What was the best combat rifle ever in it's time?

Started by Strix, April 10, 2009, 02:21:58 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

What was the best combat rifle ever?

AK-47
M16
LEE-ENFIELD SMLE
M1 GARAND
FN FAL
MAUSER K98k CARBINE
STEYR AUG
1903 SPRINGFIELD
STURMGEWEHR 44
M14
The one between Jaron's legs
Print
Go Down Pages1 2 3 4
User actions

Strix

April 10, 2009, 02:21:58 PM
I saw a show on this recently and was curious as to what people thought here.  -_-
"I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left." - Margaret Thatcher

Caliga

#1
April 10, 2009, 02:28:37 PM
When the question is "in it's time" specifically, I go with the StG-44, without which there would be no AK-47.
0 Ed Anger Disapproval Points

Syt

#2
April 10, 2009, 02:29:33 PM
Quote from: Strix on April 10, 2009, 02:21:58 PM
I saw a show on this recently and was curious as to what people thought here.  -_-

Discovery's "The Ultimate [weapon]" series? I like those. High :nerd: -factor on that show.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Syt

#3
April 10, 2009, 02:31:01 PM
I'd guess AK-47, though, good enough to be in production for deacdes.

Aesthetically, I prefer the Austrian AUG, though.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein's brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops.
—Stephen Jay Gould

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

jimmy olsen

#4
April 10, 2009, 02:34:36 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 10, 2009, 02:28:37 PM
When the question is "in it's time" specifically, I go with the StG-44, without which there would be no AK-47.
Same, it was a weapon ahead of its time.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

derspiess

#5
April 10, 2009, 02:35:29 PM
On an individual basis, I would have to rate the StG44 as the best.  It wasn't made in high enough numbers for them to make it a game-changer in the war, but the influence it had is very obvious (and I don't buy the BS about the AK47 not being derived from it in any way).

The entire idea of a selective-fire, more compact rifle with high capacity magazine, firing a shorter cartridge with about the same accuracy and effectiveness at practical ranges was more revolutionary than any of the other choices.

I'd kill to have one in my collection.  Sadly, most of the surplus ended up being sent over to Africa to arm communist movements/regimes in the 50s & 60s :(
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Caliga

#6
April 10, 2009, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 10, 2009, 02:35:29 PM
On an individual basis, I would have to rate the StG44 as the best.  It wasn't made in high enough numbers for them to make it a game-changer in the war, but the influence it had is very obvious (and I don't buy the BS about the AK47 not being derived from it in any way).

The entire idea of a selective-fire, more compact rifle with high capacity magazine, firing a shorter cartridge with about the same accuracy and effectiveness at practical ranges was more revolutionary than any of the other choices.

I'd kill to have one in my collection.  Sadly, most of the surplus ended up being sent over to Africa to arm communist movements/regimes in the 50s & 60s :(

I've never heard anyone insist the AK-47 isn't based on the StG-44.  On the contrary, I swear I've read Kalashnikov plainly admitted the StG-44 was the design inspiration.  Didn't Red Army soldiers used to fight over captured StG-44's because they were so superior to any rifles in the Soviet arsenal? :blink:

If you want an StG-44 badly enough, you might try searching YouTube for vids of guys firing them (I've seen folks who were clearly Americans, judging by accent, firing them) and email them to see where they got theirs.
0 Ed Anger Disapproval Points

Norgy

#7
April 10, 2009, 02:41:56 PM
For sheer influence and mass use, there'd be no contest - the AK-47 is present everywhere where there's an armed conflict. And boy soldiers in Africa are known as Kalash in some dialects. But that's not the question, so I'd go for either the Mauser K98 or the StG44. The latter for innovation and ingenuity, the former for reliability and up 1 km precision with a scope.

Admiral Yi

#8
April 10, 2009, 02:44:09 PM
My old Spanish teacher's husband works for Colt and met Komrade Kalashnikov.  I asked him (the husband) the question about copying the STG44 and the answer he gave me was that the round and the concept were lifted but the internal design was original.

On topic: AK.  Changed history.

Mr.Penguin

#9
April 10, 2009, 02:44:22 PM
The Stg-44 was produced and use in both east- Germany and Yoguslavia after the war. I think some of the ex-Yoguslavian states still produce the ammo...
Real men drag their Guns into position

Spell check is for losers

derspiess

#10
April 10, 2009, 02:47:53 PM
Quote from: Caliga on April 10, 2009, 02:38:54 PM

I've never heard anyone insist the AK-47 isn't based on the StG-44. 

Consider yourself lucky.  Go check out some gun collector forums if you want to experience some true fanboy weirdness.

I think a lot of Russians deny it as well, due to national pride.

Quote
On the contrary, I swear I've read Kalashnikov plainly admitted the StG-44 was the design inspiration. 

Haven't heard that, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear him contradict himself.  He's a colorful character.

QuoteDidn't Red Army soldiers used to fight over captured StG-44's because they were so superior to any rifles in the Soviet arsenal? :blink:

Yeah, but they lusted after practically every piece of captured German weaponry they could get their hands on.

Conversely, Krauts had an affinity for the SVT-40 rifle as well as the PPSh41.

QuoteIf you want an StG-44 badly enough, you might try searching YouTube for vids of guys firing them (I've seen folks who were clearly Americans, judging by accent, firing them) and email them to see where they got theirs.

I suppose I should have specified that I would kill to have one in my collection at a reasonable price :P
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Mr.Penguin

#11
April 10, 2009, 02:51:44 PM


East- German troops on parade in the 1950's, with StG-44 and M-54 helmet (copy of a late WW2 german Helmet, that didnt enter production)...
Real men drag their Guns into position

Spell check is for losers

Valmy

#12
April 10, 2009, 02:54:21 PM
The AK-47 is unmatched in history for its ubiquity and durability.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Caliga

#13
April 10, 2009, 02:55:03 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 10, 2009, 02:47:53 PMI suppose I should have specified that I would kill to have one in my collection at a reasonable price :P

This gives me an idea. Muhahahaha.  :menace:
0 Ed Anger Disapproval Points

derspiess

#14
April 10, 2009, 02:58:18 PM
Quote from: Mr.Penguin on April 10, 2009, 02:44:22 PM
The Stg-44 was produced and use in both east- Germany and Yoguslavia after the war. I think some of the ex-Yoguslavian states still produce the ammo...

I'd be surprised if they continued production after the war.  I know they were used fairly extensively.

I'm sure they're still making 7.92x57 in ex-Yugoslavia, but do you think they would still be making 7.92 x33?? I can't imagine enough StG44's being functional enough to warrant continued production.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall
Print
Go Up Pages1 2 3 4
User actions