Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Zanza]

Just a thought: Maybe British royals are not representative. 

[Admiral Yi]

Just a thought: Maybe British royals are not representative. 

Excellent thought.  He's another: they are.

Wouldn't it be nice to find out?

[crazy canuck]

Gap year = one year break in schooling before committing to a "final" higher education choice that potentially defines the rest of your life.

How that gap year is filled depends on individual interests and personality, social class, money, etc. Travel is popular (get a sense of perspective and finding yourself and all that), but the style of travel will vary based on independent means. Gap years can often be funded by working abroad via things like working holiday visas and the like.

But very rich people are obviously going to do things that cost money, confirm their status, and is appealing to them. That doesn't necessarily reflect what everyone else may do.

And I think it is becoming more common for people to work a bit to try to defray the large costs associated with becoming a full time student.

[Jacob]

Yeah no doubt.

[Jacob]

Excellent thought.  He's another: they are.

Wouldn't it be nice to find out?

My sense is that they aren't. Of the people I've known taking a gap year, none of them have come across as having the amount of strictly organized (and expensive) set-up you're talking about for William.

It's always been one of:

1) Work to make money.
2) Exotic travel on a shoestring budget to "experience the world".
3) Pursuing CV-able experiences to improve the chances of success on a competitive University application.

Some folks try to combine more than one (e.g. volunteer somewhere that's also exotic, working while travelling).

[Admiral Yi]

My sense is that they aren't. Of the people I've known taking a gap year, none of them have come across as having the amount of strictly organized (and expensive) set-up you're talking about for William.

I was curious about the UK situation because in The Crown Kate Middleton, who's family is well off but not horsey aristocracy is seen taking one of the nice summer camps that William takes, one in Chile.

[Gups]

I reckon the majority of graduates take a year or six months off travelling. You don't need much cash to slum it around India or South east Asia.

[Sheilbh]

I reckon the majority of graduates take a year or six months off travelling. You don't need much cash to slum it around India or South east Asia.

Yeah. Although I feel like these sort of organised trips were a bigger thing in the 2000s. I definitely remember knowing about them and that's when I was leaving school. The way it was pitched, as I remember, was basically you do fundraising for a few months for x amount then you go off for your gap year which would normally include a bit of charitable/volunteer work (I imagine entirely useless), an "adventure" section where you get taken trekking/into the jungle and then basically standard tourism.

I think it was fairly common for middle class kids, possibly especially if they were travelling alone - I also think a big part of the pitch was basically to the parents of it being organised fun with people who know where your kid is. There would be a tour leader from that company manging the trip.

I know someone who did one to Peru, including a trip into the Amazon, some conservtio volunteering etc. But he did it just over the summer between school and university and I think it was also seen as something you could save money during the school year and then have the experience of a gap year but in six weeks.: I did a gap year but just earned the money and then travelled on my own (and did no volunteering and zero adventure/trekking - but did work in Buenos Aires for some reason). He regrets not doing that and going for one of these companies instead.

But I remember it was interesting talking about our different expeirences. I think he was terrified of going on a gap year on his own and not making friends so if it was an organised thing there would be a group you were with; I was the opposite and terrified of not liking/getting on with people in the group you're then trapped with for x amount of time.

Obviously I think William and Harry's were the vastly more expensive, organised Sloane Ranger version of that but I think back then it was definitely fairly common. I also think there's a bit more cynicism about the "fundraising" now as it is more commonly appreciated that the charity/volunteer section is pretty limited and you're basically asking people to donate to a holiday

I was curious about the UK situation because in The Crown Kate Middleton, who's family is well off but not horsey aristocracy is seen taking one of the nice summer camps that William takes, one in Chile.

They are millionaires.

Edit: Also practically speaking Harry and William are not going to be allowed to do a solo gap year or one with a few mates in the way normal kids are. So those types of organised ones probably allow their personal protection people etc to travel with them and give them a bit of Potemkin normal experience - plus trekking, volunteering in a conservation centre etc is controllble so the press can be kept away.

Edit: I don't often think about the royals but whenever I do - I always think of the brilliant Hilary Mantel piece that's well worth reading from when Kate's first pregnancy was announced:
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v35/n04/hilary-mantel/royal-bodies

[Josquius]

I reckon the majority of graduates take a year or six months off travelling. You don't need much cash to slum it around India or South east Asia.

I don't think so there.
You don't need much cash by working people standards but by young person who has never had a real job standards it might as well be millions.

[garbon]

Edit: I don't often think about the royals but whenever I do - I always think of the brilliant Hilary Mantel piece that's well worth reading from when Kate's first pregnancy was announced:
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v35/n04/hilary-mantel/royal-bodies

I don't know why but Mantel has never done it for me. I think that piece had some interesting concepts but largely felt like it meandered all over the place.

Admittedly, I've only ever finished one book by her and that was a bit of a slog (Beyond Black).

[garbon]

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/aslef-tube-strike-ballot-sadiq-khan-tfl-london-underground-rmt-b1131134.html

Tube strikes: Aslef drivers to be balloted on possible walkout amid row over Sadiq Khan's £30m RMT deal

Tube drivers are set to be balloted over possible strike action as the row over Sadiq Khan's £30m "magic money tree" deal to avert a week of walkouts intensified, the Standard can reveal.

The mayor unexpectedly found extra funds from City Hall to boost the annual pay rise for 16,000 Tube staff – a move that led the RMT to suspend action that would have shut the London Underground until Friday.

But critics said Mr Khan's unprecedented intervention on Sunday, when he was ridiculed for having discovered a "magic money tree", had "instantly backfired" and meant Londoners faced a greater threat of strikes.

The Standard can reveal that Aslef, which represents the vast majority of Tube drivers, is about to re-ballot its 2,000 members to enable it to retain the power to call a strike at a fortnight's notice.

Its current six-month strike "mandate" – which was supported by 99% of its Tube drivers - expires at the start of next month.

Aslef members had accepted a five per cent offer, on the basis that Transport for London could not afford any more, but are now understood to have "lost all trust" in the mayor and TfL after the extra cash was found to pay off the RMT.

Aslef leaders now want a 12% rise – matching the RPI rate of interest in February last year when the pay talks began – and a further increase for the 2024/25 year.

Keith Prince, City Hall Conservatives transport spokesman, said he was "disappointed but not surprised" that Aslef intended to re-ballot its members.

He said: "At the 11th hour, Sadiq Khan threw the RMT £30m to stave off this week's Tube strikes to try save his political skin. His ill-judged intervention has completely undermined TfL management and its industrial relations strategy.

"Sadiq Khan effectively called all TfL unions to jump aboard his magic money train. Aslef is the first and others will soon follow. This is a mess of Sadiq Khan's doing that will cost Londoners many millions of pounds which they will pay in higher fares."

While Aslef tends to be less willing than the RMT to hold Tube strikes, members have warned that feared changes to their terms and conditions in return for pay rises will almost certainly spark a walkout.

It comes as the TSSA union, which represents thousands of workers across TfL, warned it was also ready to ballot for strike action over pay.

TSSA general secretary Maryam Eslamdoust said: "Our members are ballot ready and prepared to do whatever is necessary to ensure they get a fair deal.

"Only urgent talks – and a seriously improved offer which takes into account the cost-of-living crisis – will mean industrial action can be avoided."

Talks involving all Tube unions are being held this week but sources said there was "lots of confusion" about how to proceed following the mayor's intervention, including uncertainty about how the £30m – which is worth about £1,800 per worker - would be allocated.

On Tuesday morning Mr Khan refused multiple requests from the London Assembly to reveal exactly how much taxpayers' cash he had offered the RMT to avert this week's Tube strike.

"I'm not going to go into figures," he said.

He added: "You shouldn't believe what is in the press."

But this failed to recognise that the figure of £30m was published first by the RMT – and confirmed by Mr Khan's own spokesman on Monday.

Neil Garratt, Tory chairman of the assembly's budget committee, said: "The Bat Signal has gone up from City Hall: If you want more money, threaten a strike."

A spokesperson for Mr Khan said: "The absolute worst outcome for London taxpayers and businesses would have been a week of strike action this week causing huge disruption in the capital. The hospitality industry alone had warned of a £50m loss of income if strikes had lasted throughout the week.

"The mayor has always said that negotiation and talking with workers is the best way to settle disputes."

If there is free money to be had, they'd be mad not to agitate for it.

Funny, of course, how excited local conservatives are to have something to moan about (as evidenced in article).

[Sheilbh]

I like her a lot. But I've never got on as well with the Wolf Hall books as I'd expect (prefer the TV adaptation) but I absolutely loved A Place of Greater Safety, her massive French Revolution novel which I just read in massive gulps.

I do love that essay though and remember the scandal about it - that she was somehow being cruel and nasty and anti-Kate. Which is a mad reading, but one that I think made her point coming from the press who have the cruelty built in, which in turn reflects our own.

Also think there's some great lines that always come back to me when I see anything to do with the royals.

[Sheilbh]

If there is free money to be had, they'd be mad not to agitate for it.

Funny, of course, how excited local conservatives are to have something to moan about (as evidenced in article).

Yeah I'd handle the Evening Standard with care given the mayoral election's in May

I think Khan has been a fairly underwhelming mayor - although I think some of that (especially on TfL's budget/covid negotiations are the government/DfT trying to deliberately screw him over). So there's probably a fair bit the Tories could go for - but the national picture is pretty catastrophic for them and they've picked a crap candidate.

Also it's now FPTP instead of a run-off system which I think makes it pretty solid for Labour - although it also makes me think this could be a good year if there was a prominent independent from the left (not Rory Stewart).

[Gups]

I agree. Khan's been pretty poor but still better than the alternatives. He does seem to have completely screwed this up though, I don't think it's just propaganda.

[crazy canuck]

I reckon the majority of graduates take a year or six months off travelling. You don't need much cash to slum it around India or South east Asia.

I don't think so there.
You don't need much cash by working people standards but by young person who has never had a real job standards it might as well be millions.

Naw, I went travelling after undergrad, and had no money. I worked while I backpacked, and it was easy to live cheap and particularly in southern Europe back in those days.