Europe's Golden age? 1890-1914

[Ed Anger]

The US does shit.  Like Iraq.  It may not be a good idea, but it goes in and does stuff.  That's self confidence.  If nobody wanted to help the US in Iraq the US still would have attacked.  Compare this to the Euros and the Yugoslav wars.  They couldn't do much unless the US came in.  Hell, look at Libya.  They lacked even the capability to actually operate a no fly zone with out the US.

Eh they do that to have the resources to buy off their voters.  If we left they would eventually be compelled to fund their militaries again.  I do not know if their military weakness is necessarily the evidence of their lack of vilality but just evidence they do not need to spend money on their militaries.  The evidence of European lack of vitality is the fact they seem to have to wait for a crisis before actually being able to address their problems which is textbook evidence for a society that lacks vitality.

I think there is a distinct lack of will.  If we left NATO I don't think they would do much with their militaries (Spell check doesn't like this word).  I think they would prefer to isolate themselves politically, putting faith in the UN and the like and shake their fists at more active countries like an old man complaining about teenagers.  Europe is becoming a retirement communities for nations.

The French will continue to intervene in its former colonies and maintains the capability to do so. The rest of the misbegotten lump of NATO nations? A  joke except for the Turks.

Speaking of the Turks, please invade Syria. TV is boring right now.

[jimmy olsen]

Name one big crisis we headed off at the pass by fixing an underlying problem before it blew up into a big crisis?

Um all of them?  The only one we failed to do so was the slavery thing and that was simply intractable.  Even the compromises made it worse.  But that had to do more with the unsolvable nature of the crisis than a lack of will to solve it.

That was a string of crises that lasted 80 years and just kept getting bigger.

I mean look at the problems with social unrest because of the industrial revolution.  I thought we did excellently by addressing those issues before any serious threats to the social order really got rolling.

What big crises are you thinking of?

The Great Depression, WWII, 70s(protest movements/stagflation), Global Warming, the 2008 financial collapse. These all could have been ameliorated if steps had been taking before hand to address the root causes.

[Malthus]

By the definition America has never had vitality. We always wait until a crisis to do something about a problem.

If that was true you would be right.

But that is total nonsense.

Name one big crisis we headed off at the pass by fixing an underlying problem before it blew up into a big crisis?

How about the Marshall Plan?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan

The crisis averted was to use European economic recovery to forestall the spread of Communist influence in Western Europe.

[The Brain]

I think it's reasonable to describe 1890-1914 as Europe's golden age.

[The Minsky Moment]

1890-1914 was pretty awful for most Europeans.

1953-1973 would probably be a better choice, except for the Hungarians and the Czechs.

[The Brain]

1890-1914 was pretty awful for most Europeans.

1953-1973 would probably be a better choice, except for the Hungarians and the Czechs.

Troll?

[Duque de Bragança]

1890-1914 was pretty awful for most Europeans.

1953-1973 would probably be a better choice, except for the Hungarians and the Czechs.

Troll?

Best part of the Trente Glorieuses or Glorious Thirties if you prefer.

[The Brain]

At least in the 30s there was a new hope.

[PDH]

1930s Star Wars sucked.

[Zanza]

Eh they do that to have the resources to buy off their voters.  If we left they would eventually be compelled to fund their militaries again.

To defend against whom?

[The Minsky Moment]

1890-1914 was pretty awful for most Europeans.

1953-1973 would probably be a better choice, except for the Hungarians and the Czechs.

Troll?

The trolls had it pretty bad from the end of the Middle Ages until mass access to the World Wide Web.  Their Golden Age is now.

[Zanza]

Europe's Golden Age was obviously the postwar and post-Cold War period. Most Europeans lived in peace for more than 66 years now and have unparalled prosperity. Having colonial empires and great power status is pretty meaningless for the average person.

[MadImmortalMan]

Reasoning that no golden age would have the seeds of it's own destruction sown with in it and that people looked back across the gulf of the war with rose tinged glasses.

I would speculate that all golden ages have the seeds of their own destruction built in.

[KRonn]

1890-1914 was pretty awful for most Europeans.

1953-1973 would probably be a better choice, except for the Hungarians and the Czechs.

Troll?

The trolls had it pretty bad from the end of the Middle Ages until mass access to the World Wide Web.  Their Golden Age is now.

[Razgovory]

Europe's Golden Age was obviously the postwar and post-Cold War period. Most Europeans lived in peace for more than 66 years now and have unparalled prosperity. Having colonial empires and great power status is pretty meaningless for the average person.

This is a function of technology more the society.  If we use this criteria nearly all countries are in a golden age. Most Russians live better then their ancestors did, though this is hardly the golden age of Russia.  Hell, North Koreans probably have better amenities then their ancestors did under the Japanese or living in mud huts.  They don't have a lot of electricity but they had more then then they did 200 years ago.  I'm not sure if most European countries have been at peace for 66 years now.  Several European powers were engaged in an air war over Libya a few months ago.