Dems impatient; want second stimulus

[Valmy]

that Congress and the President have very little ability to improve the economy

I bet if they set taxes to zero the economy would improve.

I don't get how they have very little ability to improve the economy.  It seems to me they have plenty of power to do so.

It is just that economics is so complex it is very difficult to know just what to do to improve it.

[Caliga]

I bet if they set taxes to zero the economy would improve.

Ok I stand corrected.  If Congress did stuff that we all know there's a snowball's chance in hell of them ever doing, they might be able to improve the economy.

[Valmy]

Ok I stand corrected.  If Congress did stuff that we all know there's a snowball's chance in hell of them ever doing, they might be able to improve the economy.

I was making a ridiculous example to make a point.

The way they are going about trying to turn the economy around, by passing big pork bills on deficit money, is indeed unlikely to turn the economy around but could make it worse you are right on that one.

[Darth Wagtaros]

it's really simple in fact: there is nothing you can do on the short term.

This.

The root of the problem is that Congress and the President have very little ability to improve the economy (though they can certainly make it worse), but for some reason people think they can.  Because of this, Congressmen can't just do nothing... they have to pretend what the people think is correct if they want to be reelected.

You are right as far as The Government being expected to take care of the economy.  To some extent its expected that if the economy is toast the 'throw the bums out' thing gets some traction.  But at some point the Feds were made the guarantors of financial prosperity.

[Valmy]

But at some point the Feds were made the guarantors of financial prosperity.

Yeah they have kinda sucked at that the past 20 years.  They love to pump up economic bubbles.

[Vince]

The root of the problem is that Congress and the President have very little ability to improve the economy (though they can certainly make it worse), but for some reason people think they can.  Because of this, Congressmen can't just do nothing... they have to pretend what the people think is correct if they want to be reelected.

What about all of the appointees that the President makes to all of the regulatory committees like the Federal Reserve and the SEC?  I would think that would give the President the ability to influence the economy good or bad based on who they put into those positions and what regulations they enact.

[Caliga]

What about all of the appointees that the President makes to all of the regulatory committees like the Federal Reserve and the SEC?  I would think that would give the President the ability to influence the economy good or bad based on who they put into those positions and what regulations they enact.

I think that all you need to do is look at the Madoff case and how well his outfit was regulated to see how effective the SEC is lately.

In years past I thought that the (Greenspan-chaired) Fed was OSSUM, but I'm not so sure anymore.

[Razgovory]

I bet if they set taxes to zero the economy would improve.

Probably not.  You'd have to lay off alot of people.

[crazy canuck]

Probably not.  You'd have to lay off alot of people.

Only in a world where the US government worries about deficit spending but in this brave new world where endless money can be printed to pay for government programs why should there be any taxation.

[Valmy]

Only in a world where the US government worries about deficit spending but in this brave new world where endless money can be printed to pay for government programs why should there be any taxation.

CC for President!

[Darth Wagtaros]

But at some point the Feds were made the guarantors of financial prosperity.

Yeah they have kinda sucked at that the past 20 years.  They love to pump up economic bubbles.

Which is exactly what the Pres and Congress have wanted.  The economy has to run great while they are in office, not ten years down the line. 

[DGuller]

I think that all you need to do is look at the Madoff case and how well his outfit was regulated to see how effective the SEC is lately.

Isn't that exactly the point?  If you appoint the regulators who are against regulation, then the regulatory bodies they'd be heading wouldn't be very effective at regulating.

[Admiral Yi]

Isn't that exactly the point?  If you appoint the regulators who are against regulation, then the regulatory bodies they'd be heading wouldn't be very effective at regulating.

What's not entirely clear to me is whether or not Madoff was within the SEC's purview.  Hedge funds were intended to be minimally regulated investment vehicles for wealthy, financially saavy clients.  Isn't fraud of this type the responsibility of the local DA?

[Caliga]

Isn't that exactly the point?  If you appoint the regulators who are against regulation, then the regulatory bodies they'd be heading wouldn't be very effective at regulating.

What's not entirely clear to me is whether or not Madoff was within the SEC's purview.  Hedge funds were intended to be minimally regulated investment vehicles for wealthy, financially saavy clients.  Isn't fraud of this type the responsibility of the local DA?

If he wasn't within the SEC's purview, then why did the SEC repeatedly "look into" his firm?  IIRC they did so at least once back when that Markopolous dude first ratted him out... they just did a terrible job and found nothing.

[alfred russel]

Isn't that exactly the point?  If you appoint the regulators who are against regulation, then the regulatory bodies they'd be heading wouldn't be very effective at regulating.

What's not entirely clear to me is whether or not Madoff was within the SEC's purview.  Hedge funds were intended to be minimally regulated investment vehicles for wealthy, financially saavy clients.  Isn't fraud of this type the responsibility of the local DA?

The SEC isn't responsible for direct oversight as with mutual funds and publically traded companies, but they are responsible for investigating securities fraud once it comes to their attention (and it did).