:hmm:
Quote
http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/13/us/ntsb-cell-phone-ban/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
NTSB recommends full ban on use of cell phones while driving
Washington (CNN) -- A federal safety board called Tuesday for a nationwide ban on the use of cell phones and text messaging devices while driving.
The recommendation is the most far-reaching yet by the National Transportation Safety Board, which in the past 10 years has increasingly sought to limit the use of portable electronic devices -- recommending bans for novice drivers, school bus drivers and commercial truckers. Tuesday's recommendation, if adopted by states, would outlaw non-emergency phone calls and texting by operators of every vehicle on the road.
It would apply to hands-free as well as hand-held devices, but devices installed in the vehicle by the manufacturer would be allowed, the NTSB said. The recommendation would not affect passengers' rights to use such devices.
NTSB members say the action is necessary to combat a growing threat posed by distracted drivers. While distracted driving has been a problem "since the Model T," in the words of NTSB Chairwoman Deborah Hersman, authorities say it has become ubiquitous with the explosion in the number of portable smart phones. At any given daylight moment, some 13.5 million drivers are on hand-held phones, according to a study released last week by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
Some 3,092 roadway fatalities last year involved distracted drivers, although the actual number may be far higher, NHTSA said.
"This (distracted driving) is becoming the new DUI. It's becoming epidemic," said NTSB member Robert Sumwalt.
Accident investigators routinely seek protective orders to preserve smart phones for use as evidence in accident investigations, Hersman said.
But because distracted drivers sometimes do not own up to their actions, or because they die during the crash, determining whether distraction was a factor in an accident can be difficult.
That was the case in a 2010 chain-reaction accident near Gray Summit, Missouri. During the 11 minutes prior to that incident, the driver of a pickup truck received five text messages, and sent six, and he was seen leaning over just before the accident, leading investigators to believe the driver was likely distracted when his truck plowed at 55 mph into the rear of a tractor trailer, which had slowed or stopped because of a highway work zone. Two school buses then plowed into the wreckage. Two people -- including the pickup truck driver and a bus occupant -- were killed; 38 other people were injured.
The driver of the pickup truck was 19 years old, and was in violation of a Missouri law prohibiting drivers under the age of 21 from texting while driving. But the safety board focused little on the age of the driver, casting "distracted driving" as epidemic among people of all ages.
The NTSB said cell phone laws alone would not solve the problem, but must be accompanied by aggressive educational campaigns and strict enforcement. The Missouri State Highway Patrol had issued only 120 citations for texting in a two-year-period, the NTSB said.
Currently, a patchwork of laws governs cell-phone usage by drivers. Some 35 states ban text messaging while driving, 30 states ban cell-phone use by novice drivers, and 10 ban all use of hand-held cell phones, according to the NTSB.
The safety board also recommended the electronics industry develop phones that would discourage their use by drivers, but could identify a car occupant's location so that passengers could use the devices.
A Virginia Tech Transportation Institute study of commercial drivers found that a safety-critical event is 163 times more likely if a driver is texting, e-mailing or accessing the Internet.
The NTSB's action is a recommendation only, but the board has been instrumental in leading for changes in other areas of transportation safety.
Chairwoman Hersman said the ban may inconvenience motorists, but would save lives.
"Needless lives are lost on our highways, and for what? Convenience? Death isn't convenient," Hersman said. "So we can stay more connected? A fatal accident severs that connection."
The NTSB's investigation of the August 5, 2010, Missouri crash also exposed numerous other safety shortcomings.
Although Missouri requires school bus inspections twice a year -- one by the highway patrol and a second by a certified inspection station -- an inspection 10 days before the accident did not reveal faulty brakes on one of the buses, the NTSB said. The faulty brakes were not a factor in the accident, the NTSB said, because the driver said she did not hit the brakes before the crash.
But the NTSB criticized the service station that inspected the brakes, the contract owner of the school buses, and the highway patrol. The highway patrol gave the bus company a "Total Fleet Maintenance Award" before the accident because 100% of its buses had passed inspection. In an unannounced inspection following the tragedy, the pass rate dropped to 60%, the NTSB said.
The NTSB said both the inspection station and the highway patrol performed inadequate inspections.
That's a very sensible decision. Everybody should be made to buy the overpriced good value telephony installations from car manufacturers. ;)
QuoteNTSB members say the action is necessary to combat a growing threat posed by distracted drivers. While distracted driving has been a problem "since the Model T," in the words of NTSB Chairwoman Deborah Hersman, authorities say it has become ubiquitous with the explosion in the number of portable smart phones. At any given daylight moment, some 13.5 million drivers are on hand-held phones, according to a study released last week by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
Some 3,092 roadway fatalities last year involved distracted drivers, although the actual number may be far higher, NHTSA said.
I wonder if that stat is just those dietracted by cell phone calls, or all fatalities involving distracted drivers.
On a guess, I'd say that more accidents are caused by drivers who are distracted by fiddling with the radio/sound system controls than by those distracted by cell phones.
Just like seatbelt laws, another great opportunity for pretextual stops. Law enforcement rejoices! :showoff:
I'm all for it; but allowing people to use the built-in manufacturers devices defeats the purpose. Talking on a cell phone, even a hands-free one, is still dangerous. It's different than talking to someone else in the car, because that other person is aware of the road conditions. For example. If you're chatting with a passenger in your car, and all of a sudden the car in front of you starts swerving side to side, the passenger is likely to stop talking whilst you try negotiate around a tricky situation. The person on the other side of a phone call is completely clueless and will continue discussing trivial information with you.
I drive the highway every day, and I see so much idiotic stuff out there, much of it has to do with distracted drivers (yes, including adjusting the radio, changing a CD).
How can you enforce such laws? I imagine just spotting someone using a cell phone is pretty hard, especially if the cop isn't driving alongside the car at the same speed.
Quote from: DGuller on December 13, 2011, 06:34:01 PM
How can you enforce such laws? I imagine just spotting someone using a cell phone is pretty hard, especially if the cop isn't driving alongside the car at the same speed.
Much easier at night, I'd guess.
Anyway - so when are we going to ban people reading maps while driving and people fiddling with their GPS's while driving?
In Wyoming this will be just like the seatbelt law - just an added fine for a legitimate stop. That's right, here they can't pull you over if you are playing with death and driving without your seatbelt on.
Quote from: DGuller on December 13, 2011, 06:34:01 PM
How can you enforce such laws? I imagine just spotting someone using a cell phone is pretty hard, especially if the cop isn't driving alongside the car at the same speed.
We'll just need to make talking to yourself illegal too, just to be safe.
Quote from: PDH on December 13, 2011, 06:43:31 PM
That's right, here they can't pull you over if you are playing with death and driving without your seatbelt on.
Mihali abhors the West.
Quote from: citizen k on December 13, 2011, 06:53:37 PM
Quote from: PDH on December 13, 2011, 06:43:31 PM
That's right, here they can't pull you over if you are playing with death and driving without your seatbelt on.
Mihali abhors the West.
(I was being sarcastic.) :secret:
Quote from: dps on December 13, 2011, 06:04:21 PM
On a guess, I'd say that more accidents are caused by drivers who are distracted by fiddling with the radio/sound system controls than by those distracted by cell phones.
Any decent car solves the sound system thing by having controls on the wheel though. Much harder to ensure proper focus when having a conversation on the phone.
As an aside, the automakers exemption is silly. A result of lobbying, perhaps?
Banned in the UK. Hands-free's allowed but I don't see why there should be a difference between bought and manufacturer.
I also hate the phrase 'safety-critical event' :bleeding:
Quote from: DGuller on December 13, 2011, 06:34:01 PM
How can you enforce such laws? I imagine just spotting someone using a cell phone is pretty hard, especially if the cop isn't driving alongside the car at the same speed.
Yeah...it is virtually impossible. All you need is tinted windows.
Quote from: DGuller on December 13, 2011, 06:34:01 PM
How can you enforce such laws? I imagine just spotting someone using a cell phone is pretty hard, especially if the cop isn't driving alongside the car at the same speed.
Much like seatbelt laws. I think the overall goal is that the law shifts what's socially acceptable (this has happened in the UK) and that it also has consequences for insurance claims.
Quote from: Josephus on December 13, 2011, 08:17:38 PM
Yeah...it is virtually impossible. All you need is tinted windows.
Or a phone with a proximity sensor at night, which is most smartphones.
Yeah, it's not going to accomplish the goal unless we also ban eating, indecisiveness, putting on makeup, smoking, children and pets--as well as enforcing proper lane usage, institute minimum speeds as well as maximum ones and create road etiquette, IQ and reflex tests in order to be allowed to use the road. Basically, pointless.
If one relies on two wheels to get about, stuff like this seems like mere frippery; one is acutely aware of the safety trade off for both ones own actions and those of others.
People who text while driving are stupid and will be distracted. People that don't wear a seat belt are stupid even if not distracted. People that are eating a burger while smoking and putting on make up talking on the phone and changing the radio station with 4 kids fighting in the back seat while driving are stupid and distracted.
But do we need the goverment to create yet another law? :mad: Don't we have enough laws to cover this? (even if most are not enforced anymay) Where is it going to end? :glare:
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on December 13, 2011, 10:04:35 PM
Yeah, it's not going to accomplish the goal unless we also ban eating, indecisiveness, putting on makeup, smoking, children and pets--as well as enforcing proper lane usage, institute minimum speeds as well as maximum ones and create road etiquette, IQ and reflex tests in order to be allowed to use the road. Basically, pointless.
We'd be much further ahead to just ban human drivers. Computers don't do any of these things. They also don't succumb to road rage and competitiveness.
Quote from: Iormlund on December 13, 2011, 07:43:09 PMAny decent car solves the sound system thing by having controls on the wheel though.
And modern cars will usually come with the option to have radio, satnav and telephone controlled by voice commands, so you never have to take the hands of the wheel or the eyes of the road.
QuoteAs an aside, the automakers exemption is silly. A result of lobbying, perhaps?
If the system is done well, a phone conversation shouldn't be more distracting than talking to a passenger.
The best way to do it would be to let individual citizens enforce it. By letting people drive sell phone users off the road or shoot out their windows.
Quote from: Razgovory on December 14, 2011, 05:03:59 PM
The best way to do it would be to let individual citizens enforce it. By letting people drive sell phone users off the road or shoot out their windows.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcarwarsuk.webs.com%2FCarWars_AutoDuel_compare.jpg&hash=d3f8363fce3d1d9e8dc4140b47780ba5785c654b)
:)
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
I disagree with your nanny state argument. Nanny state implies the state is looking after, baby sitting, the person not looking after himself.
But when I drive to work, I want to make sure that some asshole texting goodbye to his one-night stand doesn't smack into me, causing me to lose control and smack into a 16-wheel truck.
I don't give a shit about the guy texting. But, I do for myself.
Quote from: Razgovory on December 14, 2011, 05:03:59 PM
The best way to do it would be to let individual citizens enforce it. By letting people drive sell phone users off the road or shoot out their windows.
Yes.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on December 13, 2011, 06:25:41 PM
Just like seatbelt laws, another great opportunity for pretextual stops. Law enforcement rejoices! :showoff:
Rules are rules. Gives me the PC.
Quote from: 11B4V on December 14, 2011, 11:27:17 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on December 13, 2011, 06:25:41 PM
Just like seatbelt laws, another great opportunity for pretextual stops. Law enforcement rejoices! :showoff:
Rules are rules. Gives me the PC.
:D And cops are cops. :hug:
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
I thought traffic cops paid for themselves? :unsure:
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
How many wanted criminals are pulled over and nabbed during a routine traffic stops.
example...For not wearing seat belt or cellphone or rolling a stop sign/light or expired reg. or failing to signal or aggressive driving or illegal lane change...etc
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on December 15, 2011, 12:38:28 AM
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
I thought traffic cops paid for themselves? :unsure:
Huh? :huh:
Quote from: Ed Anger on December 14, 2011, 05:10:59 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on December 14, 2011, 05:03:59 PM
The best way to do it would be to let individual citizens enforce it. By letting people drive sell phone users off the road or shoot out their windows.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcarwarsuk.webs.com%2FCarWars_AutoDuel_compare.jpg&hash=d3f8363fce3d1d9e8dc4140b47780ba5785c654b)
:)
Good call. :D
Quote from: 11B4V on December 15, 2011, 01:14:42 AM
Huh? :huh:
Well, it only takes 5-10 minutes from flagging them down to leaving to hand somebody a ticket for hundreds of dollars. Seems a cop actively looking for traffic violations would easily offset his own salary with ticket revenues, even considering the downtime between stops.
Quote from: 11B4V on December 15, 2011, 01:14:10 AM
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
How many wanted criminals are pulled over and nabbed during a routine traffic stops.
example...For not wearing seat belt or cellphone or rolling a stop sign/light or expired reg. or failing to signal or aggressive driving or illegal lane change...etc
Driving While Black, Driving While Poor, etc.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on December 15, 2011, 07:44:16 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on December 15, 2011, 01:14:10 AM
Quote from: lustindarkness on December 14, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
The other thing is, the police needs to fight crime, they don't have the manpower to be the enforcer of a nanny state with so many laws.
How many wanted criminals are pulled over and nabbed during a routine traffic stops.
example...For not wearing seat belt or cellphone or rolling a stop sign/light or expired reg. or failing to signal or aggressive driving or illegal lane change...etc
Driving While Black, Driving While Poor, etc.
Quit being a Hippie.
Quote from: 11B4V on December 15, 2011, 07:53:43 AM
Quit being a Hippie.
:D "Mind if I take a look around, son?"