The China Thread

[DGuller]

Isn't green card sort of second class citizenship?  Well, technically it's not a citizenship, but once you have green card, your presence in the country is no longer tenuous.

[Monoriu]

It is a weird concept.

I understand and accept the rationale.  Hong Kong was a colony, not "UK proper". 

[celedhring]

Our former colonies have an expedited path to citizenship but no "middle" status like BN(O).

Then again, brits have always been confusing with all their overseas territories, dependencies, and shit.

[Admiral Yi]

I guess in the US Puerto Rico has a sort of in between status.  Everyone born their has US citizenship, but residents of the island have no federal voting rights.

[Duque de Bragança]

One of my biggest shocks in Canada was they didn't have different classes of citizenship.  I at first assumed that I would become a Canadian National (Overseas) or something like that.  It would not include the right to vote or some such.  No big deal.  I then found out that Canada didn't have a ladder of citizenship like the UK did.  Then I began to notice that, actually, not that many countries in the world had different classes of citizenship.  The UK was actually the exception.

Brazilians may have as well a second class citizenship in Portugal, branded as as Equality Statute under the treaty of Porto Seguro. The difference being that the Brazilian with the special Portuguese ID cannot use it to travel freely in the EU/Schengen zone. Being elected for office is included though, except maybe top political positions; not sure about it.
Works reciprocally for the Portuguese in Brazil.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_Statute_between_Brazil_and_Portugal

PS: nothing for Macau citizens, sorry Mono. It's all (Portuguese citizens) or nothing. 

[Josquius]

Don't Goans have some special status?

[Sheilbh]

Our former colonies have an expedited path to citizenship but no "middle" status like BN(O).

Then again, brits have always been confusing with all their overseas territories, dependencies, and shit.

Yeah it's a legacy of empire but actually quite a late development - things used to be simple. We didn't have codified citizenship laws until the 20th century - it was just "his/her Majesty's subjects" or not. I think initially that was the approach the to citizenship: if you were a subject then you were a citizen. So during the First World War newspapers would report the number of "British" casualties and then break it down by nationality but they counted Canadian, South African, Indian, Irish casualties as "British" (and legally, they were).

That all basically changes after the second world war when those Brits from other bits of the empire start to exercise their right to move and live in the UK which prompts various waves of racist panic. So there's some restrictions in 1948, more are imposed in the 60s and then in the 80s these various categories of citizenship are are created - and there's now a load of legacy citizenships like BN(O). I think the only one that people still get are for British Overseas Territories like the Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Bermuda etc.

[Duque de Bragança]

Don't Goans have some special status?

More like an expedited path to citizenship, as the other lusophone countries.

[Valmy]

I guess in the US Puerto Rico has a sort of in between status.  Everyone born their has US citizenship, but residents of the island have no federal voting rights.

An even better example of this is American Samoans who are American Nationals but not American Citizens...whatever that means.

[Agelastus]

Our former colonies have an expedited path to citizenship but no "middle" status like BN(O).

Then again, brits have always been confusing with all their overseas territories, dependencies, and shit.

Yeah it's a legacy of empire but actually quite a late development - things used to be simple. We didn't have codified citizenship laws until the 20th century - it was just "his/her Majesty's subjects" or not. I think initially that was the approach the to citizenship: if you were a subject then you were a citizen. So during the First World War newspapers would report the number of "British" casualties and then break it down by nationality but they counted Canadian, South African, Indian, Irish casualties as "British" (and legally, they were).

That all basically changes after the second world war when those Brits from other bits of the empire start to exercise their right to move and live in the UK which prompts various waves of racist panic. So there's some restrictions in 1948, more are imposed in the 60s and then in the 80s these various categories of citizenship are are created - and there's now a load of legacy citizenships like BN(O). I think the only one that people still get are for British Overseas Territories like the Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Bermuda etc.

BN(O) is Hong Kong Unique and dates to the mid-Eighties, after the handover agreement was signed. Also, almost all British Overseas Territories citizens now also hold British citizenship (once Hong Kong was gone there was no need for it outside of Cyprus.)

While we are happy now to potentially allow 3 million Hong Kong citizens to emigrate here - we were not in the Eighties and Nineties (something which annoyed me then.) I seem to remember this being commented on when we extended full citizenship to most of the Overseas Territories under Blair.

One must also remember that the main "tidying up", that being the 1971 Act, was partly needed because we were joining the EEC and our somewhat lax definitions of citizenship were inadequate for "the Club".

[grumbler]

Don't Goans have some special status?

More like an expedited path to citizenship, as the other lusophone countries.

I learned a new word today!

It's going to take some work to put it properly into a sentence I might speak, but it's a great word.

[Sheilbh]

Similar to the Huawei patents. There needs to be a real responsibility for companies to manage their supply chain and not get involved with either forced labour or tech companies who've been doing this type of work:

Amazon questioned over contract with company that offered 'real-time Uighur warnings'
By Johana BhuiyanStaff Writer
Feb. 10, 2021 5:54 PM PT

Amazon.com Inc. faces questions from senators over a reported contract with Dahua, a Chinese security camera company that indicated it has the ability to alert police when its facial recognition software identifies members of the Uighur ethnic group.

Sens. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.) and Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) sent the letter to Amazon Chief Executive Jeff Bezos one day after the Los Angeles Times reported on Dahua product support documents that suggest the company's technology can sort passersby by race, issue "real-time warnings for non-local Uighurs," and track "Uighurs with hidden terrorist inclinations."


Dahua is among the Chinese companies included on the Commerce Department's entity list for its ties to "human rights violations and abuses in the implementation of China's campaign of repression" against Uighurs, a Turkic ethnic group. The U.S. doesn't restrict American companies such as Amazon from buying from businesses on the entity list, though it urges caution. Companies on the entity list are barred from purchasing American products.

Menendez and Rubio asked whether Amazon knew Dahua was on the entity list when it was considering entering into a contract with the company and whether that came up in its deliberations. According to a Reuters report, Dahua sold 1,500 thermal imaging cameras to Amazon in a deal estimated to be worth close to $10 million.

"If these allegations against Dahua are true, it would mean that Amazon willfully ignored guidance from the United States government and purchased equipment from an entity-listed company that is complicit in China's atrocities against" the Uighurs, read the joint letter addressed to Bezos. "While buying equipment from Dahua Technology is not illegal, it does raise several questions for you, as the chief executive of Amazon."

On Wednesday, Dahua said in a statement that the documents referenced by The Times and in a separate report by the video surveillance news outlet IPVM were "historical internal software design documents."

"Dahua will not provide the features or applications in the software products in the future," the statement said. "Dahua will conduct a rigorous internal review and strengthen the design review process and management of the company's Research and Development functions."

Dahua said it "does not provide products and services for ethnicity detection" in the "regional markets reported by the media."

The Times report mentioned an Australian business that will cut ties with Dahua after noticing a race-identifying feature in its software, and an American contract holder unaware of the company's designation on the entity list.

Dahua did not address whether these features are functional in other markets.

The company also said total sales in "relevant regional markets ... have been declining rapidly on a yearly basis."

Amazon did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

"These reports are extremely disturbing and show that the comprehensive surveillance system that Chinese authorities have deployed against the [Uighurs] is just as bad as we had feared, if not worse," the senators wrote in the letter.

Johana Bhuiyan is a business reporter at the Los Angeles Times covering the technology industry with a focus on accountability.

Edit: For example apparently Xinjiang is a huge manufacturer of solar panels. It feels like it'd be worth looking for (and if necessary) funding alternatives because it's  quite possibly going to be an issue untangling whether or not they were made using forced labour.

[Monoriu]

Boris Johnson says he is 'fervently Sinophile,' seeks to improve China-UK economic ties

UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson recently declared that he is "fervently Sinophile" during a Downing Street round table with Chinese businesses to mark the Chinese Lunar New Year.

Johnson told those who gathered at the February 12 event that he wants to resume formal trade discussions between China and the UK by reactivating the Economic and Financial Dialogue and the China-UK Joint Trade and Economic Commission, a report published in the Guardian said. However, no date has been set for the resumption of either forum.

https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-02-22/UK-PM-Boris-Johnson-says-he-is-fervently-Sinophile--Y5Kvctu9Ik/index.html

[Syt]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-hongkong-economy/hong-kong-dropped-from-economic-freedom-index-as-policies-controlled-from-beijing-idUSKBN2AW0OI

Hong Kong dropped from Economic Freedom Index as policies 'controlled from Beijing'

HONG KONG (Reuters) - Hong Kong has been excluded from the Heritage Foundation's Index of Economic Freedom because its economic policies are controlled from Beijing, the Washington-based think tank said, removing Hong Kong from a list it topped for 25 years up to 2019.

The title of the world's freest economy for 2021 was retained by Singapore for the second year, the Heritage Foundation said, with Hong Kong's investment freedom hurt by political and social unrest dating back to 2019.

In the 2021 index published on Thursday, the foundation said Hong Kong and Macau, both special administrative regions of China, were no longer included because even though citizens enjoy more economic freedom than the average resident of China, "developments in recent years have demonstrated unambiguously that those policies are ultimately controlled from Beijing".

Developments in Hong Kong or Macau that are relevant to economic freedom would be considered in the context of China's evaluation in the index, it added. China slipped to 107 from 103, among the list of 178 countries.

A spokesman for the Hong Kong government's financial secretary expressed "deep disappointment" at the decision.

"The decision is neither warranted nor justified. It does not do justice to (Hong Kong)," the spokesman said, adding that the claim that the city's economic policies are controlled by Beijing is "ill-conceived and simply not true".

He added that the assessment was "politically biased" and that Hong Kong's core economic competitiveness, including free flow of capital, remains under the "one country, two systems" formula of governance put in place in 1997 when the city reverted from British to Chinese rule.

The U.S. suspended Hong Kong's preferential tariff rates for exports to the country and imposed sanctions on Hong Kong and Beijing officials last year in response to China's imposition of a national security law on the former British colony, saying it undermined the city's high autonomy.

Critics of the law say it is aimed at crushing dissent, while authorities in Beijing and Hong Kong say it was necessary to restore stability after anti-government and anti-China unrest.

Earlier this week, London-based non-governmental organisation Hong Kong Watch said in a report that "red capital" - money originating from mainland China - had fundamentally shaped Hong Kong's politics, media and the city's status as a business hub.

In 2019, 82% of IPOs in Hong Kong were by mainland companies, while in October 2020, mainland equities comprised 57.3% of the Hang Seng Index by weighting, the group said.

[Josquius]

Wasn't it just a page or two back Mono saying this would never happen?