UKIP poster boy is a racist immigrant, film at 11

[Warspite]

- Our Cabinet is stuffed full of rich property owners.

I do not think the last point is trivial.

Surely your planning ordinances aren't set at the national level, are they?

Depends - there's a variety of different national legislation and local acts.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/buildingregulations/buildingpolicyandlegislation/currentlegislation/

For example, in London there are protected sightlines in which no building must obscure the view of St Paul's cathedral from a variety of London spots.

EDIT: And the selling off of Britain's national housing was a central decision.

[Sheilbh]

For example, in London there are protected sightlines in which no building must obscure the view of St Paul's cathedral from a variety of London spots.

Eg. the view between the hedge in Richmond Park:


Although I'm not sure if that's national as I believe Ken got rid of about half of them.

And the implementation of planning is performed by local councils, even if the statutes are national. They'll have a lot of duties to consult widely and people who are annoyed about a planning decision are far more likely to vote in council elections. As I say at a local level this sort of thing is a plausible motive for murder on British TV.

Edit: And this government did liberalise planning law a little. But they planned to go much further and it caused a huge backlash from Tory members who are mostly older, mostly home-owners and mostly rather attached to the countryside even if just the idea of it. Sir Simon Jenkins () who was chair of the National Trust accused Cameron of 'ruining the countryside' with his relatively modest changes. But then he seems to think all young people everywhere in the country should just buy a flat in Battersea Power Station.

Also: does anyone else find Owen Jones insufferable?

Everyone, I think.

Still I reserve most of my columnist-hate for Seumas Milne.

[mongers]

The economy seems to generate enough jobs, there would be skill shortages if UKIP had their way, but there is a big housing problem. British planning law is highly restrictive and we are currently constructing about 100,000 houses per annum, meanwhile household formation is running at 250,000 per annum........it is a recipe for overcrowding and tension.

I want the state to get involved in this and start producing social housing in large quantities until the pressure is relieved. We are probably talking about 250,000 houses a year for a the forseeable future.

I'm not one for conspiracy theories but I think there are far too many vested interests in keeping house prices propped up. The problem is:
- The young, who suffer from rising house prices, tend not to vote
- Rising/stable house prices at this high plateau are keeping consumption going
- More straightforward NIMBYism
- Our Cabinet is stuffed full of rich property owners.

I do not think the last point is trivial.

I don't disagree on those points, but that's the one that seriously annoys me, if you young and in that predicament, then vote, join political parties, take them over, get your voice heard and change the loaded dice. Don't wallow in apathy.

[Josquius]

Our cities need a big slap to realise medium rise flats arent a bad thing

Yep. But we've a pretty dodgy record of building higher density areas. The last time councils built houses are a big part of the reason people don't like high density housing.

It boggles the mind. My grandparents received a flat in 1960s Yugoslavia - where along the Dalmatian coast, available land is even more squeezed than the UK will ever be - that was spacious and solidly built, if functional rather than luxurious. Today we still use this flat, and it's nicer than four of the five London homes I've lived in (across Muswell Hill, Herne Hill, Colliers Wood, Parsons Green and Pimlico).

We are unable to build to the quality that Communist Yugoslavia could sixty years ago.

Most brits would agree with you only sub out 1960s yugoslavia for 1900s uk.
We never build decent flats yet our modern houses are also really pretty shit.

[Sheilbh]

Most brits would agree with you only sub out 1960s yugoslavia for 1900s uk.
We never build decent flats yet our modern houses are also really pretty shit.

Yep. And they're all apparently incredibly wasteful when they're being built compared to other European countries.

That's what's really galling about high house prices. Generally you're paying a lot for a really crap place to live

[mongers]

Most brits would agree with you only sub out 1960s yugoslavia for 1900s uk.
We never build decent flats yet our modern houses are also really pretty shit.

Yep. And they're all apparently incredibly wasteful when they're being built compared to other European countries.

That's what's really galling about high house prices. Generally you're paying a lot for a really crap place to live

Is that the 12-16 house per acre or the UK as a whole?

[Valmy]

Well there goes the fantasy about every British person living in a castle with their own butler.

[garbon]

Well there goes the fantasy about every British person living in a castle with their own butler.

Sheilbh still has one though.

[mongers]

Well there goes the fantasy about every British person living in a castle with their own butler.

Sheilbh still has one though.

Indeed, the butler is locked in the under-stairs cupboard, lured to Sheilbh flat by promises of working in an ancestral pile. 

[garbon]

Well there goes the fantasy about every British person living in a castle with their own butler.

Sheilbh still has one though.

Indeed, the butler is locked in the under-stairs cupboard, lured to Sheilbh flat by promises of working in an ancestral pile. 

Too many shades of Boy George.

[Sheilbh]

Well there goes the fantasy about every British person living in a castle with their own butler.

Sheilbh still has one though.

How else could I afford not to be snobbish?

[Martinus]

No, the tax free amount (and progressive tax thresholds) are lower in Poland.

So, for example, imagine that the tax free amount in the UK is $1000 per month. Once you reach it you pay 19%, and only once you reach $5000 per month you pay the higher bracket.

At the same time, in Poland, the tax free amount is $500 per month - once you reach it you pay 19% and you get into the higher (32%) bracket upon reaching $1500 per month.

Now imagine you are earning $2000 per month. In the UK the tax on this would be $190 but in Poland that would be taxed at $350 ($190 for the 1000 between 500 and 1500; and $160 for the 500 between 1500 and 2000).

So in a situation like this you would have to pay the excess $160 in Poland after having paid the $190 in the UK.

But how does it work in practice? The tax-free threshold is higher in Britain, for example, because the cost of living is much higher.

EDIT: Actually Marty this EU website says only people resident in Poland pay Polish income tax:

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/work/taxes/income-taxes-abroad/poland/index_en.htm

I read this was a big issue for Polish citizens working in the UK, exactly because of higher costs of living in the UK. Could be that it only applied to people who worked in the UK for less than half a year.

[Martinus]

Our cities need a big slap to realise medium rise flats arent a bad thing

Yep. But we've a pretty dodgy record of building higher density areas. The last time councils built houses are a big part of the reason people don't like high density housing.

It boggles the mind. My grandparents received a flat in 1960s Yugoslavia - where along the Dalmatian coast, available land is even more squeezed than the UK will ever be - that was spacious and solidly built, if functional rather than luxurious. Today we still use this flat, and it's nicer than four of the five London homes I've lived in (across Muswell Hill, Herne Hill, Colliers Wood, Parsons Green and Pimlico).

We are unable to build to the quality that Communist Yugoslavia could sixty years ago.

Were your grandparents communist apparatchiks though? That could go a long way towards explaining it.

[Richard Hakluyt]

Our cities need a big slap to realise medium rise flats arent a bad thing

Yep. But we've a pretty dodgy record of building higher density areas. The last time councils built houses are a big part of the reason people don't like high density housing.

Also another Guardian headline - 'Labour party at war over Emily Thornberry's 'snobby' tweet'.

Christ's sake

Interestingly tower blocks do not achieve as high a population density as traditional terraced housing, nor are they as popular of course.

Take a look at this report, some particularly germane information on page 11 :

http://www.policyexchange.org.uk/images/publications/create%20streets.pdf

An updated approach to terraced housing could achieve high population densities and satisfy British preferences for their own front door and whatnot.

[Zanza]

Interestingly tower blocks do not achieve as high a population density as traditional terraced housing, nor are they as popular of course.

[Mono]You are not doing tower blocks right then[/Mono]