UK-Israel relations hit the rocks over Dubai assanation

Started by jimmy olsen, February 17, 2010, 08:16:28 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Barrister

That was my take on it - the Brits are pissed because that is how they are supposed to react, but they darn well know that it happens, and likely know that British agents have used forged papers of other countries at varies times.
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

Neil

Wait a minute?  Are we not supposed to say Chinaman anymore when referring to Chinese people?
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Ed Anger

Quote from: Neil on February 18, 2010, 07:36:02 PM
Wait a minute?  Are we not supposed to say Chinaman anymore when referring to Chinese people?

Chinaman girls.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

Viking

First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

Viking

Quote from: Martinus on February 18, 2010, 11:23:09 AMIn Polish for example, the word for "Jews" and "Israelis" is the same.

This explains a lot.
First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

grumbler

Quote from: Agelastus on February 18, 2010, 06:50:40 PM
The operation could have gone worse (if, say, the target had been suspicious or aware enough to shoot), but its difficult to see how they could have carried it out more sloppily except by failing to kill the guy.
I suspect your difficulty comes from ignorance.  If you actually knew anything about the topic, you could probably imagine many ways in which they could have carried it out more sloppily.

Don't feel bad about it - I don't know much about the topic, either.  However, I don't base any argument on the fact that I am too ignorant to imagine much in this scenario, and that would probably be a wise policy for you as well.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

grumbler

Quote from: Viking on February 18, 2010, 08:05:47 PM
Quote from: Martinus on February 18, 2010, 11:23:09 AMIn Polish for example, the word for "Jews" and "Israelis" is the same.

This explains a lot.
Yeah, it also means "subhuman," "devil-worshiper," "murderer of Christ," and "drinker of Christian children's blood."

When you have a language with a total vocabulary of only forty words (plus six grunts that carry specific meanings) you have to make each one go a long way.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

Ed Anger

Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

katmai

Quote from: grumbler on February 18, 2010, 08:12:24 PM
Quote from: Viking on February 18, 2010, 08:05:47 PM
Quote from: Martinus on February 18, 2010, 11:23:09 AMIn Polish for example, the word for "Jews" and "Israelis" is the same.

This explains a lot.
Yeah, it also means "subhuman," "devil-worshiper," "murderer of Christ," and "drinker of Christian children's blood."

When you have a language with a total vocabulary of only forty words (plus six grunts that carry specific meanings) you have to make each one go a long way.
Silly grumbler, you are talking to a Icelander, the last culture that needs an explanation on limited vocab.
Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son

Viking

Quote from: katmai on February 18, 2010, 08:14:53 PM
Silly grumbler, you are talking to a Icelander, the last culture that needs an explanation on limited vocab.

Silly katmai, you assume I read his posts.
First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

katmai

Quote from: Viking on February 18, 2010, 08:15:42 PM
Quote from: katmai on February 18, 2010, 08:14:53 PM
Silly grumbler, you are talking to a Icelander, the last culture that needs an explanation on limited vocab.

Silly katmai, you assume I read his posts.

Doh!

Forgot about that.
Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son

Agelastus

Quote from: grumbler on February 18, 2010, 08:07:06 PM
I suspect your difficulty comes from ignorance.  If you actually knew anything about the topic, you could probably imagine many ways in which they could have carried it out more sloppily.

Don't feel bad about it - I don't know much about the topic, either.  However, I don't base any argument on the fact that I am too ignorant to imagine much in this scenario, and that would probably be a wise policy for you as well.

Well, no, I doubt either of us are experts. However, we both have imaginations, we are both reasonably well read, and we are operating with a limited number of ways things could have gone worse if we stick with the way the Israelis seem to have planned it.

I could imagine many ways they could have carried it out more sloppily, but only if I go back to square one and plan the assassination to take place in a different location or by a different method. Even on the assumption that even the Israelis try to avoid mass murder (by blowing up the plane he was on, for example) I can come up with a worse scenario. For example, if they tried to eliminate him with a bomb, that blew up an innocent chamber maid by accident. Or a shooting attempt at a public cafe which hits bystanders and not the target. Or if they do try a shooting, the weapons are intercepted when they enter the country and the operation is rolled up from there.

Once they've picked the location and method they have, there's only one way I can see that it could have gone worse - if the target had been alert enough to put up sufficient of a struggle to compromise their physical escape, perhaps by injuring one of them sufficently that it caused suspicion on their exit, or by making a noise that raised the alarm. It's possible that prematurely alerted authorities might intercept them on the way out of the country even if nothing different happens in the room (if the body is discovered early, perhaps) but that seems fairly unlikely given how quickly they would have arranged to exit the country.

I am curious as to what happened to his bodyguards; I would have assumed he would have some given his position, unless he was trying to travel "under the radar."
"Come grow old with me
The Best is yet to be
The last of life for which the first was made."

Neil

Quote from: katmai on February 18, 2010, 08:14:53 PM
Quote from: grumbler on February 18, 2010, 08:12:24 PM
Quote from: Viking on February 18, 2010, 08:05:47 PM
Quote from: Martinus on February 18, 2010, 11:23:09 AMIn Polish for example, the word for "Jews" and "Israelis" is the same.

This explains a lot.
Yeah, it also means "subhuman," "devil-worshiper," "murderer of Christ," and "drinker of Christian children's blood."

When you have a language with a total vocabulary of only forty words (plus six grunts that carry specific meanings) you have to make each one go a long way.
Silly grumbler, you are talking to a Icelander, the last culture that needs an explanation on limited vocab.
Absolutist is an Icelander.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Razgovory

I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Viking

First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.