Should there just be one language in the world?

Started by jimmy olsen, August 25, 2011, 02:19:51 AM

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Should there just be one language in the world?

Yes, it would promote economic growth, science and peace
16 (40%)
No, it would cause mass cultural genocide
24 (60%)

Total Members Voted: 40

Monoriu

Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 12:26:41 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 11:17:21 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 25, 2011, 11:04:14 PM
I'd be surprised if even the best linguist at the State Department knows 26 alphabets.

Trendy? Given the dearth of Chinese speakers in the west I'm sure you can get yourself a great job that you're otherwise only marginally qualified for if you're fluent in it.

If you count waiting tables as great jobs, yeah, sure.  I know plenty of Chinese friends who waited tables in Vancouver  :lol:
I'm talking about American born citizens. Just look at HVC, he's got a great opportunity with a company simply because he speaks Portuguese and the company has business in Brazil. The same applies even moreso to people who speak Chinese, because so much more business is done in China.


You really don't need Chinese speaking employees to do business with China.  There are plenty of people who speak fluent English here. 

Zoupa

Quote from: Ideologue on August 25, 2011, 11:21:15 PM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 11:02:49 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on August 25, 2011, 10:50:11 PM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 09:59:58 PM


It has been developed.  It is called pinyin.  Nobody really uses it, except in teaching foreigners on pronounciation. 

The beauty of the Chinese system is that it is nigh on impossible to change the characters.  There are hundreds of dialects in China, but everybody uses the same writing system.  Great for maintaining language/national unity.

It's this sort of inflexibility that makes me think that Chinese will not become a lingua Franca even if China becomes a Superpower.  English, for all it's faults is very flexible.  New words can be added in very easily.  Nouns generally don't need genders and foreign words don't need to be modified much to be put into an English sentence.  English also lacks a great many grammatical elements found in other languages, such as admirative sentences or clusivity.  Which probably makes it easier to learn, but I suppose conveys less information.

The Chinese are very eager to learn English.  "He doesn't even know the 26 alphabets" is a popular insult.  Most Chinese do not believe that their language will become a lingua Franca, and they do not think it should be a goal.  I always laugh when I see foreigners learning Mandarin, thinking this will become trendy in the future.  Chinese have a responsibility to learn English.  Others do not have a responsibility to learn Chinese.

Well, at least you're realistic about it.  It's refreshing to see that sort of attitude.  So unlike the Quebecois.

Fermes donc ta gueule un peu, mon petit con. T'avaleras moins de mouches.

Ideologue

#107
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Zoupa


Duque de Bragança

Quote from: HVC on August 25, 2011, 02:52:10 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on August 25, 2011, 02:45:36 PM
Quote from: HVC on August 25, 2011, 02:15:36 PM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on August 25, 2011, 01:59:51 PM
Quote from: HVC on August 25, 2011, 01:24:07 PM
Quote from: Barrister on August 25, 2011, 09:53:30 AM
Quote from: HVC on August 25, 2011, 09:51:44 AM
Bilingualism is good sometimes. for example i have a job interview on Monday that I'm woefully under qualified for, but since I'm fluent in Portuguese they're giving me a shot hah

Wait until they hear your pidgin Azorean Portuguese though. :weep:
Pidgin continental Portuguese, thank you very much! Actually, my spoken portuguese is fairly good (although there are NA worlds like Drivar, which would make some one in portugal very confused)

Though, i'll be communicating with brazillian, so it doesn't help lol

:yuk: That's Azorean pidgin, sorry.
hey, i have family from nazare and lisbon here, and they use it too :P

Even if Lisboete is pretty bad, that's way worse than Lisboete since they don't use it. Same goes for Nazarese although it's not obnoxious as Lisboete. :contract:
it's just the lingo here, meu (which i a purely euro portuguese term i hate).

Anglo Canadian Azorean pidgin  :bleeding: :x  :yuk:
The mix between French Canadian and Portuguese can be funny at times, at least.
Not a great fan of "meu" either but it's always better than drivar. You do know about conduzir or guiar at least, don't you?  :hmm:

jimmy olsen

#110
Quote from: Monoriu on August 26, 2011, 01:24:52 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 12:26:41 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 11:17:21 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 25, 2011, 11:04:14 PM
I'd be surprised if even the best linguist at the State Department knows 26 alphabets.

Trendy? Given the dearth of Chinese speakers in the west I'm sure you can get yourself a great job that you're otherwise only marginally qualified for if you're fluent in it.

If you count waiting tables as great jobs, yeah, sure.  I know plenty of Chinese friends who waited tables in Vancouver  :lol:
I'm talking about American born citizens. Just look at HVC, he's got a great opportunity with a company simply because he speaks Portuguese and the company has business in Brazil. The same applies even moreso to people who speak Chinese, because so much more business is done in China.


You really don't need Chinese speaking employees to do business with China.  There are plenty of people who speak fluent English here.
Businesses and governments will always want their own representatives to speak the other language. Otherwise you're at the mercy of inaccurate and/or malicious translation.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

Monoriu

Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 02:17:00 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 26, 2011, 01:24:52 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 12:26:41 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 11:17:21 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 25, 2011, 11:04:14 PM
I'd be surprised if even the best linguist at the State Department knows 26 alphabets.

Trendy? Given the dearth of Chinese speakers in the west I'm sure you can get yourself a great job that you're otherwise only marginally qualified for if you're fluent in it.

If you count waiting tables as great jobs, yeah, sure.  I know plenty of Chinese friends who waited tables in Vancouver  :lol:
I'm talking about American born citizens. Just look at HVC, he's got a great opportunity with a company simply because he speaks Portuguese and the company has business in Brazil. The same applies even moreso to people who speak Chinese, because so much more business is done in China.


You really don't need Chinese speaking employees to do business with China.  There are plenty of people who speak fluent English here.
Businesses and governments will always want there own representatives to speak the other language. Otherwise you're at the mercy of inaccurate and/or malicious translation.

My point is, if your Chinese business/government counterparts are already speaking English with you, you don't really need your own Chinese translator. 

Eddie Teach

Quote from: Monoriu on August 26, 2011, 02:20:28 AM
My point is, if your Chinese business/government counterparts are already speaking English with you, you don't really need your own Chinese translator.

Be helpful when you overhear bits and pieces of conversation not meant for your ears.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

jimmy olsen

Quote from: Monoriu on August 26, 2011, 02:20:28 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 02:17:00 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 26, 2011, 01:24:52 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 12:26:41 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 25, 2011, 11:17:21 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 25, 2011, 11:04:14 PM
I'd be surprised if even the best linguist at the State Department knows 26 alphabets.

Trendy? Given the dearth of Chinese speakers in the west I'm sure you can get yourself a great job that you're otherwise only marginally qualified for if you're fluent in it.

If you count waiting tables as great jobs, yeah, sure.  I know plenty of Chinese friends who waited tables in Vancouver  :lol:
I'm talking about American born citizens. Just look at HVC, he's got a great opportunity with a company simply because he speaks Portuguese and the company has business in Brazil. The same applies even moreso to people who speak Chinese, because so much more business is done in China.


You really don't need Chinese speaking employees to do business with China.  There are plenty of people who speak fluent English here.
Businesses and governments will always want there own representatives to speak the other language. Otherwise you're at the mercy of inaccurate and/or malicious translation.

My point is, if your Chinese business/government counterparts are already speaking English with you, you don't really need your own Chinese translator.
There's always a lot of paperwork involved in this kind of business, you need someone who works for you that can read the English and Chinese versions and make sure they're the same.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

Josquius

Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 26, 2011, 12:27:08 AM
Quote from: Tyr on August 25, 2011, 11:29:09 PM
Hell no.
And I wish the world language wasn`t English, it`s damaging for us (culturally and educationally, not economically of course)
How?
Makes it much harder for Brits to learn foreign languages since there's no overwhelming amount of stuff in another foreign language and we don't need one to get by in the world.
Dumbs down English into being a simplistic international communication method. Destroys local dialects.
Of course the up side of the economic benefits outweigh this but still, its not all rosy.
██████
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Eddie Teach

Quote from: Tyr on August 26, 2011, 04:23:12 AM
Dumbs down English into being a simplistic international communication method.

I disagree. Native speakers continue to use dozens of words meaning the same thing and creating new slang all the time, regardless of the difficulty that creates for random foreigners with a workable knowledge of the language.

Consider this forum, for instance. When we split off from Paradox we had a heck of a lot more non-native speakers around(percentage wise as well as raw totals). Sure, the Atlanticist bent of the foreign policy discussions probably had something to do with a lot of exits, but much of the humor on the forum stems from wordplay and people who don't have a near-native understanding simply don't get it.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

The Brain

My understanding of English is positively aboriginal.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

HVC

Quote from: Duque de Bragança on August 26, 2011, 01:56:31 AM

Anglo Canadian Azorean pidgin  :bleeding: :x  :yuk:
The mix between French Canadian and Portuguese can be funny at times, at least.
Not a great fan of "meu" either but it's always better than drivar. You do know about conduzir or guiar at least, don't you?  :hmm:
yes, i use guiar because conduzir sounds weird to me. I also use estacionar instead of parkar :lol:
Being lazy is bad; unless you still get what you want, then it's called "patience".
Hubris must be punished. Severely.

Duque de Bragança

Quote from: HVC on August 26, 2011, 05:40:58 AM
Quote from: Duque de Bragança on August 26, 2011, 01:56:31 AM

Anglo Canadian Azorean pidgin  :bleeding: :x  :yuk:
The mix between French Canadian and Portuguese can be funny at times, at least.
Not a great fan of "meu" either but it's always better than drivar. You do know about conduzir or guiar at least, don't you?  :hmm:
yes, i use guiar because conduzir sounds weird to me. I also use estacionar instead of parkar :lol:

There is hope, or at least a light in the darkness...

viper37

Quote from: Valmy on August 25, 2011, 09:35:56 AM
Not too good.  But nobody is wanting to create one people through legislation and force.
Historically, you haven't been able to achieve one people/one language without either of it.
Modern French was developped when France decided everyone should speak the same French.  It's what was used in official communication, what was taught in schools.
People born in Quebec in the early 20th century had a slightly different dialect depending on where they were born.  IIRC, only through the 1960s was education made uniform from one corner of the province to the other (slight differences in pronounciation remain for some).

Quote
I think there will be one common way of communication just because we all are going to be communicating alot and therefore such a thing is needed.  Where there is a need humans fill that need.
Well, humans are what... 10-12 000 years old since the first civilizations?
We certainly have reduced the number of languages & dialects over the years.
But as soon as an empire crumbled, people in the area reverted to their old dialects mixed with the new language.  From German & French emerged English.  From Latin came Italian, Spanish, Portuguese and French (not counting Occitan and Basque language and a few others maybe).

For all the similarities and the exchanges between Germany (well, the states forming what is now Germany), the Dutch and the English, these 3 languages haven't merged over the years. Yet, they are close by, geographically speaking, and they have had significant cultural and economical exchanges over the last 500 years.  I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe these 3 languages are coming closer.

I've read an article some years ago stating that American blacks were moving toward their own distinct dialect of english.  Sometimes, hearing Southerners or Texans speak on tv, I wonder if you truly speak the same english.

I don't see a unique language for everyone without some kind of coercitive measures.

Quote
I mean I am just saying what I think will be so in the future.  I do not mean to say it wil be a wholley positive good or that any steps need to be taken to get there.  Just that it will happen.  Heck people are moving to protect local languages...what are they protecting them from?
Language is the basis of the identity for a nation.  Figure it as an individual.  You are Valmy.  You are not Yi.  You could all be Yi.  We could all be Yi.  Would that make things easier?  Probably?  Would you become Yi voluntarily?  Probably not.  You have had signification interaction with Yi over the years.  Yet you are not moving closer to one another, you have your own differences.

It is the same with a nation.  Each one has their differences, for better or for worst.
The same way you protect your own difference, your own individuality, other people protect their cultural identity.  If you speak French in Flanders, no one will talk to you until you make it clear you are neither French nor Belgian.  They feel threatened by assimilation, by losing their collective identity, wich is also a part of their individuality.

I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

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