Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Josquius]

My twitter feed is filling up with the Brits I follow posting pictures of empty store shelves.  I think grocery stores.

Still not seeing that. There is a mysterious shortage of feta at Lidl, being the rugged individualist that i am I walk 600 yards down the road and get my feta fron Aldi 

Us city-folk can do this.
People living in more rural areas have it a bit tougher however. I've heard a lot of companies are prioritising their city shops as well; logical in a way considering the higher density.

[The Larch]

It seems that the UK's operation with Afghan refugees could do with some improvement in the home front as well.[...]
As Musa Okwonga said on Twitter, these people should dress as pets, and then British people would drive the length of the country to feed them gourmet meals.

So this doesn't bother me so much. According to the latest relase by the MoD there's been 13,000 people evacuated in about a fortnight including 2-2,500 in the last 24 hours.

I think it's going to be chaotic (I mean complaining about the food options on an evacuation flight strikes me as a little bit much ) - you know if Afghanistan had a coast it would probably be people crammed on ships too. My priority, because times is running out, would be get people out and worry about the rest later and it is not going to be like a commercial flight where you land and smoothly disembark - there might be a period where you have to stay at the airport while everyone's processed. I imagine things will get better organised relatively quickly - I can believe Birmingham Airport's comment that they had very short notice to get anything ready I think the lack of coffee facilities is probably quite low down the list when they've been given, probably a few hours, to prepare a space for a thousand people to stay while they're processed

Not least because apparently the UK has accidentally airlifted one person who is on the no fly list

What makes me wonder a bit is why the UK took that particular plane or any others to a regular, commercial airport, and "dump" the issue on its administrators. Spain is taking all their flights to military bases and the army are the ones handling everything.

[alfred russel]

Hey they have five days to get out the other ones.

The question that no one seems to be asking is why we have any obligation to get these people out. I can't speak to the UK but the US government gave ample warning months ago that we were pulling out and advised citizens to leave. Military or government workers in the country--I get that we have an obligation to get them out. Private citizens on the other hand...

Are you imputing some knowledge or foresight of a private person might have had months ago that your own government did not have?

I get that it is lucrative to work in warzones, but a "do not travel" advisory has been in place for approximately forever and the message above was not a new one.

Also, not really fair to say the US government didn't have foresight considering they were moving embassy work related to Afghanistan out of Afghanistan months ago.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/27/politics/embassy-kabul-ordered-departure-april-2021/index.html

[Sheilbh]

What makes me wonder a bit is why the UK took that particular plane or any others to a regular, commercial airport, and "dump" the issue on its administrators. Spain is taking all their flights to military bases and the army are the ones handling everything.

My guess is there's two sides to it.

One is that from my understanding there is one RAF base which is used for all air transport - it's the sole point of embarkation and landing for military planes such as when the Army deploys overseas. That's RAF Brize Norton - so I imagine they are busy with just getting the military planes out (and the UK has about 1,000 soldiers at the airport who will need pulling out with the US) for the airlift. So I don't know if there's a load of military base space available - and I imagine the reason Birmingham has been roped in is that it's about 60 miles from that base so it can be used for the emergency unloading of civilians while the military base can entirely focus on getting planes (and ground crews and supplies necessary for flights) to Kabul.

The other is just volume. The UK has chartered a lot of big civilian planes so they're not just using the military planes - I imagine it is the civilian planes that have been chartered that are being directed to a commercial airport because they might only be doing one run so it's unhelpful to have them taking up time and space on the base. But also the volume is higher than I expected - given the last day or two I think if we have another 12-24 hours the UK should have evacuated 15,000+ people which is quite a lot. Maybe they can be dispersed around army bases but I'm not sure - and I imagine in much the same way as the RAF are probably just focusing on getting people out, I suspect the army will be overwhelmingly focused on that via the UK troops in Kabul airport.

It doesn't seem crazy that basically the MoD's job right now is to get people out and then it's up to the domestic ministries (including the Home Office ) to basically house and process people once they're here - including by requisitioning commercial premises if necessary. I don't think it's fair to ask the MoD to do both a huge civilian airlift in a fortnight and also look after/process people as they arrive. Similarly I think the FCDO's only job right no should basically be making sure everyone who needs paperwork gets it.

Having said that there are reports/grumblings that the MoD and people in uniform are feeling very let down and frustrated by the Home Office and FCDO. It's plausible - but the sources for that are in the MoD so there may be a bit of briefing their side of things now and not wanting to get blamed in the inevitable inquiries that are coming.

Separately - interesting, slightly terrifying 'this country' thread from a pollster:

Luke Tryl
@LukeTryl
Last night, when we asked focus group participants how they thought we should pay for the cost of tackling climate change, the immediate (and sincere) response was to cut MPs pay. It's the second time in recent months I've had that response and it worries me in two ways.
Firstly, that we have allowed perceptions of MPs level of pay (and their greed) to run so out of line with reality. Defending politicians is rarely in anyone's interest, but its clear press coverage/populist attacks have created a sense MPs are being paid 10/100 x what they are.
Secondly, even with inflated salaries, that the cost of transition to net zero is seen as something that could be paid by cutting the pay of a few hundred people shows when it comes to expectations management, we are nowhere near having explained the scale of reaching net zero.
And obviously the two strongly interlink, when you don't have faith in policy makers and politicians taking decisions, you're far less likely to embrace their solutions/ calls for major societal change.
It maybe on the second point that rising awareness/concern on climate as per today's @IpsosMORI poll in turn changes expectations of the scale of change necessary. And that more gradual approach may be better for building durable support for change. But clearly a long way to go.

[garbon]

Oh I know (perhaps knew is better) that pollster. I oncef asked him on a date but then never scheduled it.

[Syt]

Oh I know (perhaps knew is better) that pollster. I oncef asked him on a date but then never scheduled it.

I'm kinda glad now you showed up for our dinner in Vienna

[garbon]

Oh I know (perhaps knew is better) that pollster. I oncef asked him on a date but then never scheduled it.

I'm kinda glad now you showed up for our dinner in Vienna

I've matured at least slightly since then (14 years ago).

[mongers]

My twitter feed is filling up with the Brits I follow posting pictures of empty store shelves.  I think grocery stores.

Still not seeing that. There is a mysterious shortage of feta at Lidl, being the rugged individualist that i am I walk 600 yards down the road and get my feta fron Aldi 

Us city-folk can do this.
People living in more rural areas have it a bit tougher however. I've heard a lot of companies are prioritising their city shops as well; logical in a way considering the higher density.

I've definitely seen this, shortages at my local Lidl, later same day I visited a Lidl in the Bm'th conurbation, no real shortages.

[Josquius]

Last night, when we asked focus group participants how they thought we should pay for the cost of tackling climate change, the immediate (and sincere) response was to cut MPs pay. It's the second time in recent months I've had that response and it worries me in two ways.
Firstly, that we have allowed perceptions of MPs level of pay (and their greed) to run so out of line with reality. Defending politicians is rarely in anyone's interest, but its clear press coverage/populist attacks have created a sense MPs are being paid 10/100 x what they are.
Secondly, even with inflated salaries, that the cost of transition to net zero is seen as something that could be paid by cutting the pay of a few hundred people shows when it comes to expectations management, we are nowhere near having explained the scale of reaching net zero.
And obviously the two strongly interlink, when you don't have faith in policy makers and politicians taking decisions, you're far less likely to embrace their solutions/ calls for major societal change.
It maybe on the second point that rising awareness/concern on climate as per today's @IpsosMORI poll in turn changes expectations of the scale of change necessary. And that more gradual approach may be better for building durable support for change. But clearly a long way to go.

The average bits trouble grasping numbers over 1000 strikes again.

[Sheilbh]

FFS


I hate to sound like a male, Tory voting pensioner - but get a grip

And - frankly - given that nowhere near 40% of this country is vegetarian or vegan people need to take a long hard look at their dining habits if they think humans and animals are worth the same.

[alfred russel]

100% chance the earlier immature version of me would answer this poll with "animal lives are worth more than human lives".

But the current version of me; older, wiser, but still equally immature; might answer with "animal lives are equally worth human lives", because answers in the more extreme bucket would just be dismissed as people trolling the pollsters but that answer might cause genuine consternation. 

[Valmy]

This is not helping my stereotype that British people love sheep more than they love themselves.

[Sheilbh]

This is not helping my stereotype that British people love sheep more than they love themselves.

That's a stereotype about the Welsh (if you're English or Welsh) or Aberdonians (if you're Scottish)!

Edit: Also - I don't think it's appropriate to call that love.

Edit: Oh and for Valmy, the Lib Dem fightback continues

Britain Elects
@BritainElects
Corby and Hayton (Cumbria) by-election result:

LDEM: 71.0% (+60.8)
CON: 29.0% (-6.0)

Liberal Democrat GAIN from Independent.

No Ind (-47.7) and Grn (-7.1) as prev.

[Valmy]

Edit: Also - I don't think it's appropriate to call that love.

[Valmy]

Edit: Oh and for Valmy, the Lib Dem fightback continues

Britain Elects
@BritainElects
Corby and Hayton (Cumbria) by-election result:

LDEM: 71.0% (+60.8)
CON: 29.0% (-6.0)

Liberal Democrat GAIN from Independent.

No Ind (-47.7) and Grn (-7.1) as prev.

I mean if Labour keeps screwing up somebody has to be left in England to counter the Tories.

Pity that nothing will ever be built again though.