Sweden and the Great War

[Neil]

The goals of the Siberian intervention were a. help get the Czech Legion back home, and b. prevent Japan from getting any ideas about annexing Vladivostok or other parts of Siberia.

Why bother? Whether the Whites or the Reds won the Japanese would have been kicked out of Siberia eventually by the Russians.

That wasn't obvious at the time.  After all, it had only been a decade and change ago that the Japanese crushed the Russians in the Far East.

[jimmy olsen]

The goals of the Siberian intervention were a. help get the Czech Legion back home, and b. prevent Japan from getting any ideas about annexing Vladivostok or other parts of Siberia.

Why bother? Whether the Whites or the Reds won the Japanese would have been kicked out of Siberia eventually by the Russians.

That wasn't obvious at the time.  After all, it had only been a decade and change ago that the Japanese crushed the Russians in the Far East.

I'd hardly say they crushed them on land. They made slow grinding progress and the Japanese economy was on the verge of collapse from that effort IIRC.

Raz it has nothing to do with the Swedes marching on Murmansk or Arkhangelsk. It has everything to do with supplies no longer being shipped through Sweden to Russia and Murmansk and Arkhangelsk  not being able to pick up the slack.

[Razgovory]

How much was being sent through Sweden?  Couldn't be much.

[jimmy olsen]

How much was being sent through Sweden?  Couldn't be much.

Surely off loading goods at ports in Norway and shipping them by rail across Sweden into Russian Finland would be more efficient and safer then sailing them into the Arctic sea and offloading them at ports with extreme rail bottlenecks. One could also offload goods onto ships in eastern Sweden and ship them straight to St. Petersburg.

[Neil]

Really?  Tell me about the quality of the rail links through Norway, Sweden and Finland during the Great War.

Sweden also had its neutrality to consider.

[jimmy olsen]

Really?  Tell me about the quality of the rail links through Norway, Sweden and Finland during the Great War.

Sweden also had its neutrality to consider.

FWIW the Swedish border town of Haparanda experienced a huge transport boom in WW1. - The Brain

[Valdemar]

A boom in going from backwater to little less back water

The Germans sank ships in the bottom end of the Baltic, all the way down to a load of Cognac and Champagne

V

[The Brain]

I get the impression that maybe 100 rail carriages of goods a day passed through Sweden to/from Russia. Plus passengers.

[jimmy olsen]

A Russian corp sent to deal with the Swedes is a corp not fighting the Germans

The Russians problems against the Germans had nothing to do with a lack of soldiers.

I disagree with this. The Russians were stretched thin fighting against the Ottomans, the Austria-Hungarians and the Germans. If the Swedes land a corp or two in Southern Finland and the Russians have to counter with a couple of 1st rate corps in response, they have to come from somewhere. The Russians had enormous manpower, but the amount that was well trained and well armed was limited.

If those troops would have otherwise fought against the AHs then the Russian victory's won't be as decisive and Austria-Hungary will be in much better shape.

If they would have fought Germany, then Germany may not need to transport in troops from the West. They can instead by used for the battle of the Marne. 

[Razgovory]

Really?  Tell me about the quality of the rail links through Norway, Sweden and Finland during the Great War.

Sweden also had its neutrality to consider.

I wonder if the gauges were the same in Sweden and Russia.

[Ideologue]

Really?  Tell me about the quality of the rail links through Norway, Sweden and Finland during the Great War.

Sweden also had its neutrality to consider.

I wonder if the gauges were the same in Sweden and Russia.

They were not; Sweden uses standard gauge rail generally, although there are some archaic narrow gauge (even smaller than standard, much smaller than Russian wide gauge) lines still in use apparently, but not for freight.

Finland of course uses broad gauge.

[jimmy olsen]

A Russian corp sent to deal with the Swedes is a corp not fighting the Germans

The Russians problems against the Germans had nothing to do with a lack of soldiers.

I disagree with this. The Russians were stretched thin fighting against the Ottomans, the Austria-Hungarians and the Germans. If the Swedes land a corp or two in Southern Finland and the Russians have to counter with a couple of 1st rate corps in response, they have to come from somewhere. The Russians had enormous manpower, but the amount that was well trained and well armed was limited.

If those troops would have otherwise fought against the AHs then the Russian victory's won't be as decisive and Austria-Hungary will be in much better shape.

If they would have fought Germany, then Germany may not need to transport in troops from the West. They can instead by used for the battle of the Marne.

Also, such butterflies would certainly influence Romania's decision on entering the war.

[grumbler]

I disagree with this. The Russians were stretched thin fighting against the Ottomans, the Austria-Hungarians and the Germans. If the Swedes land a corp or two in Southern Finland and the Russians have to counter with a couple of 1st rate corps in response, they have to come from somewhere. The Russians had enormous manpower, but the amount that was well trained and well armed was limited.

I think you are making this up.  The Russians could not be sure the Swedes would not enter the war, and therefor had to leave troops behind to protect vital areas in case the Swedes did.  These were not first-rate troops, but your assumption that the Russians would need to deploy first-rate troops against the Swedes is unfounded.

If those troops would have otherwise fought against the AHs then the Russian victory's won't be as decisive and Austria-Hungary will be in much better shape.

If they would have fought Germany, then Germany may not need to transport in troops from the West. They can instead by used for the battle of the Marne.

The First and Second Russian Armies didn't depend on any troops shifted in the the Finland front.  The German reserves sent east were sent as a response to the early movements of the First and Second Armies, and those armies started to move before anyone could know whether the Swedes would enter the war or not.

Sweden entering the war may have impacted the Brusilev Offensive, but couldn't have effected the Battle of the Marne.