English papers charge interns for privilege of internship

[The Brain]

Who cares about social mobility in certain jobs? If people want a specific job more than they want social mobility (up or down btw?) then what's the problem? If you want to make something of yourself you don't go into fucking journalism.

[Martinus]

Who cares about social mobility in certain jobs? If people want a specific job more than they want social mobility (up or down btw?) then what's the problem? If you want to make something of yourself you don't go into fucking journalism.

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

[CountDeMoney]

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

That's the whole point of unpaid internships, though:  to earn experience in a sector one wishes to enter as a career--and, in some cases, to determine it's not for them, either.

[Martinus]

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

That's the whole point of unpaid internships, though:  to earn experience in a sector one wishes to enter as a career--and, in some cases, to determine it's not for them, either.

Yes but making it avaialble without pay means only people from affluent enough families can afford it.

I pride myself on the fact that my firm in Warsaw pays interns a modest (but living salary) and also rents flats for those who come from outside of Warsaw area. We want talent, not trust fund babies.

[Sheilbh]

Who cares about social mobility in certain jobs? If people want a specific job more than they want social mobility (up or down btw?) then what's the problem? If you want to make something of yourself you don't go into fucking journalism.

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

Very rare in the UK. Companies that actually want to make money and recruit the best people pay their interns so they're not drawing from a shallow, privileged gene pool.

Companies that don't are mainly using unpaid interns as free labour, rather than a potential hiring tool/work experience gig. That tends not to be most law firms for example.

Yes but making it avaialble without pay means only people from affluent enough families can afford it.

Especially if that family's not from London. Internships can be an opportunity for poor kids if their parents happen to live in London. If they don't they're fucked.

Again firms that want to recruit from their interns pay.

[CountDeMoney]

Yes but making it avaialble without pay means only people from affluent enough families can afford it.

But see, you are paying for an internship--it's called tuition.

I pride myself on the fact that my firm in Warsaw pays interns a modest (but living salary) and also rents flats for those who come from outside of Warsaw area. We want talent, not trust fund babies.

Gays, too.

[Martinus]

My firm is a British one so I guess its normal but many Polish or American firms in Warsaw do not pay interns/trainees.

The fact that an intern to survive needs to be paid 1/100 of a partner's pay makes it more stupid not to pay them really.

[Martinus]

Yes but making it avaialble without pay means only people from affluent enough families can afford it.

But see, you are paying for an internship--it's called tuition.

I pride myself on the fact that my firm in Warsaw pays interns a modest (but living salary) and also rents flats for those who come from outside of Warsaw area. We want talent, not trust fund babies.

Gays, too.

We believe that you get better results if you also hire people who are not rich white heterosexual males, imagine that.

[CountDeMoney]

We believe that you get better results if you also hire people who are not rich white heterosexual males, imagine that.

We call those "unions" here.  And try to destroy them.

[The Brain]

Who cares about social mobility in certain jobs? If people want a specific job more than they want social mobility (up or down btw?) then what's the problem? If you want to make something of yourself you don't go into fucking journalism.

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

I fail to see the problem with supply and demand in the labor market. If you want people to pay you then develop marketable skills. If you want to do stuff that people won't pay you to do then yes you need money from other sources. What a shocker.

[Valmy]

I think it is a natural outcome of trustifarians treating jobs as a hobby.

Are there that many Trust Fund kids working for free that it can this large of an impact?  I figured most trust fund kids would prefer to just not work at all.

[Martinus]

Who cares about social mobility in certain jobs? If people want a specific job more than they want social mobility (up or down btw?) then what's the problem? If you want to make something of yourself you don't go into fucking journalism.

But the unpaid internships are a problem in other areas as well, like law practice.

I fail to see the problem with supply and demand in the labor market. If you want people to pay you then develop marketable skills. If you want to do stuff that people won't pay you to do then yes you need money from other sources. What a shocker.

I believe people should act according to rules that, if followed by everybody, would contribute to the betterment of the society, especially if that does not involve a huge personal sacrifice or cost on their part. That is the most primary moral duty one has in life.

On that basis, employers that can afford it, should pay their interns.

[Martinus]

I think it is a natural outcome of trustifarians treating jobs as a hobby.

Are there that many Trust Fund kids working for free that it can this large of an impact?  I figured most trust fund kids would prefer to just not work at all.

It doesn't matter. Our societies (again, excepting America which doesn't really have any civilized concept of education and employment rights) are built around the principle (and usually have built-in supports) that parents support their children through education, but once education finishes, children should be able to live on their own. By making internships unpaid, you are effectively preventing educated young people who come from poorer families and/or from the country, from competing, because their families can no longer support them. As in practice, having an internship experience then serves as a gateway to a well paid job, you are effectively segregating people according to social classes, while maintaining the illusion of a meritocracy.

Of course you could argue that many people have to work already while getting college education - but the difference here is that education allows you to get a paid job in your free time. Internship is normally already a full time job.

[The Larch]

That's happened here, too. In particular I remember a (smallish) radio station that charged 100€ for working with them, Radio Kanal Barcelona.

There was also an advertising agency that did it, directed by one of the gurus of that sector. If you read "Moderna de pueblo" she did a comic strip denouncing it.

[Josquius]

Seems a logical outgrowth of the already screwed up system of unpaid internships and let's face it, the newspaper industry is a mess these days.
That it is a logical growth of a trend does not of course make that trend in any way ok .
I totally agree with what Martinus said above