The Labor Pains Megathread

[Duque de Bragança]

We have all this talk about driverless cars, but we cannot even make driverless subways/trains. 

The Skytrain in Vancouver is driverless.

So's the Metro in Athens. Or anywhere modern.

Sadly London's Tube was mostly built 150 years ago which makes for some practical difficulties with driverless trains.

Possible to do but expensive and time consuming see line 1 in Paris, the oldest one (1900) and now almost as good as line 14, the most recent one, and driverless of course.

[Tamas]

Car is freedom. Having good transport links like I do here is great and everything, and yes in a city they make more sense than rotting in a traffic jam, but without a car you are highly inconvinienced in a lot of situations, and basically you are tied to your immediate neighborhood like some feudal peasant.

And as for working weekends: don't like it? Don't do it. Switch and let some other guy have your job. You don't have a choice? Be happy you got that job then.

When I worked multiple shifts I didn't hear anyone wishing the government made their job illegal.

[Martinus]

Car is freedom. Having good transport links like I do here is great and everything, and yes in a city they make more sense than rotting in a traffic jam, but without a car you are highly inconvinienced in a lot of situations, and basically you are tied to your immediate neighborhood like some feudal peasant.

I don't feel like this at all. Since I moved to Warsaw, I have never been in a situation where I couldn't get somewhere cheaper and/or more conveniently either on foot, on a bike, in a taxi, on a bus/metro or by plane. 

Admittedly I got a car at the nagging of my boyfriend but he is the only one using it now, pretty much.

[Tamas]

Let's imagine you cannot use taxis regularly, because, you know, you are not stinking rich.

Car is freedom.

[Syt]

A taxi ride within Vienna rarely comes out at above 15 EUR. And that is discounting excellent public transport in the center - the outskirts can be a bit cumbersome to get to a subway/major tram line, but it's manageable. And even if we talk hauling of stuff there's alternatives for that or delivery options. And if push comes to shove you might still use a rental (if you move apartments, for example).

[Tamas]

Still we are talking about depending on others' services for doing stuff you could do on your own with a car.

It is a matter of taste. Personally, I miss my car, but in no hurry to get one because there is not much point right now. But I won't be able to hold off forever.

[Syt]

Having a car in Vienna would be way too expensive for me with taxes, parking space and insurance, considering my annual ticket costs me under €40.- a month (just a parking space in a garage will be more expensive than that), public transport to work and around my usual haunts is as fast as taking a car, and the only benefit would be to use it to get out of town once in a while, and that seems hardly worth it.

YMMV, of course (literally). If I was living on the outskirts or in the countryside, I'd have a different perspective.

[Martinus]

Still we are talking about depending on others' services for doing stuff you could do on your own with a car.

I fail to see how this is different from depending on fuel, parking places, insurance and technical checks for your car.

And a car makes your options more limited than you think - for example forget about driving anywhere where you would drink alcohol and then go home.

[Eddie Teach]

And a car makes your options more limited than you think - for example forget about driving anywhere where you would drink alcohol and then go home.

You still have all the same options to get there you do without the car.

[crazy canuck]

Jacob's argument from beginning to end.  The crystal clear one.

Why do it twice?

[crazy canuck]

Forcing people to work every weekend as if they were normal days is horrible.
Wages should be higher (used to do time and a half years ago....no longer) and at least one weekend per month allowed off.
But outright banning shops opening Sunday is madness

Assuming you are not religious, in the long run what's the difference if you work every Saturday and Sunday but get Monday and Tuesday off? Many employees, especially younger ones, actually prefer such a set up.

As having been a non religious young person who worked weekends, I certainly did not prefer working those days.  I suppose if one doesnt have a lot of social contact it wouldnt matter but it really sucks when our friends are not working but you are.

[Tamas]

Forcing people to work every weekend as if they were normal days is horrible.
Wages should be higher (used to do time and a half years ago....no longer) and at least one weekend per month allowed off.
But outright banning shops opening Sunday is madness

Assuming you are not religious, in the long run what's the difference if you work every Saturday and Sunday but get Monday and Tuesday off? Many employees, especially younger ones, actually prefer such a set up.

As having been a non religious young person who worked weekends, I certainly did not prefer working those days.  I suppose if one doesnt have a lot of social contact it wouldnt matter but it really sucks when our friends are not working but you are.

Whether its the same to work on weekends and weekdays should not be part of this conversation about whether the government should make weekend work verboten.
What if its worse? Working on a garbage truck is considerably worse than working in an air conditioned office browsing the Internet between actually working.

This is one of the most typical examples of needless state involvement. If there is no demand in a particular job to work weekends, then nobody will employ weekend-workers anyway. If there is one, and they can find somebody to do it, then it is no place for the government to prevent those people from having a job. And if they do, they screw over two groups of people with one stroke: those who would be willing to work weekends instead of being on the dole, and the customers who would need the particular service during the weekends.

[Josquius]

I dont think anyone is saying to ban it outright.
Weekends hoewever shouldnt be treat like any other day. Higher wages should apply at the least. Better would be at least one weekend a month where you dont have to work

[crazy canuck]

If there is no demand in a particular job to work weekends, then nobody will employ weekend-workers anyway.

That makes about as much sense as saying that if there was a demand for slaves or indentured servants then laws prohibiting that should be abolished. It is just silly to argue that there shouldnt be minimum employment standards because the market will regulate everything perfectly.

Rather the argument is, as a matter of good public policy, what regulations should be put in place.

[Jacob]

Let's imagine you cannot use taxis regularly, because, you know, you are not stinking rich.

Car is freedom.

It really sounds like you should move to the US.