Next logical step is for the shittier law schools to close.

[KRonn]

Next logical step is for the shittier law schools to close.

Nah, they should just get government subsidies for not producing students, just like the govt does for farmers so as not to over produce a crop to keep surpluses down.     

[MadImmortalMan]

Next logical step is for the shittier law schools to close.

huh

http://www.businessinsider.com/which-law-schools-might-fail-2013-1

[Ideologue]

Another BI headline--

The Law School Crisis Doesn't Exist At Places Like Yale

Ha ha, so all two of them?

Also, if you see a significant number of law schools close, given that Yale is the largest (iirc) single source of law professors, I think you'll find quite a few former Yaletards in potentially permanent underemployment.

[Phillip V]

Drowned in a Stream of Prescriptions

'Up to 35 percent of college students take stimulant pills to enhance school performance.'

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/03/us/concerns-about-adhd-practices-and-amphetamine-addiction.html

[merithyn]

That's because they work.

[garbon]

For undergrad? I think as the first page of that underlines with the Fee story - these individuals sorely lack perspective.