What does a TRUMP presidency look like?

[Valmy]

If I understand D'Souza's argument correctly, blacks have been re-enslaved by the Democrats and put into a "Federal Plantation".  Unfortunately blacks are too stupid, lazy, and malicious to do anything about it.

D'Souza is correct that many Klansmen were Democrats (as were many Republicans in 1920's).  He is incorrect to say that the Democratic party founded it.  D'souza is really big on saying that minorities shouldn't be forgive Democrats for stuff that happened 150 years ago.  He is hasn't said much about how the Republican party essentially made it illegal for non-whites to immigrate to the US from 1875-1940.  This is puzzling since we wouldn't have been able to immigrate to the US were it not for the Democrats removing these restrictions.

I'm curious - do you have a source that says many Republicans in the 1920s were KKK members?  It seems odd to me that just 60 years removed from the Civil War that the GOP would embrace racism in that way, but I could be wrong.

And I do feel obliged to point out that the 1965 immigration reform bill passed with bipartisan support.  In fact a greater proportion of Republicans voted for it than did Democrats.

It is more complicated than that. Traditionally the Republicans were the nativist party and the Democrats were the immigrant party IN THE NORTH. This is because the No-Nothings were one of the founding parties that came together to form the Republican Party to begin with.

So who is doing what for whom is really messy. The Democrats and Republicans are juggling completely dissonant goals all across the country. So you the anti-Catholic KKK being associated with the Democrats when in the north the Catholic immigrants are the backbone of the Democratic Party. The Democrats are leading labor movements that are courting black migrants in the north while enforcing segregation and Jim Crow in the south. The Republicans are the party of the establishment in the north, very conservative and austere. While in the South they are populist insurgents.

So yes the Republicans and Democrats were both fantastically racist and xenophobic, or heroically fighting racism and xenophobia, at the same time for decades. So yeah where the KKK was pushing for anti-immigration and conservative values and pushing for things like prohibition they had some appeal among the Northern Republican Base. But it should be pointed out this was only for a short time during the big KKK wave in the 1910s and 1920s and 1930s.

[Valmy]

That is not exactly new. The Democrats = Traitors who are not entirely American has been there thing basically since the founding the party. Naturally how accurate that is varies with time

It has happened before, yes -  but not as a continuous feature.  And if those previous moments are anything to go by, the kind of polarization we are witnessing does not bode well for the future.

Well I mean this was what we had during the Gilded Age, waving the bloody shirt and all that and pretty much what we had going during the Cold War...which kind of covers most of post Civil War American history.

The difference is that the propaganda machines are now backed by a fully armed and operational internet. Eventually I think people will burn themselves out on it.

[Oexmelin]

and pretty much what we had going during the Cold War...which kind of covers most of post Civil War American history.

The difference is that the propaganda machines are now backed by a fully armed and operational internet. Eventually I think people will burn themselves out on it.

I disagree: you flatten considerable differences, including ebbs and flows, upon a long period of time. The Red Scare was certainly a spike - but it eventually led to a backlash, because there was a corresponding need, within the US State, to emphasize disagreement and dissent as a distinguishing feature from the Soviet Union. I encourage you to watch and listen to actual Cold War propaganda: it was directed by Washington, and against an outside enemy, and thus required to preserve a robust sense of "Us" capacious enough to include political opponents.

And yes, there was in the past, quite nasty political cartoons and vicious attacks against opponents. It never could be as relentless as it can be now. And I see nothing in the current climate, or in the past, that leads me to believe that people will be "burn out" from it. I only see increased normalization of what was once aberrant.

[Oexmelin]

If I understand D'Souza's argument correctly

There is not much to understand. It's coarse political brand management, based on vilifying opposition, mixed with a healthy dose of conspiracy theory ("this knowledge is being actively suppressed by the violent-far-left-cultural-Marxist-establishement of academia!). In shot, it's the perfect product for the current incarnation of the conservative movement. 

[DGuller]

I don't think it's going to be better until we get a credible foreign enemy.  In a way Trump's sabotage of the US standing in the world may in the end bring the country out of the cold civil war.

[Valmy]

Lincoln Day Dinner at Mar-A-Lago.

I am just glad they still like Lincoln.

[Razgovory]

I'm curious - do you have a source that says many Republicans in the 1920s were KKK members?  It seems odd to me that just 60 years removed from the Civil War that the GOP would embrace racism in that way, but I could be wrong.

And I do feel obliged to point out that the 1965 immigration reform bill passed with bipartisan support.  In fact a greater proportion of Republicans voted for it than did Democrats.

Yes.  The original Klan was one of several insurgent groups operating in the South during Reconstruction.  Others included the White League and the Red Shirts.  The existence of these groups led to the creation of the Department of Justice which was fairly successful in suppressing them.  In 1915 two events led to the refoundation of the Klan.  The lynching of Leo Frank and the making of the film "A Birth of a Nation".  This one was more of a fraternal organization devoted to the preservation of a Protestant America.  It was anti-catholic, anti-immigrant, anti-socialist, antisemitic and pro-temperance.  It quickly grew to over six million members was probably one of the largest conservative groups in the country at it's peak.

In the North the Klan was active in Republican politics in states like Maine, Illinois, Indiana (Where it help elect governors in those states) and Western states like Oregon (where they supported Congressman Albert Johnson).  In Indiana the most powerful political boss was Grand Dragon D.C. Stephenson.  He would eventually lead the to the downfall of the Klan across the United States.  In 1925 Stephenson kidnapped, raped, married and murdered a woman over the course of a weekend.  He threaten the governor, a man he had helped to elect, that if was wasn't granted a pardon he would reveal the extent of the Klan's control in the State.  The Governor refused and Stephenson released his records.  The result was a national scandal and the Klan pretty much collapsed.

Cause I'm feeling lazy I'm just going to use Wikipedia sources today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D._C._Stephenson

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan_in_Maine

And here is one that might interest you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan_in_Canada

[Grinning_Colossus]

A nothingburger after all

Mueller finds no Trump-Russia conspiracy

Robert Mueller's nearly two-year-long Russia probe concluded without finding adequate evidence to show that officials with Donald Trump's presidential 2016 campaign aided Russian attempts to interfere with the election.

"The investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities," the special counsel wrote in his findings, which Attorney General William Barr released on Sunday in four-page summary form.

Mueller's long-awaited findings also do not take a clear position on whether Trump obstructed justice, a gray-area conclusion that leaves the door wide open for an already-heated debate in Congress over whether Democrats should even consider impeachment proceedings against the president.

"For each of the relevant actions investigated, the report sets out evidence on both sides of the question and leave unresolved what the special counsel views as 'difficult issues' of law and fact concerning whether the President's actions and intent could be viewed as obstruction," Barr wrote in a letter to the key House and Senate committees.

"The Special Counsel states that 'while this report does not conclude that the President committed a crime, it also does not exonerate him,'" Barr added.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/24/breaking-news-barr-to-release-summary-of-mueller-report-1233771

[Syt]

""For each of the relevant actions investigated, the report sets out evidence on both sides of the question and leave unresolved what the special counsel views as 'difficult issues' of law and fact concerning whether the President's actions and intent could be viewed as obstruction," Barr wrote in a letter to the key House and Senate committees."

So basically, "Here's the facts, you do with them what you will."

[Valmy]

A nothingburger after all

I don't think so. Look I never thought Trump was an actual Russian agent but it seems clear to me that Russia is attempting to subvert our system and we need to be vigilant.

[Berkut]

Other than the sitting Presidents Campaign Manager and National Security Advisor going to prison on felony charges, and 21 other indictments, nothing there at all!

[Valmy]

Other than the sitting Presidents Campaign Manager and National Security Advisor going to prison on felony charges, and 21 other indictments, nothing there at all!

I mean, yeah. The investigation clearly had some results. I hope it does not end there. Russian shenanigans needs to be brought under control.

[jimmy olsen]

So basically, "Here's the facts, you do with them what you will."

That was always what it was going to be no matter the evidence collected. DOJ policy is not to indict the president. It was always going to be left to the politicians.

[Valmy]

I just want to note with a slightly resigned sigh that my taxes actually went up with the new tax bill. Thanks Trump I mean if I am going to pay more taxes can't we at least shrink the freaking deficit instead of growing it? I would at least pay my higher taxes with a smile then.

[viper37]

I just want to note with a slightly resigned sigh that my taxes actually went up with the new tax bill. Thanks Trump I mean if I am going to pay more taxes can't we at least shrink the freaking deficit instead of growing it? I would at least pay my higher taxes with a smile then.

I thought it was a change in how taxes were perceived, yet the overall amount was supposed to be smaller than last year?  I read something about it in either the NYT or the WP...