Italian Politics

[The Larch]

The "only" problem for that is that Forza Italia is going to be the junior-est partner in the three-way government coalition, and their coalition arrangement establishes that the party that gets the most votes will be the one to put forward the PM (although that's actually a presidential prerrogative), and it'll be FdI for sure. Polls put FdI in the mid 20s%, Lega in the mid 10s% (down from the high 30s% from a few years ago, most of the FdI growth has been at the expense of, mostly, the Lega, and the M5S to a lesser degree), and Forza Italia barely scratching 10%.

And even the 1st Berlusconi government in the 90s was brought down by the Lega. 

[Sheilbh]

I know. I just keep imagining that Berlusconi goes into every meeting with the FdI and Lega pitching himself as the PM.

You need someone who's an acceptable face and known quantity to the world. You want someone who can keep a coalition together etc

[The Larch]

I know. I just keep imagining that Berlusconi goes into every meeting with the FdI and Lega pitching himself as the PM.

You need someone who's an acceptable face and known quantity to the world. You want someone who can keep a coalition together etc

He should lobby the Italian president for that. In a "And who are you going to nominate for PM? Meloni? Are you crazy? Salvini? You must be joking. Look, I know what I'm talking about, I've been there before..." kind of way. 

[celedhring]

You guys are making me picture what the Italian version of "Borgen" would be like 

[Crazy_Ivan80]

You need someone to hold together a fissiparious right-wing coalition and get Lega to serve a full term you say....





Edit: Total aside but every recent picture I see of Berlusconi and he looks like Max Headroom. It's like a human has decided to travel the uncanny valley.

that's the puppet from Tussauds right?

[The Larch]

You guys are making me picture what the Italian version of "Borgen" would be like 

You have experience with the country, give it a try. 

[Oexmelin]

You guys are making me picture what the Italian version of "Borgen" would be like 

Il Divo:
https://youtu.be/cw-qm-liCPA

[Sheilbh]

An incredible film.

And given it's a film about Italian politics - it has a far better soundtrack than it should

Edit: I went to see it when it came out in cinemas here and I remember the cinema I went to had a little primer on who was who which was really useful and made the film so much more accessible to me and others. It was a lovely touch.

[The Larch]

Edit: I went to see it when it came out in cinemas here and I remember the cinema I went to had a little primer on who was who which was really useful and made the film so much more accessible to me and others. It was a lovely touch.

That's a good touch, IIRC basically every single character in the film are real historical people, basically the entire Italian political elite of the early 90s is there (and the mafia bosses, of course), and unless you lived that era in Italy and were politically minded I don't think anyone could recognize who is who.

[The Larch]

Apparently the elections only cracked 51% turnout at 19h, I guess it's on track to be the lowest participation general elections in Italian history.

[Sheilbh]

Apparently the elections only cracked 51% turnout at 19h, I guess it's on track to be the lowest participation general elections in Italian history.

Well you need to go back to the 2008 general election to find a term that doesn't end up with a technocratic government. I can see how that might not inspire democratic participation.

[Josquius]

So how long are we stuck with the fascists?

I have heard the reason they won is they're the only opposition party. But still. Dangerous times. Putin sees a light.

[Sheilbh]

Only opposition party is part of it - I think I said they'd be the obvious beneficiaries of another technica government backed by all the other parties. Because that is the obvious result of one party staying out.

The FdI are the least pro-Putin of the right coalition. Which is key. This is the same constellation of forces (Forza, Lega, post-fascists) as governed Italy in the late 90s, most of the 00s and early 10s. They're even elected with, in many respects, similar messaging and a similar constituency (that the opposition to that hasn't found an alternative message in the last thirty years is both an indictment and a big part of why we're here, again).

The question, I suppose, is to what extent will the same forces and same patterns of a Berlisconi government recur, and to what extent will Meloni manage to do something different (and more dangerous).

[The Larch]

Apparently the elections only cracked 51% turnout at 19h, I guess it's on track to be the lowest participation general elections in Italian history.

Well you need to go back to the 2008 general election to find a term that doesn't end up with a technocratic government. I can see how that might not inspire democratic participation.

Turnout has been going down for a while, but it'd still be in the 70s or 80s % for general elections. In 2018 turnout was 73%, and it was already the lowest ever.

I have heard the reason they won is they're the only opposition party. But still. Dangerous times. Putin sees a light.

Being the only true oposition party to the Draghi government did give them a position that allowed them to punch way beyond their weight, yeah. They only got like 4% in the 2018 elections.

[Tamas]

Exit poll shows 41-45% for these people: