Russo-Ukrainian War 2014-23 and Invasion

[Josquius]

I wonder if those mega solar farms in Morocco, feeding the European Market, have become economic now.

[Zanza]

Yeah - and I've already read about companies in Europe shutting down production due to gas prices (which is at a level that'd be the equivalent of $600 per barrel in oil). Add that sort of impact in manufacturing that relies on gas to all the direct economic impacts of this war on food, energy and fertiliser and there's going to be a huge impact on economies and cost of living.

In Germany that seems to be mainly metallurgy, where gas is used to melt ores, and chemical processes, e.g. producing ammonium for fertilizer etc. Fairly limited to these energy intensive industries.
The high price of oil (especially diesel) has a much broader impact on all sectors of the economy. 

It's why I think - and hope - that the EU will move to some form of common debt to help alleviate the issue. But more generally for these sanctions to be durable western politicians need to be thinking about how to mitigte the cost of living impact on their citizens.

At least here that's already being implemented. Mainly tax reductions on energy etc.

The other thing I find slightly interesting is what the Economist wrote about this week around the lack of asking citizens to make adjustments. I think it's really interesting because everywhere in Europe there is huge public opinion on the side of supporting Ukraine and sanctioning Russia. We've also just had the experience of incredibly sweeping and intrusive adjustments to everyone's life to deal with covid - which had very broad voluntary compliance (and would be impossible to enforce otherwise). I'm surprised politicians across Europe haven't asked for their citizens to, for example, turn down their thermostat by 1.5 to help reduce reliance on Russian gas. Given that people want to do something it feels plausible that many would and it would cut the need for Russian gas by more than 10% which is not nothing when the EU is aiming to end 2/3s of the Russian gas by year end.

The invisible hand of the market will do this anyway...

[The Brain]

I wonder if those mega solar farms in Morocco, feeding the European Market, have become economic now.

Making the lights of Europe depend on the political stability of North Africa may not be a great idea.

[Zanza]

I wonder if those mega solar farms in Morocco, feeding the European Market, have become economic now.

Making the lights of Europe depend on the political stability of North Africa may not be a great idea.

I just wanted to write something similar. Let's develop our own capabilities, even if they might be slightly less efficient.

[The Larch]

Here in Spain most of our gas comes from Algeria, and it's been reliable. Italy also receives significant amounts of Gas from there.

[celedhring]

Spain has huge spare LNG capacity. I've seen it claimed we have a third of all LNG processing capacity in the EU and that Barcelona is the largest LNG port in Europe. Sadly, our connections with the rest of Europe are a bottleneck.

[celedhring]

Regarding Northern Africa, I do wonder whether Spain's sudden U-turn on the status of Sahara as something to do with all this affair - although it has greatly annoyed Algeria.

[Sahib]

Read an interview with some Polish volunteers of the Ukrainian International Legion:

- they're there illegally, as getting an official permission would take like 3 months. Were warned about possible legal consequences by the Polish military intelligence.
- For now, they're only accepting people with a lot of experience (former special forces, or at least peacekeeping missions).
- However, Ukrainians are taking heavy casualties and they except the recruiting standards to be relaxed to replace the losses.
- They were based in Javorov when it was hit, 5 guys quit after surviving the attack.
- Most of them are still kept in the rear, but already seen some heavy shit while going out with the humanitarian aid. Mariupol and Kharkiv reduced to ruins, sick children, massacred bodies.

[Zanza]

Here in Spain most of our gas comes from Algeria, and it's been reliable. Italy also receives significant amounts of Gas from there.

Reliability was (and currently is) not the problem with Russian gas. 

[jimmy olsen]

Ukraine requests 500 javelin and stinger missiles per day

That's a lot of ammunition.

They're just asking for big numbers, so that even the negotiated down number they agree on is still large.

I doubt that, war always eat up gigantic amounts of materiel. They will soon need a lot of cargo, I hope our factories are ramping up as we speak.

Ukraine is fighting a total war, they have manpower for an army of millions and an army of millions need a metric fuckton of materiel.

Aren't Javelins guided missiles? With this kind of hit rate, there's no need for 500 missiles a day.

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/how-small-ukraine-force-is-killing-russian-tanks-with-us-javelin-missiles-2803289#:~:text=east%20European%20nation.-,At%20least%20280%20Russian%20armoured%20vehicles%20have%20been%20destroyed%20with,93%20per%20cent%20kill%20rate.

At least 280 Russian armoured vehicles have been destroyed with the American Javelin missile, out of 300 shots fired, journalist Jack Murphy said in an article quoting a US Special Operations official.

That is a 93 per cent kill rate.

[The Larch]

Spain has huge spare LNG capacity. I've seen it claimed we have a third of all LNG processing capacity in the EU and that Barcelona is the largest LNG port in Europe. Sadly, our connections with the rest of Europe are a bottleneck.

Yeah, out of the 10 largest LNG terminals in Europe, 5 are in Spain (Barcelona, Cartagena, Huelva, Bilbao and Sagunto), and Barcelona is indeed Europe's largest one. The rest of the big LNG terminals are spread around France, Netherlands and Belgium. Germany, which IIRC does not currently have any LNG terminals, has just announced a project to build its first one, but I think it'll not have as much capacity as the already existing ones.

[The Larch]

Regarding Northern Africa, I do wonder whether Spain's sudden U-turn on the status of Sahara as something to do with all this affair - although it has greatly annoyed Algeria.

Don't think so, I'd say it's mostly for other domestic issues, but maybe we should bring back the "shit in Spain" thread for that discussion. 

[The Larch]

Here in Spain most of our gas comes from Algeria, and it's been reliable. Italy also receives significant amounts of Gas from there.

Reliability was (and currently is) not the problem with Russian gas. 

Then why bring up the issue of political stability in Northern Africa?

[Threviel]

Ukraine requests 500 javelin and stinger missiles per day

That's a lot of ammunition.

They're just asking for big numbers, so that even the negotiated down number they agree on is still large.

I doubt that, war always eat up gigantic amounts of materiel. They will soon need a lot of cargo, I hope our factories are ramping up as we speak.

Ukraine is fighting a total war, they have manpower for an army of millions and an army of millions need a metric fuckton of materiel.

Aren't Javelins guided missiles? With this kind of hit rate, there's no need for 500 missiles a day.

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/how-small-ukraine-force-is-killing-russian-tanks-with-us-javelin-missiles-2803289#:~:text=east%20European%20nation.-,At%20least%20280%20Russian%20armoured%20vehicles%20have%20been%20destroyed%20with,93%20per%20cent%20kill%20rate.

At least 280 Russian armoured vehicles have been destroyed with the American Javelin missile, out of 300 shots fired, journalist Jack Murphy said in an article quoting a US Special Operations official.

That is a 93 per cent kill rate.

They have something like an army of 2-300k, say 100 brigades. They are presumably mobilizing at top speed to a mass army. That mass army need equipment, they can't fight with only AK-47s. It's not necessarily that they use 500 a day now, but when their army is five to ten times as large they will need a lot of stuff for their new and shiny 400 brigade army.*

*Statistics from the department of stuffed pulled straight from my ass.

[Josquius]

I wonder if those mega solar farms in Morocco, feeding the European Market, have become economic now.

Making the lights of Europe depend on the political stability of North Africa may not be a great idea.

I just wanted to write something similar. Let's develop our own capabilities, even if they might be slightly less efficient.

It's not just efficiency, space as well.
Far better to have a bunch of panels in a useless desert than in place of a forest.

The issue is the numbers haven't quite made sense yet. With the rise in energy prices they might well be.