Stuck In Your Parents’ Basement? Don’t Blame The Economy

[Berkut]

FWIW,the data in the OP seems to apply for the US generally, and not just a small handful of hotspots (clearly experiencing a bubble  ).

However, I do think there's a lot more opportunities in general for a higher quality of life to people who are willing to move around.

Perhaps in the US given your numerous cities.  But in Canada the problem is pretty significant since there are really only two cities where there are reasonably good prospects for young professionals and land prices in those two cities are now unaffordable for most. 

indeed - I heard the same a lot in the UK, where the prices in London are much more of an issue, since it is a smaller country and hence the concentration of professional jobs is much more felt.

I don't think the US is remotely similar in this case. The fact that it is crazy expensive to live in NYC and SF and DC is a problem if you want to live in those places, but that is YOUR problem, or maybe those locations problem if they want those people living there anyway.

It has nothing really to do with the problem the general problem that even outside those places, it is hard for young professionals to afford the same kind of homes they used to be able to afford (assuming that is true, which it seems like is the case).

[The Minsky Moment]

In a sense I agree that NYC's housing cost problem or SF Bay's housing costs problems are the problems of those areas, not the nation as a whole.  But then you add in DC, Boston, LA/SD/Socal, and now you are starting to talk about a very significant % of the population of the US.

[garbon]

In a sense I agree that NYC's housing cost problem or SF Bay's housing costs problems are the problems of those areas, not the nation as a whole.  But then you add in DC, Boston, LA/SD/Socal, and now you are starting to talk about a very significant % of the population of the US.

Yeah just did a quick sum of those cities (+area for Bay Area) and that's 21 million people or so. That's a pretty large chunk of citizens in the US.

[Jacob]

In a sense I agree that NYC's housing cost problem or SF Bay's housing costs problems are the problems of those areas, not the nation as a whole.  But then you add in DC, Boston, LA/SD/Socal, and now you are starting to talk about a very significant % of the population of the US.

Yeah just did a quick sum of those cities (+area for Bay Area) and that's 21 million people or so. That's a pretty large chunk of citizens in the US.

Googling, I get 7M for SF, 6M for DC, 20M for NYC, 4.5M for Boston, and 18.5 for LA (all metro areas). That's a total of 56 million.

[garbon]

In a sense I agree that NYC's housing cost problem or SF Bay's housing costs problems are the problems of those areas, not the nation as a whole.  But then you add in DC, Boston, LA/SD/Socal, and now you are starting to talk about a very significant % of the population of the US.

Yeah just did a quick sum of those cities (+area for Bay Area) and that's 21 million people or so. That's a pretty large chunk of citizens in the US.

Googling, I get 7M for SF, 6M for DC, 20M for NYC, 4.5M for Boston, and 18.5 for LA (all metro areas). That's a total of 56 million.

Yeah I didn't count all metro areas, just cities (apart from Bay area as SF itself is small). But yeah throw in metro areas and that is a rather large chunk of US population. Nothing to be sniffed at.

[Berkut]

But if you are going to expand to metro areas, then you also dilute the problem - if you want to talk about the LA area, or the Boston area, you can certainly find housing in those "areas" that are a tiny fraction of the crazy costs associated with Manhattan and the actual city of San Francisco, or the desirable parts of Boston or San Diego.

You can find an apartment in the LA area, for example, that is 1/3rd the cost of the cheapest Manhattan apartment, and hence you are no longer talking about the crazy costs of living in Manhattan, and is likely much more comparable to the cost of an apartment in Kansas City.

[garbon]

likely much more comparable to the cost of an apartment in Kansas City.

That seems like a rather big stretch but then I don't know much about pricing in KC. Jersey City is cheaper than Manhattan but it is still rather expensive but you've removed it from the problem/equation if you only include NYC proper.

[The Minsky Moment]

Housing costs are definitely a metro area problem in NY, including Brooklyn, much of Long Island, much of Westchester and the Jersey/CT burbs.  It is possible to find some close in areas that are sort of affordable, as long as you are OK with a lousy public school system.

Boston is pretty similar at this point - house prices in the burbs are very elevated until you start getting out to Worcester.  There are some exceptions of course again where the school system has problems. 

So yes you can find some reasonably priced housing here and there if you either accept subpar schools, shell out for private school or don't procreate.

[DGuller]

I think metro areas are much more relevant, as that is really the economic unit.  Yes, there is heterogeneity there, but it is everywhere.  It goes without saying that "all else being equal" applies to all comparisons.

[garbon]

There are some exceptions of course again where the school system has problems. 

So yes you can find some reasonably priced housing here and there if you either accept subpar schools, shell out for private school or don't procreate.

Hey, I survived a subpar school!

[MadImmortalMan]

Rochester/Buffalo seems to be one of the very few places in the US where wages are growing compared to home values. 

[Camerus]

Heh. I'm from Toronto originally and went to university at the U of T, and after graduating have lived in Montreal, Ottawa and Edmonton  (not to mention abroad). I have a home in Edmonton, the likes of which I would not be able to afford as easily in Toronto and a pretty decent standard of living here. Anecdotally I can say there are a lot of other educated folks I've met from elsewhere in Canada doing well here, even after the oil drop. So it definitely can be done if you're willing to think outside the Toronto / Vancouver box.

Hell Camerus - you're in E-town?  I had no idea.

Ever feel like meeting up and having a coffee or beer?

Sure, sounds good Beeb. I'll PM you.

[CountDeMoney]

Rochester/Buffalo seems to be one of the very few places in the US where wages are growing compared to home values. 

Nah, Berkut is an offshoot of the Hamilcar "House Destroyed By A Tornado? Nobody Told You To Live In A State With Tornadoes, Tough Shit For You, Asshole" school of thought.

[derspiess]

That's a bit harsh.

[CountDeMoney]

The fact that it is crazy expensive to live in NYC and SF and DC is a problem if you want to live in those places, but that is YOUR problem, or maybe those locations problem if they want those people living there anyway.

I dunno, he's pretty explicit about that.  Nobody says you have to live there.  But that's where the job is going to be?  Sounds like you need a different job then.