Skeletal Remains Of An Entire Army Found In An Ancient Mass Grave In Denmark

[Razgovory]

I actually know some of these people so, no meri, no.

What defines an actual Asatru?

Willingness to sacrifice an entire army in Denmark.

[DGuller]

Also, Timmay, pray tell what you find so "fucking cool" about human sacrifice on a large scale?

What, we can't revel in the achievements of others now? 

[Viking]

So if someone calls themselves Asatru they are actual Asatru? Good, we are in agreement then.

Depends. Are there official guidelines?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A1vam%C3%A1l

[Admiral Yi]

Yes, and mormons call themselves christian. The thing is you can call yourself whatever you want. I'm rich, popular and handsome, plus my penis is over two foot long. I just choose my own meanings of the words rich, popular, handsome and foot.

But two is not up for debate? 

[Viking]

Yes, and mormons call themselves christian. The thing is you can call yourself whatever you want. I'm rich, popular and handsome, plus my penis is over two foot long. I just choose my own meanings of the words rich, popular, handsome and foot.

But two is not up for debate? 

when the meaning of "foot" is completely arbitrary then "two" no longer has any meaning.

[Razgovory]

The thing is Max, these are people who are trying to reconstruct a religion that differed dramatically across a wide area from a few poems recorded and partially preserved at the far periphery of the area where people had these beliefs and try understand them through the lens of religion as they understand it in the modern world.  It would be like a group of Chinese Buddhists who decided to develop an idea of Christianity based on watching the movie The Exorcist and started calling themselves "Baptist Christians" based on what they they thought they gleaned from the film.

[merithyn]

So if someone calls themselves Asatru they are actual Asatru? Good, we are in agreement then.

Depends. Are there official guidelines?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A1vam%C3%A1l

Yeah, that's what I was thinking of when I said based on actual writings. I don't know enough about it to say that the neo-Asatru movement follows it faithfully, but if that's their basis for their religion, I'd guess it would still be okay to call it Asatru. But I'm not as strict with my definition of what to call things as you seem to be.

[merithyn]

The thing is Max, these are people who are trying to reconstruct a religion that differed dramatically across a wide area from a few poems recorded and partially preserved at the far periphery of the area where people had these beliefs and try understand them through the lens of religion as they understand it in the modern world.  It would be like a group of Chinese Buddhists who decided to develop an idea of Christianity based on watching the movie The Exorcist and started calling themselves "Baptist Christians" based on what they they thought they gleaned from the film.

Actually, it would be more like those same Buddhists trying to recreate Christianity based on the Dead Sea Scrolls.

I don't see anything wrong with them callilng themselves Christians anymore than I do with the Asatru folks calling themselves that.

[Phillip V]

Denmark needs to issue an official apology and provide reparations.

[Razgovory]

The thing is Max, these are people who are trying to reconstruct a religion that differed dramatically across a wide area from a few poems recorded and partially preserved at the far periphery of the area where people had these beliefs and try understand them through the lens of religion as they understand it in the modern world.  It would be like a group of Chinese Buddhists who decided to develop an idea of Christianity based on watching the movie The Exorcist and started calling themselves "Baptist Christians" based on what they they thought they gleaned from the film.

Actually, it would be more like those same Buddhists trying to recreate Christianity based on the Dead Sea Scrolls.

I don't see anything wrong with them callilng themselves Christians anymore than I do with the Asatru folks calling themselves that.

These poems were not really "holy texts" in the sense we think of Christians and the Bible.  They were closer to entertainment.

[Neil]

Also, Timmay, pray tell what you find so "fucking cool" about human sacrifice on a large scale?

It's subjective.  Why wouldn't it be cool?

[merithyn]

These poems were not really "holy texts" in the sense we think of Christians and the Bible.  They were closer to entertainment.

So you know nothing about them? That's what I'm getting from this statement.

[Viking]

The thing is Max, these are people who are trying to reconstruct a religion that differed dramatically across a wide area from a few poems recorded and partially preserved at the far periphery of the area where people had these beliefs and try understand them through the lens of religion as they understand it in the modern world.  It would be like a group of Chinese Buddhists who decided to develop an idea of Christianity based on watching the movie The Exorcist and started calling themselves "Baptist Christians" based on what they they thought they gleaned from the film.

Actually, it would be more like those same Buddhists trying to recreate Christianity based on the Dead Sea Scrolls.

I don't see anything wrong with them callilng themselves Christians anymore than I do with the Asatru folks calling themselves that.

The thing is that at some point we have to insist that words have meaning. We don't have to choose between a world where there is a form of "Asatru" which we only see shadows of and a world where words only have the meaning we choose to give them at any moment. Languages are tools for communication amongst people who agree on the meanings of words. I can't arbitrarily declare myself female or blonde and expect to be treated as such.

It is belief in the gods and belief in the doctrine of the gods. Tradition is clear, these neo-pagans are making their own shit up and putting old norse names on them.

[HVC]

164 stanzas written 300 years after the death of a religion is not equivallent to a religious text liek the dead sea scrolls. Raz's comparisson was off. it's more like catching a 30 minute clip of the passion of the christ... if passion was written by someone who only had passing knowledge of the subject matter he was writing about

[Viking]

These poems were not really "holy texts" in the sense we think of Christians and the Bible.  They were closer to entertainment.

So you know nothing about them? That's what I'm getting from this statement.

Basically they are a collection of hesiod style just so stories and homer style epic poems about the adventures of heros (often with thor as the hero with loki as sidekick) and books of wisdom like havamal. It is about what to believe not how to worship.