Have you Ever Personally Known a Murderer?

[Habbaku]

It is the job of judges to impose sentences as appropriate.  If a judge imposes inappropriate sentences, then he should be fired (and possibly executed).

[Stonewall]

I know a dozen or so.  The most interesting of whom was this guy.  Went into the woods, and killed 2 campers with an AK-47. 

Any particular reason, or were campers just in season?

I think it was more a matter of they just happened to be the people he came across.  It was textbook random act of violence done for no real reason other than that he could.

Did you get him off?

We considered life in prison in lieu of the death penalty a victory.

[DGuller]

We considered life in prison in lieu of the death penalty a victory.

At least your client didn't aim low.

[viper37]

Then you need new judges or new laws, that don't involve minimum sentences.  When you set minimum sentences you end up with a 17 year old boy spending 5 years in prison for having consensual sex with his 16 year old girlfriend.   My problem is that the minimum sentences don't give the judge ANY leeway in sentencing, they are the experts in deciding the law, the legislators are the "experts" (used very loosely) in writing the laws.

No, you can't have 17 yr old boy spending 5 yrs in prison for that.  Legal age of consent is 16, and for 14-16 a tolerance of 5 years is applied.  Meaning a 19y.o. with a 14 y.o. is ok.

We're talking real rape here, and real pedophiles.

[viper37]

The Bloc is defending my position.  Mandatory sentencing is evil.

I became a Conservative supporter.  And Neil became a Bloc supporter.  Who would have though this possible?

[Neil]

The Bloc is defending my position.  Mandatory sentencing is evil.

I became a Conservative supporter.  And Neil became a Bloc supporter.  Who would have though this possible?

Perhaps the Bloc became Neil supporters.

At any rate, my position has long been that mandatory sentencing is utterly without merit.  If one cannot trust a judge to impose a sentence that is within the sphere of what is appropriate, then that judge should simply be removed from the bench.

[Tonitrus]

The Bloc is defending my position.  Mandatory sentencing is evil.

I became a Conservative supporter.  And Neil became a Bloc supporter.  Who would have though this possible?

Perhaps the Bloc became Neil supporters.

At any rate, my position has long been that mandatory sentencing is utterly without merit.  If one cannot trust a judge to impose a sentence that is within the sphere of what is appropriate, then that judge should simply be removed from the bench.

Agreed.  Take it too much further, and you might as well do away with judges altogether.  Let some crazy judge hand out 5-day sentences to murderers...that's what mobs with pitchforks are for.

[sbr]

Then you need new judges or new laws, that don't involve minimum sentences.  When you set minimum sentences you end up with a 17 year old boy spending 5 years in prison for having consensual sex with his 16 year old girlfriend.   My problem is that the minimum sentences don't give the judge ANY leeway in sentencing, they are the experts in deciding the law, the legislators are the "experts" (used very loosely) in writing the laws.

No, you can't have 17 yr old boy spending 5 yrs in prison for that.  Legal age of consent is 16, and for 14-16 a tolerance of 5 years is applied.  Meaning a 19y.o. with a 14 y.o. is ok.

We're talking real rape here, and real pedophiles.

My example is something I pulled out of my ass, based on my mis-remembering of this case.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/law/10/26/wilson.freed/index.html

Genarlow Wilson was released from prison Friday, after spending more than two years behind bars for a teen sex conviction.

"I've got a new life," Genarlow Wilson tells reporters after being released Friday.

"At times I dealt with adversity ... my family and myself, we finally get to deal with happiness now," Wilson said, with his mother and sister at his side.

The Georgia Supreme Court earlier Friday ordered that he be released, ruling 4-3 that his sentence was cruel and unusual punishment.

Wilson, 21, was convicted in 2005 of having oral sex with a consenting 15-year-old girl when he was 17.

A 17 year old was sentenced to 10 years in prison for having consensual oral sex with a 15 year old in the state of Georgia.  He was eventually freed after serving 2.

These minimum sentencing laws always start out being about "real rape" and "real pedophiles", but next thing you know something like that happens because we have let the legislators do the judges' jobs.

[Barrister]

The Bloc is defending my position.  Mandatory sentencing is evil.

I became a Conservative supporter.  And Neil became a Bloc supporter.  Who would have though this possible?

Perhaps the Bloc became Neil supporters.

At any rate, my position has long been that mandatory sentencing is utterly without merit.  If one cannot trust a judge to impose a sentence that is within the sphere of what is appropriate, then that judge should simply be removed from the bench.

There is no constitutional way to remove a judge for giving a low sentence.

Hence the need for mandatory minimums.

[dps]

Then you need new judges or new laws, that don't involve minimum sentences.  When you set minimum sentences you end up with a 17 year old boy spending 5 years in prison for having consensual sex with his 16 year old girlfriend.   My problem is that the minimum sentences don't give the judge ANY leeway in sentencing, they are the experts in deciding the law, the legislators are the "experts" (used very loosely) in writing the laws.

No, you can't have 17 yr old boy spending 5 yrs in prison for that.  Legal age of consent is 16, and for 14-16 a tolerance of 5 years is applied.  Meaning a 19y.o. with a 14 y.o. is ok.

We're talking real rape here, and real pedophiles.

My example is something I pulled out of my ass, based on my mis-remembering of this case.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/law/10/26/wilson.freed/index.html

Genarlow Wilson was released from prison Friday, after spending more than two years behind bars for a teen sex conviction.

"I've got a new life," Genarlow Wilson tells reporters after being released Friday.

"At times I dealt with adversity ... my family and myself, we finally get to deal with happiness now," Wilson said, with his mother and sister at his side.

The Georgia Supreme Court earlier Friday ordered that he be released, ruling 4-3 that his sentence was cruel and unusual punishment.

Wilson, 21, was convicted in 2005 of having oral sex with a consenting 15-year-old girl when he was 17.

A 17 year old was sentenced to 10 years in prison for having consensual oral sex with a 15 year old in the state of Georgia.  He was eventually freed after serving 2.

These minimum sentencing laws always start out being about "real rape" and "real pedophiles", but next thing you know something like that happens because we have let the legislators do the judges' jobs.

Again, the problem isn't with mandatory sentencing;  the problem is that what he did shouldn't have been criminal in the first place (assuming that it was consenual, etc.).