Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Tamas]

The Guardian claimed yesterday that the EU is already preparing to delay it until July at least, anticipating a request from the UK.

[Tamas]

While I would much, much prefer the UK staying in the EU, which I think a second referendum would deliver, I do think that referendum would be very damaging. Putting such a momentous decision on a simple majority referendum was the dumbest political move of this century, and a mockery of what representative democracy is supposed to be. But it was called, and the voters delivered a result, and it was promised Parliament would deliver on it.

After all that to go back and say, "right folks, we can't really make up our mind, plus we suspect you have changed your minds about this whole ordeal, so let's have another go" could possibly be very damaging to democracry in Britain.

I'm not sure I can entirely agree with that. I mean it isn't usually the case in a democracy that something is voted on and that puts the matter to bed forever. Many times over referrenda or legislation reversing previously held stances can occur.

Sure but what matters is how the electorate will interpret it. If it ends up undermining the value of democracy in their minds, then it doesn't matter if they are right or wrong in that conclusion, the damage is done.

[Zanza]

May's populist, authoritarian, dilettante, and secretive handling of the whole situation has done much more damage to British democracy than a second referendum ever could. She has constantly fought against parliament having its traditional role. And she has made so many mistakes and has constantly tried to tack towards the most extremist part of her party that she has now created an impossible situation with only terrible choices left. Add the constant lying and falsehoods - on both sides - and virtually no British institution comes out of this looking good.

Cameron and May will both be remembered as some of the worst prime ministers in the long history of this once proud office.

And don't forget that polls show that roughly half of the population wants to remain. And no one seems to fight for their cause. Same for Europeans in Britain and British in the EU. These groups will also feel betrayed by democracy if Britain just leaves. And - conjecture by me - they are probably more relevant to the future well being of British democracy than the leavers...

[Richard Hakluyt]

This report, from the Joseph Rowntree Foundation, is a good survey of who voted for brexit :

https://www.jrf.org.uk/report/brexit-vote-explained-poverty-low-skills-and-lack-opportunities?gclid=Cj0KCQiAg_HhBRDNARIsAGHLV52MpEie4ODWG7nSS0GQoOo6Iy2eilLKOx7nyD5Tq4D05L-ssXac30oaAjMgEALw_wcB

[Tamas]

May's populist, authoritarian, dilettante, and secretive handling of the whole situation has done much more damage to British democracy than a second referendum ever could. She has constantly fought against parliament having its traditional role. And she has made so many mistakes and has constantly tried to tack towards the most extremist part of her party that she has now created an impossible situation with only terrible choices left. Add the constant lying and falsehoods - on both sides - and virtually no British institution comes out of this looking good.

Cameron and May will both be remembered as some of the worst prime ministers in the long history of this once proud office.

And don't forget that polls show that roughly half of the population wants to remain. And no one seems to fight for their cause. Same for Europeans in Britain and British in the EU. These groups will also feel betrayed by democracy if Britain just leaves. And - conjecture by me - they are probably more relevant to the future well being of British democracy than the leavers...

Good point.

[mongers]

Guys, wish 'us' luck with tonight's pantomime. 

[Zanza]

I hope this shitshow finds an end soon. It gets tiresome and repetitive.

[garbon]

Damn. She lost by 230 votes.

[Liep]

I like how they vote or rather I find it amusing.

[garbon]

No confidence motion put forth by Corbyn.

[garbon]

Apparently biggest historic loss since 1924.

[Tamas]

I like how they vote or rather I find it amusing.

Worked fine in 1650, no reason to change it.

[FunkMonk]

Is this finally it for May?

[Richard Hakluyt]

I like how they vote or rather I find it amusing.

Worked fine in 1650, no reason to change it.

1688 Tamas, 1688...........don't be failing the citizenship test now.

[Valmy]

Worked fine in 1650, no reason to change it.

I don't think the UK would allow innovation that recent to corrupt their august institutions.