Americas Elect 2012 - the Not Party

[Eddie Teach]

Because the current state of affairs isn't sustainable.

Are you talking about energy? That problem's not one that's going to be solved by politicians.

[Valmy]

Are you talking about energy? That problem's not one that's going to be solved by politicians.

Pretty sure he is talking about government fiscal management.

[The Brain]

  As for centrism, I'm as capable of pragmatic compromise as anyone, and perhaps moreso than most, but pragmatic compromise is not an inspiring vision of the future or an end goal to work toward.

Why do we need to be working toward something?

Because the current state of affairs isn't sustainable.

Then surely we'll end up somewhere else without having to work?

[Eddie Teach]

Pretty sure he is talking about government fiscal management.

Eh, well I don't think of balancing the budget as the kind of broad visionary structural change Ide was talking about.

[Ideologue]

Balancing the budget isn't a bad thing.  I just don't think austerity measures on the part of the state should be the principal, let alone only, solution.

[fhdz]

And you my friend presuppose goodwill and good-faith where there are none.

Not at all.

[fhdz]

As for centrism, I'm as capable of pragmatic compromise as anyone, and perhaps moreso than most, but pragmatic compromise is not an inspiring vision of the future or an end goal to work toward.

Why? A lot of those small victories end up totaling a giant victory.

And since when was "let's build something that works" not inspiring?

[fhdz]

I agree, generally.  I don't think there are really any pragmatic politics - it always seems to me to just be a way to try and close of discussion.  So I think Blair had his own vision and ideology, so did MacMillan - they're probably the most ideologically malleable and neutral figures I can think of.  I imagine it's the same in the US.  I think you've got to have a direction of travel, you need to marry pragmatism to some sense of ideology or you get the European Commission. 

Yes, but I guess my point is that your ideology doesn't have to be based on a fiction.

[Neil]

Are you talking about energy? That problem's not one that's going to be solved by politicians.

Pretty sure he is talking about government fiscal management.

Both, and more.  Western society, with its focus on personal freedom and prioritizing of creature comforts above all other considerations.  Energy use and fiscal carelessness are merely symptoms of the real problem.

[Eddie Teach]

Loving freedom and comfort didn't stop us from winning World War II and the Cold War.

[Jacob]

As for centrism, I'm as capable of pragmatic compromise as anyone, and perhaps moreso than most, but pragmatic compromise is not an inspiring vision of the future or an end goal to work toward.

That's a pity.

[Valmy]

As for centrism, I'm as capable of pragmatic compromise as anyone, and perhaps moreso than most, but pragmatic compromise is not an inspiring vision of the future or an end goal to work toward.

That's a pity.

Which part?

[Neil]

Loving freedom and comfort didn't stop us from winning World War II and the Cold War.

And?  Those are irrelevant and small conflicts that took place in the past.  There's a future ahead of you.

[Eddie Teach]

And?  Those are irrelevant and small conflicts that took place in the past.  There's a future ahead of you.

I won't live to see it.

[fhdz]

If you're not towards us you're against us.