The Off Topic Topic

[Tamas]

So the Jews being conniving assholes to troll the critical performers into oblivion which culminated in two third-parties having an incident is more likely than the Dutch performer simply being a violent asshat?

Why do you keep coming back to Jews?
It is possible to hate someone being a dick whilst that person is Jewish, black, gay, or whatever, without it being related to any thoughts about that group.

All evidence does suggest it was more than the Dutch guy who was upset. He's just the one who snapped.

Because all my life I have encountered people who always found that Jewish conniving was the most likely explanation to any random thing. It's the default stance for many. So it takes a lot of convincing to convince me that's the actual case in any given incident.

[Sheilbh]

But he snapped at Swedish production staff working for the national broadcaster running the show.

As I say from everything I've read, I can't really see what the Israelis have to do with it. It seems like it's putting two unconnected things together.

[Josquius]

Because all my life I have encountered people who always found that Jewish conniving was the most likely explanation to any random thing. It's the default stance for many. So it takes a lot of convincing to convince me that's the actual case in any given incident.

As I've said before, anti-semitism, or even the practical existence of Jews, was just a non-existing concept in my life until I first saw South Park. Its just not something that when I was a kid at least (doubtless different post Corbyn and all that mess) factors into most people's thinking either way around my way.
I don't think this is too abnormal in the UK in general that the "Jews did it" is not a remotely typical go-to. Catholics now....

But he snapped at Swedish production staff working for the national broadcaster running the show.

As I say from everything I've read, I can't really see what the Israelis have to do with it. It seems like it's putting two unconnected things together.

I've seen some mention it was an Israeli woman with a camera phone.
We have seen certainly that the Israeli broadcasters were up to a lot of hijinks backstage. The explanation that this led to several contestants asking not to be filmed backstage seems fairly solid- where it gets hazy is then that someone, whether Swedish or Israeli, then ignored the request whether maliciously or innocently, and prompted an angry reaction.
This actual final event is a minor part of the whole sequence.

[Sheilbh]

The EBU and Dutch broadcaster both said it was a member of the Eurovision production staff - which is the national broadcaster, broadly. A camera was broken and the police investigated and handed it to the prosecutor. As I say I've seen nothing indicating a connection with Israel - or the behaviour of their team.

[Razgovory]

As I've said before, anti-semitism, or even the practical existence of Jews, was just a non-existing concept in my life until I first saw South Park. Its just not something that when I was a kid at least (doubtless different post Corbyn and all that mess) factors into most people's thinking either way around my way.
I don't think this is too abnormal in the UK in general that the "Jews did it" is not a remotely typical go-to. Catholics now....

Maybe you encountered it, but didn't recognize it.  This was taught to us in school at a young age, is that not the case in Britain?

[Barrister]

Because all my life I have encountered people who always found that Jewish conniving was the most likely explanation to any random thing. It's the default stance for many. So it takes a lot of convincing to convince me that's the actual case in any given incident.

You know growing up I never really experienced or saw the "Jews are conniving and responsible for a grand conspiracy" kind of thinking.

But I certainly ran into the "Jews are cheap/tight/shysters", and the use of the word "jew" as a verb (as in "yeah he really jewed me down in price" was not unheard of.

[HVC]

I mostly, though not frequently, experienced the cheap stereotype too.

What jews control everything conspiracy I experienced was mostly in Languish as a running theme early on (I think it was a malthus gag  )

[HVC]

Actually, thinking it over, the all jews are rich thing came up, probably tied to being cheap sterotype. A lot having to do with the "hidden" enclaves of Jewish neighbourhooods in Toronto.

[Josquius]

In adult life I have encountered the Jews are cheap thing.
Though honestly I am not sure whether this is the existing stereotype floating around or the facts around our Heredis, setting themselves up in one of the  cheapest places around.

Also worth noting being cheap and getting bargains isn't considered a particularly terrible quality amongst northerners, unless you're on the receiving end of course.

[grumbler]

Here's a cool story: 89 Years Ago Today in Ann Arbor: Jesse Owens, Willis Ward and Gerald Ford

I knew most of this story, including the fact that Willis Ward couldn't run because of injuries, but not that he played through pain to win the long jump, knowing that Michigan needed the points.

Money quotes:

Today is the 89th anniversary of what it generally considered the greatest day in sports history - and it happened in Ann Arbor. It was on May 25, 1935, that a sophomore track star from Ohio State named Jesse Owens set three world records and tied a fourth in the span of 45 minutes at the Big Ten track meet at Ferry Field. Four world records in 45 minutes. Incredible. The greatest one-day feat in sports history.

...And the main reason Michigan won the meet is because U-M's Willis Ward fought through a leg injury to win the high jump. Ward – who had been benched by Michigan just a few months earlier in the Georgia Tech football game because the Yellow Jackets refused to play against an African American – was Owens' equal on the track. During the indoor season, they had raced against each other five times, and Ward won twice.

Also

The following year, in 1936, Jesse Owens won four gold medals at the Berlin Olympics. After the Games, President Franklin Roosevelt invited the Olympic team to the White House – the white athletes. No one else. Jesse Owens was not invited, and it was a snub he remembered for the rest of his life.

[Sheilbh]

Can't read the full article (God I miss JStor ), but seen people talking about it - but this is fascinating. Basically looking at the Able Archer incident and arguing that it wasn't a near-miss nuclear scare (as depicted by Gordievsky) but part of an internal bureaucratic fight pushing for the need to develop an early warning system/pointing to Soviet vulnerability on this:
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/08850607.2024.2334198?src=recsys

[Valmy]

Can't read the full article (God I miss JStor ),

What? JStor is still around...

Or do you mean having access to JStor? 

[garbon]

Can't read the full article (God I miss JStor ),

What? JStor is still around...

Or do you mean having access to JStor? 

Starting with I think covid, Jstor now has up to 100 articles a month that can be read on free accounts.

[The Brain]

Also

The following year, in 1936, Jesse Owens won four gold medals at the Berlin Olympics. After the Games, President Franklin Roosevelt invited the Olympic team to the White House – the white athletes. No one else. Jesse Owens was not invited, and it was a snub he remembered for the rest of his life.

I'm shocked that a man who came to power in early 1933, stimulated his country out of the depression, hid his health problems from the public, put his own citizens in camps because of their ethnicity, ordered his armies to invade Europe, terror bombed civilians, and died in April 1945, was racist.

[Legbiter]

New volcanic eruption on the same fissure as usual here in Iceland. Nice lava fountaining right now.