N. Korea building missile launch pad capable of aiming at U.S.

[CountDeMoney]

as i said to berkut, so far it has worked for several decades

Until the one time it doesn't.

[Ed Anger]

I wonder if Timmay is getting his emergency evacuation rickshaw and coolie ready for Foal Eagle '14.

[CountDeMoney]

Foal Eagle '14.

Four Eagle, ROR.

[dps]

Sure by that definition, besides that war they started that killed millions, they are choir boys.  They are masters of provocation and saber rattling, if they were masters of aggression they would not exist anymore.

well, they're clearly not choir boys. my point is that anyone who worries about north korea launching a sudden invasion, or attack against japan/united states, doesn't understand north korea

The problem with being agressive and blustery and all saber rattling while not really intending to actually go to war is that sometimes the result is that you end up at war even when you don't set out to do so.

When you bluff enough, eventually someone is going to call you on it, and then you find yourself in a position where circumstances force your hand, or at least you perceive that they do.

How many wars have started throughout human history where the side that started the war never really intended to go to war to begin with, but got themselves to a position where they could not back down?

You have pretty much just described the offset of WWII, for starters.

Not really.  Hitler wasn't bluffing--he wanted war, and the British and French had given up on appeasing him.

Now if you'd said WWI, you'd be on firmer ground. 

[celedhring]

Pretty sure Hitler was confident on getting Gdansk without war, after all he got Austria, Czechoslovakia and Memel without war beforehand. Once he had committed himself, he couldn't back down. The French were still pushing for a negotiated solution until the eleventh hour, so it's not like Hitler had no reasons to believe the entente would back down once again.

The French and British were so committed that we got the Phony War.

[Eddie Teach]

Except Hitler started the war and he could have backed down at any point.

[celedhring]

Except Hitler started the war and he could have backed down at any point.

Well, the point I'm trying to make with the comparison regarding N. Korea is that Hitler got away with so much that he had no reason to back down, he thought the Allies would cave like they did all the times before. NK has got away with so much (really, can you imagine the reaction if some foreign power shelled your territory like NK did to SK?), that I believe that their leadership believe they can get away with anything sort of an invasion in order to extract concessions or build up domestic support.

[Admiral Yi]

Who do they think they are, Hamas?

[dps]

Pretty sure Hitler was confident on getting Gdansk without war, after all he got Austria, Czechoslovakia and Memel without war beforehand. Once he had committed himself, he couldn't back down. The French were still pushing for a negotiated solution until the eleventh hour, so it's not like Hitler had no reasons to believe the entente would back down once again.

Actually, he was afraid that they'd back down again.  He had decided that he wanted war in 1939, and was worried that the Allies would negotiate and give him everything he was demanding again.  A lot of his subordinates weren't really happy about it, because previously he had told them to plan for war starting in 1946 or so.

[Razgovory]

Yeah, he was a bit put out about the appeasement in 1938.  He was surprised in 1939, but was happy to get his war.  Hitler was, after all, insane.

[MadImmortalMan]

Pretty sure Hitler was confident on getting Gdansk without war, after all he got Austria, Czechoslovakia and Memel without war beforehand. Once he had committed himself, he couldn't back down. The French were still pushing for a negotiated solution until the eleventh hour, so it's not like Hitler had no reasons to believe the entente would back down once again.

The French and British were so committed that we got the Phony War.

If Gdansk didn't spark his war, he'd have found something that did.

[MadImmortalMan]

Pretty sure Hitler was confident on getting Gdansk without war, after all he got Austria, Czechoslovakia and Memel without war beforehand. Once he had committed himself, he couldn't back down. The French were still pushing for a negotiated solution until the eleventh hour, so it's not like Hitler had no reasons to believe the entente would back down once again.

Actually, he was afraid that they'd back down again.  He had decided that he wanted war in 1939, and was worried that the Allies would negotiate and give him everything he was demanding again.  A lot of his subordinates weren't really happy about it, because previously he had told them to plan for war starting in 1946 or so.

He figured if he didn't get on with the war by then, he'd have no chance to win it. The mid 40's would have been way too late according to the possible buildup timeline. The longer they went, the worse chance Germany had to win.

[Syt]

Pretty sure Hitler was confident on getting Gdansk without war, after all he got Austria, Czechoslovakia and Memel without war beforehand. Once he had committed himself, he couldn't back down. The French were still pushing for a negotiated solution until the eleventh hour, so it's not like Hitler had no reasons to believe the entente would back down once again.

The French and British were so committed that we got the Phony War.

If Gdansk didn't spark his war, he'd have found something that did.

He was actually pissed off at the Sudeten crisis settlement during the Munich Conference, because he already wanted to go to war then.

[celedhring]

Fair enough then, the version I've always read is the opposite; he didn't want war yet because Germany was unprepared.

[Syt]

Fair enough then, the version I've always read is the opposite; he didn't want war yet because Germany was unprepared.

That's what his politicians and generals thought, during 1938.