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Scientology on trial in France for fraud

Started by jimmy olsen, May 31, 2009, 03:42:26 PM

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jimmy olsen

Not sure how I feel about this. :mellow:

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1901373,00.html
Quote
Scientology Trial in France: Can a Religion Be Banned?
By Bruce Crumley / Paris Thursday, May. 28, 2009
Alain Rosenberg

As a fiercely secular nation, France has always had an awkward relationship with religious groups. Officials often find themselves struggling to strike the delicate balance between maintaining church-state separation and honoring the right of citizens to express their faith. But in the current case against the U.S.-based Church of Scientology, authorities have abandoned their usual attempts at fine-tuning religion's standing in French society — instead, they want to ban Scientology from France altogether.

In a long-awaited trial that opened this week, French prosecutors are charging Scientology's French affiliate with organized fraud. Six of Scientology's top French officials are defendants in the case that began May 25. When investigating magistrate Jean-Christophe Hullin filed the findings of a nine-year inquiry with prosecutors, he described Scientology as "first and foremost a commercial business" whose interactions with followers are defined by "a real obsession for financial remuneration." The church's bookstores and celebrity center were described by Hullin's investigation as instrumental in ensnaring psychologically fragile people "with the goal of seizing their fortune by exerting a psychological hold." (See pictures of Paris.)

If found guilty, the defendants would face fines and possible prison time. But a conviction would also allow French authorities to designate Scientology as a criminal organization conceived to fleece its followers, which would lead to the banning of the religion in France. That exceptional measure would force Scientology out of the country — or underground, along with outlawed practices like Satanism. Given that Scientology has 8 million members worldwide, that strikes some observers are extreme.

After two of the four original plaintiffs agreed to settle out of court, the case now centers on charges by two women who say they were preyed upon by the organization. On Tuesday, Aude-Claire Malton, a hotel employee who makes $1,620 a month, told the court that once she'd agreed to accept the treatment the Scientology "auditors" had prescribed to remedy her spiritual imperfections, she found herself facing a $27,000 bill within two months. The second plaintiff claims she was forced by her Scientologist boss to undergo spiritual auditing in 1998 and was fired when she refused to accept similarly expensive treatment.

Scientology officials in France have denied the allegations, saying the two women — like all Scientology members — were free to participate in or walk away from treatment and other church activities as they pleased. They and their lawyers also point to what they say is a history of official French hostility to their movement — including its inclusion in a 1996 government list of dangerous cults. As contrast to the organization's ostracism in France, Scientology leaders note that their church has the same status as a legitimate religion in Spain, Slovenia and Hungary as it has in the U.S. and Canada. "This is a trial for heresy," said the Church of Scientology's spokeswoman in France, Danièle Gounord, who added that the organization has been relentlessly "hounded" by a French establishment intolerant of the unconventional beliefs of Scientologists.

Though allegations that Scientology bleeds members dry is neither new nor limited to France, some outside observers may agree with Gounord's claims of French intolerance toward religion. France's 1996 list of dangerous cults, for example, contains 172 groups, including Jehovah's Witnesses, Hare Krishnas, the Worldwide Church of God, the Unification Church and even transcendental meditationists — all of whom have largely shed their cult status in the U.S. and the U.K.

Some also charge that religious intolerance was behind France's infamous 2004 law banning students from wearing "ostensible religious objects" in public schools — a prohibition designed mainly to eliminate the small but slowly growing number of Muslim headscarves in classrooms. As it did when France issued its dangerous-cults list, the U.S. government officially responded to the law banning religious objects with a request that Paris make greater efforts to respect religious freedoms. (Read "'Veil Wars' Reveal Europe's Intolerance.")

Though Washington has stayed quiet about the current trial, France has carefully positioned the case to withstand charges that it is intruding in matters of faith. As in the five previous cases France brought against Scientologists, prosecutors are focusing on charges and evidence of the organization's manipulating members to wring money out of them — not on any of the spiritual beliefs or practices that may be involved. The first time that happened, in 1978, a Paris court found Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard guilty of vulgar fraud. In 1997, a Lyon court convicted five Scientology officials of similar charges, which were linked to the suicide of a debt-ridden church member. That verdict came with fines and a suspended prison sentence.

In this trial, which is expected to last until mid-June, prosecutors are likewise trying to portray Scientology as merely a large-scale scam while ignoring the organization's religious conceits. Now a country that constantly wrestles with the separation of church and state will find out just how far it's willing to go to keep the two apart.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

Martinus

Got a problem with prosecuting fraud, Timmay?

CountDeMoney

Quote from: jimmy olsen on May 31, 2009, 03:42:26 PM
Not sure how I feel about this. :mellow:

I'm pretty sure I feel you should eat shit and die.

The Brain

Wake me when they label the Catholic church a criminal organization. Talk about preferential treatment.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Neil

Really, it's shocking that Scientology hasn't been banned in the US yet.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

PRC

Wikipedia has also just banned known Scientologist IP addresses from editing their article.
http://scitech.blogs.cnn.com/2009/05/29/wikipedia-bans-church-of-scientology/


Zanza

The Church of Scientology is a normal organization and should not be above the law.

Martinus

Anyway, I hope the French use the legal precedent and burn scientologists at stake for worshipping Baphomet.

DisturbedPervert

If they're going to put a religion on trial and ban it, it should be islam.  Of course, they'd blow shit up, while the Scientologists will respond by making bad movies.

pimpicus

Quote from: DisturbedPervert on May 31, 2009, 08:51:19 PM
If they're going to put a religion on trial and ban it, it should be islam.

Like the Christians never killed anybody. :D

And Battlefield Earth was so bad it was good.  "Silly man-animals."

Martinus

Quote from: DisturbedPervert on May 31, 2009, 08:51:19 PM
If they're going to put a religion on trial and ban it, it should be islam.  Of course, they'd blow shit up, while the Scientologists will respond by making bad movies.

They are not putting a religion on trial - they are putting an organization on trial.

Mr.Penguin

Scientology as a religion?. Funny becourse when they first set up shop, here in Denmark (Cogenhagen is where Scientology's european HQ is located) back in the 70's did they only call themself a trans-meditative movement, not a religion. They still dont has status as a religion here in Denmark, guess the limited taxbreaks for religious organization isnt good eoungh to be worth trying to chance the status...
Real men drag their Guns into position

Spell check is for losers

DontSayBanana

Only 27,000 dollars? Their org is dirt cheap.

I suggest you guys read some Robert Kaufman, keeping in mind that this was originally published in 1972.

http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/isd/isd-4a.htm

QuoteOnly when the train pulled out of Edinburgh Station did I allow myself to think forbidden thoughts, feel the resentment and disgust. I wanted to heave their lines, their ethics, their stats up in one big ball.

Ron's bombastic voice still filled my head -- Source, who had nothing but contempt for the world and had taught me to see only danger and ugliness. Did I forget something? Say the wrong thing? Leave my briefcase unlocked, unguarded? And fear: fear of not escaping the Trap; fear of not being able to afford auditing; fear of sec checks, the soul stripped bare by the meter; fear of being down-stat, subject to ethics penalty; fear of destroying the preclear and myself; fear of the unconfrontable wog world.

Ron's followers were not spared his contempt. I had been seared by it when I split myself into a pathetic creature called "auditor-preclear."

I had hammered down my feelings, paralyzed myself with fear whenever my mind tried to tear itself free. How many times I'd shuddered as I was about to think what I shouldn't, and intercepted and aborted the thought; how many times I had said "Yes, oh yes," and felt the horror. Horror at myself, my own voice whispering, "Why, this is wrong, all wrong."

As the train carried me away from the AO and my Doubt penalty, I took out some notebook paper and started to write. I had denied myself self-expression for three months that seemed like three years. The notes I wrote were criticisms of Ron, Tech, the Sea Org.

If you criticize scientology as a scientologist, and it gets back to the orgs, they force you to go back for auditing; the more problems you claim to have, the farther they send you, and the more expensive it gets.
Experience bij!

The Minsky Moment

Quote"first and foremost a commercial business" whose interactions with followers are defined by "a real obsession for financial remuneration."

As opposed to all those other commercial businesses who couldn't give a damn about money.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

Norgy