:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside it's hard for me to see how they could do this accurately in a way that entertains and educates an audience, so what's the point? And Pennsylvania... shouldn't they be in the Everglades or something?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32451476/ns/us_news-military/
QuoteMilitary enthusiasts re-enact the Vietnam War
Young and old take part in portrayal of controversial conflict
updated 6:19 p.m. ET, Mon., Aug 17, 2009
BOALSBURG, Pa. - The dirt paths that lead to Alpha Company's field headquarters are lined with overgrown grass and weeds. A canvas tent is protected by machine guns, sandbags and Army-green storage boxes. And lurking somewhere outside is the enemy: the Viet Cong.
But these aren't the jungles of southeast Asia, just the woods of small-town Pennsylvania, where 40 years after the fall of Saigon, military enthusiasts are beginning to re-enact the Vietnam War.
For decades, re-enactors have played out key events in the Revolutionary or Civil wars. Now they are illustrating one of the nation's most controversial conflicts — and paying tribute to veterans.
"We do it to honor these guys and to tell them, 'You weren't forgotten,' to tell them it wasn't always negative," said Tom Gray, 47, of Altoona, who played a platoon leader at the encampment outside the Pennsylvania Military Museum in Boalsburg, about 120 miles northeast of Pittsburgh.
Vietnam re-enactors have no national organization, but participants say Vietnam War groups are popping up around the country. Events were staged earlier this year in Houston and Jackson, Miss. Fort Harrison State Park in Indiana held a Vietnam-era "tactical demonstration" last month.
Wilbur Smith, a 61-year-old postal worker, was among the 100 or so first-day visitors at the Boalsburg bivouac. That's a fraction of the thousands who are drawn to the annual Gettysburg re-enactment each summer.
"What they're doing here is absolutely great," said Smith, who lives in Mount Union, about 50 miles west of Harrisburg, and spent a year in Vietnam as an Army sergeant in 1968-69.
"I think for a long time with Vietnam, we tried to push that out of our history, that it didn't happen, so I think this is a good thing."
Veterans approve
Museum educator Joe Horvath, a Navy veteran himself from the early 1980s, helped organize the first bivouac two years ago. Horvath said he was initially wary of the reaction the event might receive from veterans, but the response has been so positive that a second day was added to the schedule this year.
On a recent summer morning, Horvath darted around the grounds to help set the scene: Speakers needed hooking up to blare period recordings of Armed Forces musical and news broadcasts; the medical and operations tents needed organizing; and signs needed to be posted.
"Caution! Bad Guys Ahead!" read one sign posted on an overgrown path that would be used by a Vietnam patrol led by Gray — the highlight of the afternoon.
A business owner by day, Gray looked the part of a platoon sergeant. He was dressed in fatigues, smoke grenades hanging from his body, and carrying a sidearm and bayonet strapped to his legs.
The mission: a long-range patrol into the "jungle" path to gather intelligence on the enemy. About 80 onlookers watched from the clearing as the patrol entered the woods. The crowd listened as dispatches from a civilian narrator and Gray were transmitted over speakers.
"Vietnam was a different war, a guerrilla war," Horvath told them. "Once you entered, everywhere around you was a killing zone."
Cell phone doubles as radio
Gray and his men remain quiet once the patrol starts, though they cannot control the sounds of laughing children at a museum picnic area beyond the trees.
Six minutes later, gunfire erupts.
"How many?" Gray shouts. The soldier on point spots three "enemy fighters" — though those re-enactors cannot be seen from beyond the thicket of brush and woods.
Some of Gray's men fire back as the rest of the platoon kneels, shielded by the maze of trees and undergrowth.
"White 1, White 1, this is Red 6," Gray yells into a cell phone that doubles as the radio after their actual radio broke down just before the patrol. "Enemy contact, enemy contact. Small amount."
Gray orders his soldiers to turn back before another exchange of gunfire. After 15 minutes, the patrol is over. Gray's group is short a couple re-enactors, so they cancel a scene in which a soldier gets wounded and must be treated in the field.
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Visitor Linda Rosser, 55, of Altoona, got the point.
"I probably wish there was a little bit more action, but you felt as though you were right there. Once you listened to the communications, and then you heard it ... it was reality," Rosser said.
Vietnam veteran Richard Dunkle, 62, made the short trip from his Boalsburg home and explained that the negative feelings directed toward soldiers have eased to the point where he felt comfortable four years ago to start wearing his own "Vietnam Veterans" hat.
"It was time for us to be proud of what were called on to do, even though it turned out to be a very unpopular thing," said Dunkle, who also spent a year during 1968-69 in Vietnam as an aviation electronics specialist for the Army.
From 20 to 60 years old
The re-enactors ranged in age from their mid-20s to early 60s, including one man who served in Vietnam.
Ryan Rentschler, 25, of New London, Pa., helps organize a Vietnam event at Fort Mifflin in Philadelphia, including a USO-type tribute show with a Christmas 1969 theme.
Rentschler grew up listening to stories told by his father, who served during the war in the Air Force, as well as several teachers who were Vietnam vets.
"Vietnam is a whole different animal," Rentschler wrote in an e-mail. "We don't do this to shoot a lot or play army. We do this to honor vets who didn't get the welcome home they deserved."
Vietnamese re-enactors largely hidden
At least one group of re-enactors specialize in playing the North Vietnamese.
"We are a group of serious military living historians who portray the communist side during the Vietnam War," reads a disclaimer on the group's Web site. "We are NOT communists, Marxist, anti-American, or support/condone that ideology."
Another large event in Newville, about 30 miles west of Harrisburg, consists of war games that are not open to the general public because they do not offer much to watch.
"If done historically accurately, you never see anybody," Patrick Hubble, 40, a mortician from Lynchburg, Va., said in a phone interview. He helps organize the enemy re-enactors.
Back in Boalsburg, Smith approved of the mock patrol — even though the firefight was no comparison to the deadly battles of 1968. He planned to return next year and check out other commemorations in the region.
The re-enactments can "help people forget the pain even. To hide it, it stays in here," Smith said, pointing a finger to his chest. "That's hard. I think this is good."
Copyright 2009 The Associated Press.
If people want to reenact shit, that's their business.
And there's still plenty of WW2 vets around, and tards have been reenacting that shit for years.
You should reenact your chemotherapy by sticking your head in a fucking microwave.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside
There are WW2 reenactors aren't there?
Quote from: CountDeMoney on August 17, 2009, 09:35:49 PM
You should reenact your chemotherapy by sticking your head in a fucking microwave.
That would be reenacting radiation therapy which I never had. :contract:
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:36:39 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside
There are WW2 reenactors aren't there?
I don't have a problem with it, there are always wet blankets out there though.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:36:57 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on August 17, 2009, 09:35:49 PM
You should reenact your chemotherapy by sticking your head in a fucking microwave.
That would be reenacting radiation therapy which I never had. :contract:
Then use the Gamma Knife, and stab yourself in the fucking head.
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:36:39 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside
There are WW2 reenactors aren't there?
I don't have a problem with it, there are always wet blankets out there though.
Your phrasing makes it sound like you're not sure about the ethics of it, that's all.
I'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
Quote from: CountDeMoney on August 17, 2009, 09:35:49 PM
If people want to reenact shit, that's their business.
And there's still plenty of WW2 vets around, and tards have been reenacting that shit for years.
That was my reaction too when I read the first sentence of Tim's post.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PM
I'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
I bet he doesn't even go to Italy to do it.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:37:37 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:36:39 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside
There are WW2 reenactors aren't there?
I don't have a problem with it, there are always wet blankets out there though.
Your phrasing makes it sound like you're not sure about the ethics of it, that's all.
I'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
Yeah, I should have phrased that better. I just meant I wanted to discuss practical objections to it rather than getting bogged down into the ethics of the matter.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:59:40 PM
I just meant I wanted to discuss practical objections to it rather than getting bogged down into the ethics of the matter.
There are no ethics of the matter. Douche.
Looks like a certain medical sales rep was not overly receptive.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 18, 2009, 04:59:25 AM
Looks like a certain medical sales rep was not overly receptive.
:lol:
Haven't seen her since.
But, we'll see how receptive she is when she's in the trunk of my car, dammit.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PMI'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
:huh:
Do the groups draw lots to see who can be Animal MOther?
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:47:03 AM
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
You'll abandon your cool plans when you get a real hummer. :(
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:39:18 AM
Do the groups draw lots to see who can be Animal MOther?
Ooh! Ooh! I call Private Pyle. :menace:
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:48:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:47:03 AM
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
You'll abandon your cool plans when you get a real hummer. :(
Ah, but the look on environmentalist's and lefty scum's faces when you drive by them is awesome. that look of disgust would please me.
And the H2 and H3 models are for women.
Quote from: Caliga on August 18, 2009, 06:51:14 AM
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:39:18 AM
Do the groups draw lots to see who can be Animal MOther?
Ooh! Ooh! I call Private Pyle. :menace:
I'll get the towels and soap.
I think Lettow should be Cowboy, and Garbon should be Snowball.
I am not sure about the ethics of reinacting a movie when the original actors are still alive. And shouldn't they be doing this in a soundstage in Britain?
I wanna be Colonel Kurtz. :D
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 07:52:16 AM
I wanna be Colonel Kurtz. :D
The horror
I nominate Martim and Lettow to be Nick and Michael from The Deer Hunter. They just need to re-enact the game scene.
Tim could be Robin Williams' character from Good Morning Vietnam! with Cdm as Christopher Walken.
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:51:50 AM
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:48:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:47:03 AM
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
You'll abandon your cool plans when you get a real hummer. :(
Ah, but the look on environmentalist's and lefty scum's faces when you drive by them is awesome. that look of disgust would please me.
And the H2 and H3 models are for women.
Be cooler if you re-enacted GI Joe. Paint the hummer black with a cobra symbol on it and claim to be re-building the Weather Dominator.
I can be John McCain. First I blow up my shipmates and then I surrender to yellow pipple.
and what are the ethical dimensions of reinacting GI Joe?!? and it does it involve forced castration (authenticity)?
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 11:16:48 AM
and what are the ethical dimensions of reinacting GI Joe?!? and it does it involve forced castration (authenticity)?
Copyright attorneys will do so.
Quote from: Caliga on August 18, 2009, 05:15:25 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PMI'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
:huh:
My only experience of them is a Professor at my old uni. He's a specialist in the early Stuarts and the Civil War (and witchcraft/paganism generally). Not only does he re-enact the Civil War but he's a druid.
As I say confusing and scary.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 11:01:09 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:51:50 AM
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:48:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:47:03 AM
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
You'll abandon your cool plans when you get a real hummer. :(
Ah, but the look on environmentalist's and lefty scum's faces when you drive by them is awesome. that look of disgust would please me.
And the H2 and H3 models are for women.
Be cooler if you re-enacted GI Joe. Paint the hummer black with a cobra symbol on it and claim to be re-building the Weather Dominator.
Awesome. I can be totally inept and bumble around while doing it too.
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 01:32:02 PM
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 11:01:09 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:51:50 AM
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on August 18, 2009, 06:48:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 06:47:03 AM
Quote from: FunkMonk on August 17, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
Iraq War re-enactors will just be a bunch of guys in H2s driving over firecrackers. Lame. :(
I can get a hold of a couple original hummers. Mount those Nerf N-Strike Vulcan EBF-25 Blasters on them and recreate the Thunder Run in Baghdad.
Sounds like fun actually. :)
You'll abandon your cool plans when you get a real hummer. :(
Ah, but the look on environmentalist's and lefty scum's faces when you drive by them is awesome. that look of disgust would please me.
And the H2 and H3 models are for women.
Be cooler if you re-enacted GI Joe. Paint the hummer black with a cobra symbol on it and claim to be re-building the Weather Dominator.
Awesome. I can be totally inept and bumble around while doing it too.
COBRA!!!!! Of course your Nerf strikes won't actually hit anybody.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:36:39 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
:huh: The ethics of reenacting a war with living veterans aside
There are WW2 reenactors aren't there?
And American Civil War reenactors, which offends me since I was there, though lately I forget which side I fought on... :unsure:
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 18, 2009, 01:30:46 PM
Quote from: Caliga on August 18, 2009, 05:15:25 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PMI'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
:huh:
My only experience of them is a Professor at my old uni. He's a specialist in the early Stuarts and the Civil War (and witchcraft/paganism generally). Not only does he re-enact the Civil War but he's a druid.
As I say confusing and scary.
Particularly if he combines the two. Cavalier Druids fighting for King, Country and the old gods. :lol:
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 01:50:56 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 18, 2009, 01:30:46 PM
Quote from: Caliga on August 18, 2009, 05:15:25 AM
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 17, 2009, 09:44:11 PMI'm not sure about the ethics of it, what's more I think the aesthetics are more concerning. Reenactors confuse and scare me. Cal <_<
:huh:
My only experience of them is a Professor at my old uni. He's a specialist in the early Stuarts and the Civil War (and witchcraft/paganism generally). Not only does he re-enact the Civil War but he's a druid.
As I say confusing and scary.
Particularly if he combines the two. Cavalier Druids fighting for King, Country and the old gods. :lol:
Blood for the blood god!
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 18, 2009, 01:30:46 PM
My only experience of them is a Professor at my old uni. He's a specialist in the early Stuarts and the Civil War (and witchcraft/paganism generally). Not only does he re-enact the Civil War but he's a druid.
As I say confusing and scary.
The confusing and scary part seems to be his druid paganism witchcraftiness than re-enacting the battle of First Battle of Newbury.
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 01:50:56 PM
Particularly if he combines the two. Cavalier Druids fighting for King, Country and the old gods. :lol:
I think a Puritan druid could be even scarier :lol:
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 18, 2009, 02:09:56 PM
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 01:50:56 PM
Particularly if he combines the two. Cavalier Druids fighting for King, Country and the old gods. :lol:
I think a Puritan druid could be even scarier :lol:
A dour, militant puritan druid Roundhead.
Sounds something like my old "feminist issues in the law" professor ... :unsure:
The rear admiral is on the poop deck!
[English] Civil War Hijack! :w00t:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2F7%2F7a%2FJames_Butler%252C_1st_Duke_of_Ormonde_by_Sir_Peter_Lely.jpg%2F483px-James_Butler%252C_1st_Duke_of_Ormonde_by_Sir_Peter_Lely.jpg&hash=7a081a9f283087af949ef87f661f11e762daa611)
:wub:
She's not really my type.
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 02:41:24 PM
[English] Civil War Hijack! :w00t:
Montrose rocks. He'd whip Bedford Forrest in 15 minutes. Blindfolded.
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 02:28:09 PM
Sounds something like my old "feminist issues in the law" professor ... :unsure:
:lol:
ECWH:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwalter9.info%2FFairfax%2Fassets%2Fimages%2FSir_Thomas_Fairfax_-_Black_Tom.jpg&hash=c89aa825a1c0acc46400df54b0f177df96ce9d8c)
:mmm:
Can always count on Sheilbh to support the horrible side of a war. <_<
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 18, 2009, 03:59:06 PM
Quote from: Malthus on August 18, 2009, 02:41:24 PM
[English] Civil War Hijack! :w00t:
Montrose rocks. He'd whip Bedford Forrest in 15 minutes. Blindfolded.
But he'd be cynically betrayed by Charles II. :(
Everytime I think about Charles I and the ECW I always think what a comparative coward James II was. Charles I went down with the ship and never once admitted that maybe he should compromise or be reasonable for one second.
James II sees a few Dutchmen in wooden shoes and runs away.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 04:35:09 PM
Can always count on Sheilbh to support the horrible side of a war. <_<
Horrible but right, yes :)
Incidentally, after my forthcoming French Revolution binge, I'm going to buy this:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Noble-Revolt-Overthrow-Charles/dp/0297842625
:mmm:
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 18, 2009, 04:47:55 PM
Horrible but right, yes :)
No, sir, you are mistaken.
I've working my way through that God's Fury, England's Fire book.
Quote from: Valmy on August 18, 2009, 04:45:38 PM
Everytime I think about Charles I and the ECW I always think what a comparative coward James II was. Charles I went down with the ship and never once admitted that maybe he should compromise or be reasonable for one second.
James II sees a few Dutchmen in wooden shoes and runs away.
Someone here suggested to me that he was traumatized by his father's execution and didn't want the same to happen to him.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 04:49:32 PM
I've working my way through that God's Fury, England's Fire book.
I've seen that around and thought of buying it. Let me know how it is.
then maybe James should have compromised with Parliament in the years before the Dutch invasion.
so he's an either an idiot or a coward or both.
he also later fled Ireland. the Irish called him Seamus Chaca or "James the be-shitten"
Compromised with popular rabble? :x
I have to ask -why?
Vietnam really doesn't seem to be a war that lends itself well to reinactment...It doesn't even lend itself well to war movies in the conventional sense- all good 'Nam films are about the characters and small bunches of people being lost in the jungle and that sort of thing
Why did the house of Orange not continue on the British throne?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 18, 2009, 05:36:20 PM
Why did the house of Orange not continue on the British throne?
No children.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
Ryan Rentschler, 25, of New London, Pa., helps organize a Vietnam event at Fort Mifflin in Philadelphia, including a USO-type tribute show with a Christmas 1969 theme.
Rentschler grew up listening to stories told by his father, who served during the war in the Air Force, as well as several teachers who were Vietnam vets.
"Vietnam is a whole different animal," Rentschler wrote in an e-mail. "We don't do this to shoot a lot or play army. We do this to honor vets who didn't get the welcome home they deserved."
Why doesn't he joins the REAL army and do something with his life?
Quote from: Tyr on August 18, 2009, 05:24:56 PM
I have to ask -why?
Vietnam really doesn't seem to be a war that lends itself well to reinactment...It doesn't even lend itself well to war movies in the conventional sense- all good 'Nam films are about the characters and small bunches of people being lost in the jungle and that sort of thing
I dunno, I think the small skirmishes could be just as much fun to reenact as the massive battles, and a lot easier to put together.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 05:07:06 PM
Compromised with popular rabble? :x
who included the urban, commercial, majority. the middle class people who had the real power.
I'll put you down with "stupid." *makes list*
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 09:59:32 PM
who included the urban, commercial, majority. the middle class people who had the real power.
aka the last thing that a monarch in an absolutist vein would want to do. K.
Quote from: Siege on August 18, 2009, 09:25:23 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
Ryan Rentschler, 25, of New London, Pa., helps organize a Vietnam event at Fort Mifflin in Philadelphia, including a USO-type tribute show with a Christmas 1969 theme.
Rentschler grew up listening to stories told by his father, who served during the war in the Air Force, as well as several teachers who were Vietnam vets.
"Vietnam is a whole different animal," Rentschler wrote in an e-mail. "We don't do this to shoot a lot or play army. We do this to honor vets who didn't get the welcome home they deserved."
Why doesn't he joins the REAL army and do something with his life?
apparently he enlisted after 911 but was discharged because of injury in 2003. sometime after that, you enlisted, making up for the loss.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 10:01:59 PM
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 09:59:32 PM
who included the urban, commercial, majority. the middle class people who had the real power.
aka the last thing that a monarch in an absolutist vein would want to do. K.
and this was at the point in history when Britain would absolutely not accept an absolutist. so ... he was stupid, as he did not learn from the Civil War.
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 10:07:53 PM
and this was at the point in history when Britain would absolutely not accept an absolutist. so ... he was stupid, as he did not learn from the Civil War.
Oh agreed. I'm not trying to suggest that he was smart. Many of the Stuarts were not.
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 05:05:33 PM
then maybe James should have compromised with Parliament in the years before the Dutch invasion.
so he's an either an idiot or a coward or both.
he also later fled Ireland. the Irish called him Seamus Chaca or "James the be-shitten"
I'll go with "both".
His brother clever, flexible, charismatic, and amoral; James seems to have only had the last characteristic.
Quote from: saskganesh on August 18, 2009, 10:05:45 PM
Quote from: Siege on August 18, 2009, 09:25:23 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on August 17, 2009, 09:32:24 PM
Ryan Rentschler, 25, of New London, Pa., helps organize a Vietnam event at Fort Mifflin in Philadelphia, including a USO-type tribute show with a Christmas 1969 theme.
Rentschler grew up listening to stories told by his father, who served during the war in the Air Force, as well as several teachers who were Vietnam vets.
"Vietnam is a whole different animal," Rentschler wrote in an e-mail. "We don't do this to shoot a lot or play army. We do this to honor vets who didn't get the welcome home they deserved."
Why doesn't he joins the REAL army and do something with his life?
apparently he enlisted after 911 but was discharged because of injury in 2003. sometime after that, you enlisted, making up for the loss.
Medical discharge?
What kind of injury?
Every pussy that wants to quit claim injury, to get an honourable discharge.
On the other hand, I have known quite a few tough mothefuckers, that have had some pretty serious injuries, have gone through a shitload of surgeries, and are still in the army, fighting the good fight. They cannot be in recon, but there are many other things they can do. The point is, the army have a job for everyone. The army is not gonna enlist a cripple, but if you are in active duty, and get injured, the army will acomodate you, even if you have to re-class to a new MOS and become a paper-pusher.
So that story about an injury he can tell it to somebody that doesn't know how the system works.
I've known alot of reenactors who were either retired military or were reservists/on active duty. One of the Roman guys I did shows with actually got deployed to Iraq in 2006 or so.
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:07:57 AM
I've known alot of reenactors who were either retired military or were reservists/on active duty. One of the Roman guys I did shows with actually got deployed to Iraq in 2006 or so.
Was he the one who organized the gladitorial games featuring Islamicists? :P
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:07:57 AM
I've known alot of reenactors who were either retired military or were reservists/on active duty. One of the Roman guys I did shows with actually got deployed to Iraq in 2006 or so.
Yeah, but we are talking here of a 25 yo, at the peak of his physical power, not some old fat bastard that like big tits and gas station food, and can barely lift a gladious, let alone the scutum.
Quote from: Malthus on August 19, 2009, 09:10:13 AM
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:07:57 AM
I've known alot of reenactors who were either retired military or were reservists/on active duty. One of the Roman guys I did shows with actually got deployed to Iraq in 2006 or so.
Was he the one who organized the gladitorial games featuring Islamicists? :P
Now that would be awesome.
We had the light version of it, by throwing candy at the smallest kid in the gang chasing our strykers through town, and watching how the older kids beat the shit out of him. One of those little packs of M&M can do wonders.
Quote from: Malthus on August 19, 2009, 09:10:13 AM
Was he the one who organized the gladitorial games featuring Islamicists? :P
:huh:
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 09:12:44 AM
Yeah, but we are talking here of a 25 yo, at the peak of his physical power, not some old fat bastard that like big tits and gas station food, and can barely lift a gladious, let alone the scutum.
Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak. <_<
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:20:51 AM
Quote from: Malthus on August 19, 2009, 09:10:13 AM
Was he the one who organized the gladitorial games featuring Islamicists? :P
:huh:
Seems a natural cross-over. :D
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:21:32 AM
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 09:12:44 AM
Yeah, but we are talking here of a 25 yo, at the peak of his physical power, not some old fat bastard that like big tits and gas station food, and can barely lift a gladious, let alone the scutum.
Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak. <_<
Really? Lets put you in a full legionary uniform, lorica segmentata, helmet, 2 pila, etc, and lets see if you can walk 12 miles in 3 hours, at a 15min mile pace.
You can be the strongest man in the world. If you are phat, you are not going to be able to keep up with the fit guys. And a unit is as slow as its slowest element, meaning YOU. By the time your cohorte gets to the fight, the barbarians already won and are running away with your legion's banner/eagle/whatever.
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
This thread makes me want to re-enact Dachau.
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:07:57 AM
I've known alot of reenactors who were either retired military or were reservists/on active duty. One of the Roman guys I did shows with actually got deployed to Iraq in 2006 or so.
hopefully he's up on the best tactics to fight Parthians.
did he send you any pix of Ctesiphon?
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
You were put in your place. Be a man and accept it.
:lol: I wasn't, though, because I never claimed I could do what Seigey was bashing me for.
Sometimes I wish Siegey would want to be a Masada zealot reenactor.
Quote from: PDH on August 19, 2009, 11:45:00 AM
Sometimes I wish Siegey would want to be a Masada zealot reenactor.
I call Eliezer Ben-Yair! :cool:
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
I can lift my scrotum, but it's hard work.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 04:51:34 PM
Quote from: Valmy on August 18, 2009, 04:45:38 PM
Everytime I think about Charles I and the ECW I always think what a comparative coward James II was. Charles I went down with the ship and never once admitted that maybe he should compromise or be reasonable for one second.
James II sees a few Dutchmen in wooden shoes and runs away.
Someone here suggested to me that he was traumatized by his father's execution and didn't want the same to happen to him.
Maybe it was also nice just being a king, even a deposed one. The current royal family has a pretty good gig, even if they are powerless. Maybe he made the calculation that when push came to shove, political power wasn't worth risking his neck over.
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 11:03:16 AM
:lol: I wasn't, though, because I never claimed I could do what Seigey was bashing me for.
Nope. You heard it from the authority.
Cal got pwned. :yes:
Cal got lit up but Seeb broke the ROE.
Quote from: garbon on August 18, 2009, 05:45:11 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 18, 2009, 05:36:20 PM
Why did the house of Orange not continue on the British throne?
No children.
It was best for all concerned. The English really hated having the Dutch Stadtholder on the throne. They felt, very correctly btw, that he was using England and Scotland to advance the interests of The Netherlands. Plus with the Dutch and the English being fierce trade rivals it made for a tense union.
Quote from: Valmy on August 19, 2009, 01:18:52 PM
It was best for all concerned. The English really hated having the Dutch Stadtholder on the throne. They felt, very correctly btw, that he was using England and Scotland to advance the interests of The Netherlands. Plus with the Dutch and the English being fierce trade rivals it made for a tense union.
Agreed. It probably wouldn't have lasted long even if there was an heir.
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
Shamer, you said "Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak." I said if you are fat, you are weak.
Profesional soldiers fight as a unit. If you can't keep up with your unit, your unit will slow down to keep up with you. That's the way it is. Nobody gets left behind. Now, you may argue that your reenactment unit are a bunch of fat old guys. In that case, then your entire unit is weak, and whatever is the parent unit, will have to slow down to your operational pace.
So, you can lift your gladius. Ok, lets see if you can lift it after an standard 12 miles forced march. And then, lets see if you can FIGHT with it.
Look Cal, if you were a serious reenactor, you would get in shape, and get your shiny gear all dirty and muddy after force marching a minimum of 12 miles to form up the battle line of maniples. Then stand there in full gear for hours. Then burn a zillion calories hacking with your gladius, then run at least 4 miles chasing the routing enemy. And then, build a damn fort to expend the night. Every night.
I don't want to discourage you in your reenactment. I think is very cool. Just remember that war is hard work, and if you want to be great at what you do, you have to go the whole nine yards.
And it all starts by being in shape.
You're very strange Seigey.
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
Shamer, you said "Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak." I said if you are fat, you are weak.
Profesional soldiers fight as a unit. If you can't keep up with your unit, your unit will slow down to keep up with you. That's the way it is. Nobody gets left behind. Now, you may argue that your reenactment unit are a bunch of fat old guys. In that case, then your entire unit is weak, and whatever is the parent unit, will have to slow down to your operational pace.
So, you can lift your gladius. Ok, lets see if you can lift it after an standard 12 miles forced march. And then, lets see if you can FIGHT with it.
Look Cal, if you were a serious reenactor, you would get in shape, and get your shiny gear all dirty and muddy after force marching a minimum of 12 miles to form up the battle line of maniples. Then stand there in full gear for hours. Then burn a zillion calories hacking with your gladius, then run at least 4 miles chasing the routing enemy. And then, build a damn fort to expend the night. Every night.
I don't want to discourage you in your reenactment. I think is very cool. Just remember that war is hard work, and if you want to be great at what you do, you have to go the whole nine yards.
And it all starts by being in shape.
Cal got Army Strong! served!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh Snap!
I still can't see the pwnage or the servage.
Cal's an army of one! :wub:
Also, I'd prefer to be build a blessed fort.
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 19, 2009, 03:26:54 PM
I still can't see the pwnage or the servage.
Nobody is owning or serving anybody.
Unless you refer to my balls left hanging outside your smelly monkey butt.
Who the fuck is Darth Fagtaros?
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 03:35:17 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 19, 2009, 03:26:54 PM
I still can't see the pwnage or the servage.
Nobody is owning or serving anybody.
Unless you refer to my balls left hanging outside your smelly monkey butt.
:yawn:
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
Shamer, you said "Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak." I said if you are fat, you are weak.
Profesional soldiers fight as a unit. If you can't keep up with your unit, your unit will slow down to keep up with you. That's the way it is. Nobody gets left behind. Now, you may argue that your reenactment unit are a bunch of fat old guys. In that case, then your entire unit is weak, and whatever is the parent unit, will have to slow down to your operational pace.
So, you can lift your gladius. Ok, lets see if you can lift it after an standard 12 miles forced march. And then, lets see if you can FIGHT with it.
Look Cal, if you were a serious reenactor, you would get in shape, and get your shiny gear all dirty and muddy after force marching a minimum of 12 miles to form up the battle line of maniples. Then stand there in full gear for hours. Then burn a zillion calories hacking with your gladius, then run at least 4 miles chasing the routing enemy. And then, build a damn fort to expend the night. Every night.
I don't want to discourage you in your reenactment. I think is very cool. Just remember that war is hard work, and if you want to be great at what you do, you have to go the whole nine yards.
And it all starts by being in shape.
:lol:
This thread is great. :D
Cal proved he could lift his shield in the movie 300, damn Leonidas did not let him fight because "he could not lift it high enough". :(
Quote from: lustindarkness on August 19, 2009, 03:51:55 PM
Cal proved he could lift his shield in the movie 300, damn Leonidas did not let him fight because "he could not lift it high enough". :(
:o
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.paraorkut.com%2Fimg%2Ffunnypics%2Fimages%2Fo%2Fowned_by_mickey_mouse-12253.jpg&hash=628a156e56275b0a2eecec7ac012308f9a8bd124)
BTW, siege has proven once again he is a special and unike snowflake. What a character huh?
unike for unique! lol, I can't spell for shit! stupid spic. :Embarrass:
Quote from: lustindarkness on August 19, 2009, 03:59:15 PM
BTW, siege has proven once again he is a special and unike snowflake. What a character huh?
unike for unique! lol, I can't spell for shit! stupid spic. :Embarrass:
You know what you must do.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nmm.ac.uk%2Ftserver.php%3Ff%3DD3920_20030127111321.jpg%26amp%3Bh%3D650%26amp%3BlegacyResize&hash=5e8c2fea64ae9869af05f6690840ebb85201ceee)
Quote from: Siege on August 19, 2009, 03:12:25 PM
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 09:33:31 AM
:huh: What's your point? I never claimed to be fit. But earlier you had specifically said I cannot lift either a scutum or a gladius, which is patently untrue, as I own both and can easily lift both. :mellow:
Shamer, you said "Just cause I'm fat doesn't mean I'm weak." I said if you are fat, you are weak.
Profesional soldiers fight as a unit. If you can't keep up with your unit, your unit will slow down to keep up with you. That's the way it is. Nobody gets left behind. Now, you may argue that your reenactment unit are a bunch of fat old guys. In that case, then your entire unit is weak, and whatever is the parent unit, will have to slow down to your operational pace.
So, you can lift your gladius. Ok, lets see if you can lift it after an standard 12 miles forced march. And then, lets see if you can FIGHT with it.
Look Cal, if you were a serious reenactor, you would get in shape, and get your shiny gear all dirty and muddy after force marching a minimum of 12 miles to form up the battle line of maniples. Then stand there in full gear for hours. Then burn a zillion calories hacking with your gladius, then run at least 4 miles chasing the routing enemy. And then, build a damn fort to expend the night. Every night.
I don't want to discourage you in your reenactment. I think is very cool. Just remember that war is hard work, and if you want to be great at what you do, you have to go the whole nine yards.
And it all starts by being in shape.
I think my old unit needs Archery Centurion Hartman Iudaeus added to it, played by you.
I should also mention that the guy who ran the unit was old and pretty out of shape, but was a retired lifer in the Army (and had been a drill sgt. for at least part of his time in the service). Alot of the other guys were in good shape including a few who were jacked. In fact, here's a pic so you can see for yourself:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F1%2F1e%2FWells_0706_054.jpg&hash=da26109f6b80179b304a81203e611827b22f9121)
I know it's hard to tell from the pic but do most of those guys look "old and fat" to you?
Also, just one more item in my defense: I marched in several parades that had five mile routes. I think Wags and Timmy came to one we did in Worcester.
I can't and won't dispute that I'm outta shape and it would be more realistic if I wasn't, but it's not going to stop me from doing something I really like to do. :)
I don't know why you are defending yourself to Sgt. Psycho, the Arab Infiltrator.
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 19, 2009, 06:43:49 PM
I don't know why you are defending yourself to Sgt. Psycho, the Arab Infiltrator.
Well right now it's because I think he makes an interesting point, but I know he's going to spin things out of control shortly and into la-la land. :D
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 19, 2009, 06:43:49 PM
I don't know why you are defending yourself to Sgt. Psycho, the Arab Infiltrator.
No fucking shit.
Caliga, You're going to get a hard fucking time from Siegy the Chinese Sales Associate no matter what you say.
He's a Jew. You're a Roman reenactor.
I'm mean, c'mon.
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 06:39:32 PM
I can't and won't dispute that I'm outta shape and it would be more realistic if I wasn't, but it's not going to stop me from doing something I really like to do. :)
Are you talking about gorging yourself on gas station bean burritos and chili dogs? :P
You fail at understanding what sorts of food are served at these fine establishments. ^_^
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 07:30:03 PM
You fail at understanding what sorts of food are served at these fine establishments. ^_^
Quik Trip always has burritos and hot dogs on hand, dunno about chili.
The featured dish at most of the local establishments is broasted chicken, every night.
Every time I stop at the local Sunoco and see the food section they've got, I think you Caliga.
And then I see who's working at the Sunoco and prepping that food, and then my colon curls up and shudders.
People eat food at gas stations in Baltimore? I thought they only existed there for people to hold up at gunpoint?
Quote from: Tonitrus on August 19, 2009, 07:53:23 PM
People eat food at gas stations in Baltimore? I thought they only existed there for people to hold up at gunpoint?
They have to keep their blood sugar up too, you know.
Quote from: Ed Anger on August 19, 2009, 06:43:49 PM
I don't know why you are defending yourself to Sgt. Psycho, the Arab Infiltrator.
Obviously Siegefaker has him on the defensive and is pressing his advantage.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on August 19, 2009, 07:50:37 PM
Every time I stop at the local Sunoco and see the food section they've got, I think you Caliga.
And then I see who's working at the Sunoco and prepping that food, and then my colon curls up and shudders.
Don't worry, we don't permit negroes to live in this county. :hug:
Almost all the gas stations in Metro Detroit are owned by immigrants from the Middle East. Consequently many gas stations around here have falafel instead of roller grill hot dogs or chili.
I suppose it was inevitable that any discussion of military re-enactment would end in gas station food. ;)
Quote from: Caliga on August 19, 2009, 07:42:20 PM
The featured dish at most of the local establishments is broasted chicken, every night.
Broasted? Is that some sort of historically accurate Roman way of making chicken?
Quote from: Malthus on August 20, 2009, 08:25:34 AM
I suppose it was inevitable that any discussion of military re-enactment would end in gas station food. ;)
I hear it was common practice for the Roman legions to eat at gas stations on their way to the garrisons in Dacia.
Quote from: Valmy on August 20, 2009, 08:27:29 AMBroasted? Is that some sort of historically accurate Roman way of making chicken?
Er no, it's a style of pressure frying used by KFC and many places that prepare fried chicken. I don't think Colonel Sanders invented it, but IIRC he used it early-on in his business.