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Another Raz history question: medieval armor

Started by Razgovory, January 16, 2012, 08:48:22 AM

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Razgovory

#45
January 16, 2012, 07:58:38 PM
I do not think that modern warfare and medieval warfare were very much alike.  For instance, Knights didn't have to worry IEDs.  Knights also trained alot but rarely got into big fights.  Siegey has probably seen more combat in one tour then an average knight would see in his whole life.  The knights battles might be more intense though.  For instance, an English Civil War known as the Anarchy lasted about 17 years but only saw something like four or five major field battles.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

PDH

#46
January 16, 2012, 08:16:43 PM
Knights got a lot of practice running down civilians though. Sure they weren't major battles, but much of Medieval Warfare was raiding and destroying farming implements (i.e. peasants).  Pleanty of practice there.
I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.
-Umberto Eco

-------
"I'm pretty sure my level of depression has nothing to do with how much of a fucking asshole you are."

-CdM

Caliga

#47
January 16, 2012, 08:59:13 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on January 16, 2012, 06:18:52 PM
I suspect modern reproduction mail is lighter then mail used in the middle ages.  I imagine they use lighter alloys now.  Hardness is not important in a reproduction, while it was at that time.  Quality was probably spotty though.
My suit of lorica hamata is made from iron chain that is supposedly an accurate copy of the original.  The chainmail you typically see in Hollywood is definitely fake, though (I think it might be made from plastic).
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PDH

#48
January 16, 2012, 09:43:02 PM
The reproduction chainmail (admittedly not trying to represent BCE/Ancient armor, but Medieval armor) I have seen has often been steel, to cut down on the rusting.  It was still of weights that were what people think the armor was.
I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.
-Umberto Eco

-------
"I'm pretty sure my level of depression has nothing to do with how much of a fucking asshole you are."

-CdM

Ideologue

#49
January 17, 2012, 01:32:07 AM Last Edit: January 17, 2012, 01:37:18 AM by Ideologue
Man, I carried 100 pounds over my shoulder for about 20 feet earlier today and I could really feel it in my legs and spine.  Granted, it wasn't very well balanced, and I doubt assault packs are shaped like bags of flour.

P.S. my own pussitude notwithstanding, there is no way WWI infantry were carrying 250 pounds.  Maybe WWI pack animals.
Kinemalogue
Current reviews: The 'Burbs (9/10); Gremlins 2: The New Batch (9/10); John Wick: Chapter 2 (9/10); A Cure For Wellness (4/10)

11B4V

#50
January 17, 2012, 02:20:16 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on January 17, 2012, 01:32:07 AM

P.S. my own pussitude notwithstanding, there is no way WWI infantry were carrying 250 pounds.  Maybe WWI pack animals.

I find this extremely hard to believe too.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Razgovory

#51
January 17, 2012, 02:21:00 AM
I was thinking that it's probably made from Stainless steel, rather then a harder steel.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Razgovory

#52
January 17, 2012, 02:22:29 AM
I found the Italians friendly, if dirty and untrustworthy.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

jimmy olsen

#53
January 17, 2012, 02:28:23 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on January 17, 2012, 02:22:29 AM
I found the Italians friendly, if dirty and untrustworthy.
Was this supposed to go in the Scorpio thread?
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
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Razgovory

#54
January 17, 2012, 02:31:00 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 17, 2012, 02:28:23 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on January 17, 2012, 02:22:29 AM
I found the Italians friendly, if dirty and untrustworthy.
Was this supposed to go in the Scorpio thread?

Yes, I believe so. Ah well.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

11B4V

#55
January 17, 2012, 03:34:16 AM
TABLE I
Loads Carried by Various Units
and/or Carried at Various Times*
UNIT Weight(kil
French Poilu (WWI) 39
British Infantry on the Somme (WWI) 30
French Foreign Legion (WWI) 45
Wingate's Chindits (WWII) 32-41
U.S. Forces in North Africa (WWII) 60
U.S. Marines in Korea 38
U.S. in Vietnam** 34
Falklands Campaign 54

http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA212050
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Ideologue

#56
January 17, 2012, 03:38:24 AM
Clearly that table does not take into account the metal lathe, sack of coal, and miniature pony each infantryman had to carry into battle during the Great War.
Kinemalogue
Current reviews: The 'Burbs (9/10); Gremlins 2: The New Batch (9/10); John Wick: Chapter 2 (9/10); A Cure For Wellness (4/10)

11B4V

#57
January 17, 2012, 03:41:22 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on January 17, 2012, 03:38:24 AM
Clearly that table does not take into account the metal lathe, sack of coal, and miniature pony each infantryman had to carry into battle during the Great War.

:D
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Ideologue

#58
January 17, 2012, 03:44:26 AM Last Edit: January 17, 2012, 03:47:18 AM by Ideologue
In fairness, the Legion Etrangere is still carrying a shitload of weight.  Right at 100 pounds.  Falklands, even more.  And what the fuck were Americans in North Africa lugging on their backs?  Their wives?  Their fat wives?
Kinemalogue
Current reviews: The 'Burbs (9/10); Gremlins 2: The New Batch (9/10); John Wick: Chapter 2 (9/10); A Cure For Wellness (4/10)

11B4V

#59
January 17, 2012, 03:54:14 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on January 17, 2012, 03:44:26 AM
In fairness, the Legion Etrangere is still carrying a shitload of weight.  Right at 100 pounds.  Falklands, even more.  And what the fuck were Americans in North Africa lugging on their backs?  Their wives?  Their fat wives?

Fat moroccan women.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".
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