WW2 Weapons Platforms: What accomplished the most with the least?

Started by CountDeMoney, July 03, 2009, 06:47:22 PM

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KRonn

Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
Nobody liked my escort carrier suggestion?
Hmm... that is probably a decent idea, now that I think about it. Those carriers were cheap, easily built or adapted on to other hulls. Small and just carried a few aircraft but that was enough for patrols alongside convoys, or to provide air support for ground troops during island invasions, or what ever. And many of carriers were easily/quickly produced.

Viking

First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

Razgovory

Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
Nobody liked my escort carrier suggestion?

While good for morale developing specially designed vehicles for the transport of prostitutes is probably wasteful.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

dps

Quote from: Norgy on July 06, 2009, 11:41:51 PM
NOT AMUSED! DOGS ARE PEOPLE TOO!

Uh, it's not a joke, Norgy.  The Soviets actually did use mine dogs.  Or tried them, at least.

jimmy olsen

Quote from: Razgovory on July 07, 2009, 12:57:56 PM
Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
Nobody liked my escort carrier suggestion?

While good for morale developing specially designed vehicles for the transport of prostitutes is probably wasteful.
Nice :lol:
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

Viking

First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

KRonn

Quote from: Viking on July 07, 2009, 12:43:06 PM
liberty ships?
Oh yeah, Liberty ships were a huge factor! They certainly could do a lot with the least - very cheaply and quickly built. Shipyards had contests on building them in record time. A few days or so in many cases. Used pre-fab parts. Astonished the allies with the speed of building and how important a factor it was to obtain all that shipping space, let alone the axis who could only look on in disappointment. Those huge numbers of ships meant that much more war material getting to the fronts.

Razgovory

That's a well trained dog to just stand there in a glass case all day.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

derspiess

Quote from: Admiral Yi on July 04, 2009, 03:28:25 PM
Pz III variants.  Conquered France and half of Russia with a 50 mm gun.  No points for beating up the Brits in North Africa.

The Pzkw III's in the 1940 France campaign had 37mm guns :nerd:
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Admiral Yi

Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
Nobody liked my escort carrier suggestion?
Not all that much.  I have yet to read anything that suggests that close air support was as important a factor in the Pacific as it was in Europe.

Admiral Yi

Quote from: derspiess on July 07, 2009, 01:41:03 PM
The Pzkw III's in the 1940 France campaign had 37mm guns :nerd:
Not if you amass enough victory points in the Polish campaign to upgrade.:nerd:

grumbler

Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
Nobody liked my escort carrier suggestion?
They are not a bad suggestion, though the Brits had a lot less luck with them in their primary role (convoy escort) than the US did in the Pacific.

I think it pretty easy to overestimate their effectiveness, though; after building half a dozen on an oiler hull, the US decided that building the ships as oilers was the better option.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

grumbler

Quote from: KRonn on July 07, 2009, 01:05:14 PM
Oh yeah, Liberty ships were a huge factor! They certainly could do a lot with the least - very cheaply and quickly built. Shipyards had contests on building them in record time. A few days or so in many cases. Used pre-fab parts. Astonished the allies with the speed of building and how important a factor it was to obtain all that shipping space, let alone the axis who could only look on in disappointment. Those huge numbers of ships meant that much more war material getting to the fronts.
Disagree that Liberty ships were ships with "the least."  They were not cheap (in fact, they were more expensive on a tonnage basis than standard ships) and their sole real edge was that they could be made quickly.  Other than that, they were just slow, medium-sized freighters remarkable for numbers more than capabilities.

Had the Victory design been adopted instead (as it later was), then maybe an argument could be made.  As it was, I think the LST design was more important among the "less capable" ship designs than was the Liberty ship (and would note for our Anglophiles that both were British conceptions).
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

Razgovory

Quote from: derspiess on July 07, 2009, 01:41:03 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on July 04, 2009, 03:28:25 PM
Pz III variants.  Conquered France and half of Russia with a 50 mm gun.  No points for beating up the Brits in North Africa.

The Pzkw III's in the 1940 France campaign had 37mm guns :nerd:

I totally beat you to it.  Alot of them used the old 37s in Russia as well.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Razgovory

Quote from: grumbler on July 07, 2009, 02:32:47 PM
Quote from: KRonn on July 07, 2009, 01:05:14 PM
Oh yeah, Liberty ships were a huge factor! They certainly could do a lot with the least - very cheaply and quickly built. Shipyards had contests on building them in record time. A few days or so in many cases. Used pre-fab parts. Astonished the allies with the speed of building and how important a factor it was to obtain all that shipping space, let alone the axis who could only look on in disappointment. Those huge numbers of ships meant that much more war material getting to the fronts.
Disagree that Liberty ships were ships with "the least."  They were not cheap (in fact, they were more expensive on a tonnage basis than standard ships) and their sole real edge was that they could be made quickly.  Other than that, they were just slow, medium-sized freighters remarkable for numbers more than capabilities.

Had the Victory design been adopted instead (as it later was), then maybe an argument could be made.  As it was, I think the LST design was more important among the "less capable" ship designs than was the Liberty ship (and would note for our Anglophiles that both were British conceptions).

They were remarkable in that they had a very short expected life.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017