Is Obama a better president than George W. Bush?

[DontSayBanana]

Of course you would. After all they are wrong and if they don't want to accept what you want to hand them, they must be evil.

The irony here is that you're completely playing into the stereotype of conservatives not knowing the meaning of the word "compromise."

This is a really stupid war of ideologies, and the primary reason why I completely refuse to identify myself as a "democrat."

[Razgovory]

Of course not.  Social Security in the hands of Wall Street?  What could possibly happen?

Mass poverty for American oldsters?  Then again, a mass influx of social security funds might be the only thing that keeps casino capitalism from fully melting down for another five years.

I know I could get a better return than the gubmint on the money I'm currently contributing to SocSec.  Just cut me loose from the system, keep what I've contributed thus far, and let me divert my SS taxes into my 401k.

I doubt it.  Isn't your Soc Security returned based on how long you live?  Theoretically you return is infinite.  It's only cut short due to your personal failure i.e. dying.

[Fate]

That's fine if he's a Congressional leader.  But he's a President who already had half the country ranting about socialism because he's passed what was, 5 years ago, a plausible Republican policy. 

I actually think the problem with Obama is that he talks the left but actually governs from the centre - which can end up confusing and annoying both, the left think he's spineless and the right think he's too lefty.

See, Shiv, this is where your over-educated British stoic intellect fails you.  You're overshooting.
The problem half the nation has with Obama is because he's black man.  Yes, it's actually that fucking simple over here.

Right, because Britain would handle a Negro prime minister so well....

They could probably handle a negro no problem...

... let's if they can ever elect a sunni paki. 

[Capetan Mihali]

It's only cut short due to your personal failure i.e. dying.

Father Divine, who was extremely successful during the Depression for giving out food and his civil rights message, preached that physical death was only the result of personal failure.  (Also, pro-interracial marriage but demanded total chastity.)

There's a great abandoned hotel at Broad and Girard that used be run by the Father Divine group -- apparently, the first hotel to be racially integrated in Phila.

[CountDeMoney]

That's fine if he's a Congressional leader.  But he's a President who already had half the country ranting about socialism because he's passed what was, 5 years ago, a plausible Republican policy. 

I actually think the problem with Obama is that he talks the left but actually governs from the centre - which can end up confusing and annoying both, the left think he's spineless and the right think he's too lefty.

See, Shiv, this is where your over-educated British stoic intellect fails you.  You're overshooting.
The problem half the nation has with Obama is because he's black man.  Yes, it's actually that fucking simple over here.

Right, because Britain would handle a Negro prime minister so well....

Of course they would;  they have Brit accents.

Now, Welsh on the other hand...

[garbon]

Of course you would. After all they are wrong and if they don't want to accept what you want to hand them, they must be evil.

The irony here is that you're completely playing into the stereotype of conservatives not knowing the meaning of the word "compromise."

This is a really stupid war of ideologies, and the primary reason why I completely refuse to identify myself as a "democrat."

Where is there room to compromise? You've said the Republicans are to blame. Where's the compromise between that and my assertion that both have a large share of responsibility?

[Berkut]

In the end, we will have single payer healthcare if Obamacare is declared unconstitutional, because we know single-payer is constitutional.  And if this is the best thing Barry can do, it ain't any worse than anything George did.  And the things I hoped Barry would do differently than George he hasn't, so eff him with a spoon.

I think we'll eventually end up with something similar to Argentina: a "universal" government-run healthcare system that is so lousy only the poor will use it, and anyone who can afford to do so will effectively opt out by buying a private insurance plan that is mostly unregulated by the gov't.

Except that our terrible universal healthcare system will cost 4 times what every other country pays for theirs, while completely failing to provide a decent level of service.

[Ideologue]

Oh I get it. I broke a rule of the left. Minority should only be used when talking about disadvantaged ones (blacks, hispanics, gays, etc). Sorry if I caused confusion.

I don't think you're disadvantaged, Sunshine. 

Well I still can't get the man of my choosing a green card.

Buy American.

[Eddie Teach]

Where is there room to compromise? You've said the Republicans are to blame. Where's the compromise between that and my assertion that both have a large share of responsibility?

It's at "both are to blame, but Republicans moreso".

[DontSayBanana]

It's at "both are to blame, but Republicans moreso".

Meh.  They just got to it first.  A lot of political stunts are only considered "off the table" until somebody grows a pair and shows they're possible.  The republican agenda doesn't seem to be that popular, but now that the democrats have seen the tactic's efficacy, I fully expect them to pull the same stonewalling tactics if and when they find themselves in the same position that the republicans are currently in.

[Valmy]

Of course they would;  they have Brit accents.

Now, Welsh on the other hand...

Yes?  What about us?

[Sheilbh]

I do fault him for his pork-barrelesque stimulus bill and the accounting tricks he used to fund Obamacare.

I don't know about either.  Do you have any sources?

The problem is that you (and many Dems) spend too much time actin superior. The opposition doesn't agree with you, they must be terribly stupid people.  As a general rule, human beings don't respond well to being called ignorant. You can't expect to win their hearts if you're parading around your superiority (with little evidence to back it up, imo).

Exactly.  I remember during healthcare the Republicans campaigning strongly against it.  The Democrats were talking among themselves like New Deal technocrats deciding which system would be best to impose on the country.  It was ridiculous - they looked arrogant, elitist and disconnected.  All this time I didn't see anyone campaigning for healthcare reform (as they had during the election) explaining and arguing why it's a good thing.  No wonder they lost, they deserved to.

Except that our terrible universal healthcare system will cost 4 times what every other country pays for theirs, while completely failing to provide a decent level of service.

Your government healthcare - so Medicare, Medicaid and the VA - already costs more, as a percentage of GDP than the NHS or many other Euro systems.

[Admiral Yi]

I don't know about either.  Do you have any sources?

You know I don't do sources. 

Half the revenue for Obamacare was raised by an increase in the Medicare tax.  That's real money.  The other half was raised by a promise to keep the Medicare reimbursement rate down.  That's fake money.

A big chunk of stimulus money was given to the the states to finance state employee salaries.  Who do state employees vote for?

[Admiral Yi]

I would absolutely blame the opposition for setting up political blockades and refusing to even open dialogue, effectively abusing a system that was designed from the ground up to enforce cooperation.  Nice strawman, though.

That's a little harsh.  Democrats weren't that bad during the Iraq war.

[CountDeMoney]

Democrats weren't that bad during the Iraq war.

And when someone did deign speak up, it got successfully circled back to Vietnam.