Elon Musk: Always A Douche

[Admiral Yi]

Why don't you do an actual search of the history of the medical study of sex change procedures, rather than trying to find the Google page that will confirm your assumption?

Because PJL told me to Wiki it.

[Admiral Yi]

Or, wild idea, maybe leave the decisions to the trans person and the medical professionals they see.

I do, unless I'm asked to pick up the tab.

[Sophie Scholl]

Or, wild idea, maybe leave the decisions to the trans person and the medical professionals they see.

I do, unless I'm asked to pick up the tab.

I will never understand that worldview and sense of entitlement and, honestly, I don't even know how to properly engage with those who hold it. To me, one of the fundamental parts of existing in a society is understanding that what you contribute is toward a common pool of resources that allows for the most good to occur for the most people, even if I don't happen to see or benefit from it. The Libertarian mindset you seem to hold on this topic and numerous others is fundamentally alien to me. 

[Admiral Yi]

I will never understand that worldview and sense of entitlement and, honestly, I don't even know how to properly engage with those who hold it. To me, one of the fundamental parts of existing in a society is understanding that what you contribute is toward a common pool of resources that allows for the most good to occur for the most people, even if I don't happen to see or benefit from it. The Libertarian mindset you seem to hold on this topic and numerous others is fundamentally alien to me. 

I don't see what entitlement has to do with anything.  I'm "entitled" to one vote, exactly the same as every other citizen.  Is wanting to exercise my vote evidence of a sense of entitlement?

Different people have different opinions on what spending priorities generate the most good for the most people.  Those different opinions are adjudicated through the democratic process.

I don't believe in using the taxing and spending authority of the government to generate the most good for the most people.  I'm a classical liberal.  I believe in using the government to provide public goods such as national defense and crime prevention. Providing a sex change operation is not generally speaking a public good.

[Tamas]

Or, wild idea, maybe leave the decisions to the trans person and the medical professionals they see.

I do, unless I'm asked to pick up the tab.

I will never understand that worldview and sense of entitlement and, honestly, I don't even know how to properly engage with those who hold it. To me, one of the fundamental parts of existing in a society is understanding that what you contribute is toward a common pool of resources that allows for the most good to occur for the most people, even if I don't happen to see or benefit from it. The Libertarian mindset you seem to hold on this topic and numerous others is fundamentally alien to me. 

Completely independent of Yi's original point, whatever that might have been, but the same way his "budgetary" attitude is one extreme, yours can also be damaging as well. It is healthy for a society to have the citizens consider tax funds as their own, because it is. The alternative thst can develop is that they start thinking it's money from the money tree granted to them by their leaders.

The shortsightedness in Yi's position comes from thinking that helping vulnerable people from these communal funds is some kind of selfless charity that they don't want to sign up for. However it is not that if it is kept on reasonable levels. Rather it is (or should be) a self-interest for the "haves" with stake in the status quo to ensure that status quo persists.

[Admiral Yi]

What, rebellion insurance?

[Razgovory]

Also, to Raz's comment: I don't *need* hormones, but my life is far, far more livable with them. I chose to have a gender affirming surgery performed after numerous doctors and medical professionals signed off on it and gave me clearance. It allowed me to abandon medications that had damaging long-term effects for the trade-off of having HRT (hormone replacement therapy) be a more vital part of my treatment plan. Just as, in theory, you could live without any medications you are on, your life is much improved with said medications, correct?

I could have sworn you said something about how the end of treatments could kill you.  I perhaps I remember wrong.

[Tamas]

What, rebellion insurance?

What else do you think the origin of welfare policies was?

[DGuller]

What, rebellion insurance?

Yes, in a way.  I was a listening to a podcast last night about Roman Empire, and the historian who was a guest argued that the reason Roman Republican eventually fell and became an empire is that too few of the Roman citizens shared in the success of the rapidly expanding entity, and too many citizens were resentful for one reason or another.

I think in general it's good to remember that all principles of governance, no matter how natural you think they are, are in place only because enough of the population supports them.  It doesn't matter what the constitution, thought experiments, or philosophies say, at the end of the day humans are just animals who agree to subject themselves to the power of the structure that organizes them in exchange for benefits for themselves.  If enough people perceive that the current iteration of their organization is all take and no give, and that the benefits of that organization are captured by too few among them and become resentful of that, they'll be receptive to ideas that they should be organized differently.

[Jacob]

Government relies on the consent of the governed (however that consent is obtained).

[Sheilbh]

Government relies on the consent of the governed (however that consent is obtained).

Or an awful lot of coercion.

[Sophie Scholl]

I could have sworn you said something about how the end of treatments could kill you.  I perhaps I remember wrong.

I mean, it would make me an absolute depressive wreck and destroy any sense of joy I can muster, but it wouldn't technically kill my body. Would such an "existence" very likely drive me to making a life ending choice? Yes. In that regard it would lead to my death.

[Valmy]

Government relies on the consent of the governed (however that consent is obtained).

Or an awful lot of coercion.

I mean that is how consent is sometimes obtained.

All of human society includes a lot of coercion.

[Admiral Yi]

What else do you think the origin of welfare policies was?

OK.  Then it becomes an optimization question.  What is the absolute minimum amount of free money that will prevent rebellion.

[Josquius]

Rebellion is a pretty low bar to set.
What about just crime?