Mississippi is changing their flag and they've invited the public to submit their suggestions. The only requirement is that it must contain the words "In God We Trust." The submissions are now viewable here and I invite you to post your favorites: https://mdah.pic-time.com/-flagcommission/gallery
Some of them are actually fairly decent:
(https://i.imgur.com/TmhxspP.png)
Others, less so :bleeding::
(https://i.imgur.com/4kjkUiv.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/UXz7TAf.png)
I imagine that, if selected, the state flag will be exactly as depicted, wood desk or Facebook post and all:
(https://i.imgur.com/nwQetZm.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/YUONJiQ.png)
Or perhaps a flag that must be hand-written on college-ruled paper:
(https://i.imgur.com/3th2Pzz.png)
But in the end, this one's my favorite:
(https://i.imgur.com/TsDBHGQ.png)
At least one should have a gun in it. :(
I am amazed that the official flag of a US state contains an emblem of a traitorous organisation that once rebelled against the US Federal government and killed untold numbers of Americans. They are only changing that in the 21st century? :blink:
Quote from: Monoriu on August 03, 2020, 09:39:15 PM
I am amazed that the official flag of a US state contains an emblem of a traitorous organisation that once rebelled against the US Federal government and killed untold numbers of Americans. They are only changing that in the 21st century? :blink:
We...made a deal. Reconciliation was politically necessary.
Sometimes, you get more flies with honey.
Sometimes, you get generations of racist assholes with that kind of honey.
The criminal may serve his sentence and rejoin society. The heretic may renounce his false beliefs and be absolved in death. But the traitor will find no peace in this world or the next. Except in the South.
On topic: that's not a seal. It's some kind of bird.
The Mississippi flag came into being in the 1890s. It wasn't about reconciliation, it was about the dual manifestations of Jim Crow and white supremacy in both North and South. The South lost the war but after a generation passed it seized control of the peace.
Quote from: Valmy on August 03, 2020, 10:55:28 PM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 03, 2020, 09:39:15 PM
I am amazed that the official flag of a US state contains an emblem of a traitorous organisation that once rebelled against the US Federal government and killed untold numbers of Americans. They are only changing that in the 21st century? :blink:
We...made a deal. Reconciliation was politically necessary.
I am so glad a similar deal was not reached with post-WWII Germany. If the US and Germany could achieve reconciliation without the use of Swastikas, I am sure the great Mississippians could have done much better.
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 02:10:49 AM
I am so glad a similar deal was not reached with post-WWII Germany. If the US and Germany could achieve reconciliation without the use of Swastikas, I am sure the great Mississippians could have done much better.
What does Nazi Germany have to do with anything? They didn't rebel against anyone.
Europe is full of examples of peoples or nations that have rebelled and still fly their national flag.
I personally don't have a problem with folks that want to secede and find the use of the word traitor in these cases problematic.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 04, 2020, 02:44:30 AM
Europe is full of examples of peoples or nations that have rebelled and still fly their national flag.
There are many things that can be said regarding this statement, but I will limit myself to observing that Mississippi and similar are neither peoples nor nations.
Quote from: The Brain on August 04, 2020, 03:00:59 AM
There are many things that can be said regarding this statement, but I will limit myself to observing that Mississippi and similar are neither peoples nor nations.
Hopefully the many other things that can be said are more interesting than this.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 04, 2020, 03:14:55 AM
Quote from: The Brain on August 04, 2020, 03:00:59 AM
There are many things that can be said regarding this statement, but I will limit myself to observing that Mississippi and similar are neither peoples nor nations.
Hopefully the many other things that can be said are more interesting than this.
You'd hope so, but no. The above is probably sufficient though.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on August 04, 2020, 02:44:30 AM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 02:10:49 AM
I am so glad a similar deal was not reached with post-WWII Germany. If the US and Germany could achieve reconciliation without the use of Swastikas, I am sure the great Mississippians could have done much better.
What does Nazi Germany have to do with anything? They didn't rebel against anyone.
Europe is full of examples of peoples or nations that have rebelled and still fly their national flag.
I personally don't have a problem with folks that want to secede and find the use of the word traitor in these cases problematic.
I was thinking, keeping defeated emblems around isn't essential to achieving reconciliation.
I do not agree that people can just secede, and would argue that unilateral secession is traitorous behaviour.
Laser Kiwi Flag, anyone?
(https://nzhistory.govt.nz/files/styles/fullsize/public/laser-kiwi-flag.jpg?itok=_Q24A5az)
Maybe they can put a Magnolia instead of the fern.
...and the laser beam should be zapping a coronavirus :cool:
Quote from: The Larch on August 04, 2020, 05:04:58 AM
Laser Kiwi Flag, anyone?
(https://nzhistory.govt.nz/files/styles/fullsize/public/laser-kiwi-flag.jpg?itok=_Q24A5az)
Maybe they can put a Magnolia instead of the fern.
Such a missed opportunity :(
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on August 04, 2020, 01:45:03 AM
The Mississippi flag came into being in the 1890s. It wasn't about reconciliation, it was about the dual manifestations of Jim Crow and white supremacy in both North and South. The South lost the war but after a generation passed it seized control of the peace.
This. The South transformed its cause from being about slavery through the use of Russian-bot-style rewriting of history. The Confederate Battle Flag wasn't an emblem of the Confederacy, it was an emblem of the Lost Cause.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on August 04, 2020, 01:45:03 AM
The Mississippi flag came into being in the 1890s. It wasn't about reconciliation, it was about the dual manifestations of Jim Crow and white supremacy in both North and South. The South lost the war but after a generation passed it seized control of the peace.
Is that contradictory with reconciliation? It feels like the sort of reconciliation that happens in a post-conflict society where two sides decide on a common narrative and adopt new heroes, but in this case it was just between white Americans in north and south. That reconciliation was partly based on the exclusion (legally and from the narrative) of black Americans.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on August 04, 2020, 01:45:03 AM
The Mississippi flag came into being in the 1890s. It wasn't about reconciliation, it was about the dual manifestations of Jim Crow and white supremacy in both North and South. The South lost the war but after a generation passed it seized control of the peace.
The Confederate flag needs to come down and we need to examine the institutions that put it up. It is terrible that Mississippi incorporated the confederate flag into its own, but at least it wasn't designed to force black people to wear the confederate flag.
Enter the New York Yankees. They had a double A affiliate in Columbus, Georgia that went by the moniker "The Confederate Yankees". See the team photo below, which includes a confederate flag on the uniform.
The Yankees truly are the evil empire.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8C84DMM2/yankees.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ts5WN1rk)
(https://i.postimg.cc/JhJTBPR7/yankees.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
I don't think anyone doubts the evil of the Yankees.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on August 04, 2020, 01:45:03 AM
The Mississippi flag came into being in the 1890s. It wasn't about reconciliation, it was about the dual manifestations of Jim Crow and white supremacy in both North and South. The South lost the war but after a generation passed it seized control of the peace.
Acceptance of the Lost Cause myth was about reconciliation.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 04, 2020, 08:35:05 AM
Is that contradictory with reconciliation? It feels like the sort of reconciliation that happens in a post-conflict society where two sides decide on a common narrative and adopt new heroes, but in this case it was just between white Americans in north and south. That reconciliation was partly based on the exclusion (legally and from the narrative) of black Americans.
Black people were sacrificed twice, both to end reconstruction and again to reconcile.
But anyway now Mississippi gets a new flag.
I like the Stennis flag
(https://i.imgur.com/pZYBhNF.jpg)
It sucks it has to say "In God We Trust" on it. Words on flags sucks ass.
I like the first one posted with the centered magnolia.
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 01:22:01 PM
It sucks it has to say "In God We Trust" on it. Words on flags sucks ass.
I think the law requires it to say that.
Does it specify font size our language? Make it microscopic, or in Sindarin.
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 01:22:01 PM
It sucks it has to say "In God We Trust" on it. Words on flags sucks ass.
Agreed. :(
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 01:22:01 PM
It sucks it has to say "In God We Trust" on it. Words on flags sucks ass.
Why? In God We Trust, as far as I am concerned, mean US$ :contract:
Quote from: HisMajestyBOB on August 04, 2020, 01:58:52 PM
Does it specify font size our language? Make it microscopic, or in Sindarin.
I think that was the idea with the flag with Arabic writings.
I suggest that flags should be as apolitical as possible. So just pick an animal or plant that is somewhat unique to Mississippi. Use the white, blue, red colour scheme, because those are the colours of the US flag.
No political messaging of any sort.
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 08:31:49 PM
I suggest that flags should be as apolitical as possible. So just pick an animal or plant that is somewhat unique to Mississippi. Use the white, blue, red colour scheme, because those are the colours of the US flag.
No political messaging of any sort.
What sort of political messaging do you see on flags? I mean they are unlikely to put a hammer and sickle on it.
"In God We Trust" is a political message though, despite your association with currency :P
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 08:05:29 PM
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 01:22:01 PM
It sucks it has to say "In God We Trust" on it. Words on flags sucks ass.
Why? In God We Trust, as far as I am concerned, mean US$ :contract:
Aesthetic taste. Currency and flags are not the same thing.
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 08:46:07 PM
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 08:31:49 PM
I suggest that flags should be as apolitical as possible. So just pick an animal or plant that is somewhat unique to Mississippi. Use the white, blue, red colour scheme, because those are the colours of the US flag.
No political messaging of any sort.
What sort of political messaging do you see on flags? I mean they are unlikely to put a hammer and sickle on it.
"In God We Trust" is a political message though, despite your association with currency :P
I see political messaging on flags everywhere. Liberty, equality, fraternity is an obvious one. Hammer and sickle for sure. The South African one is about races. I am sure there are far more examples that I am too lazy to list.
Yes, In God We Trust is a political message. But that's a design requirement that can't be helped. The designers' job should be to design a flag that is as apolitical as possible given the circumstances.
Which flag says "liberty equality fraternity" on it? :hmm:
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 09:57:31 PM
Which flag says "liberty equality fraternity" on it? :hmm:
Stop playing dumb :P
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 10:10:56 PM
Quote from: Valmy on August 04, 2020, 09:57:31 PM
Which flag says "liberty equality fraternity" on it? :hmm:
Stop playing dumb :P
If you are talking about the French flag, that was chosen long before anybody decided the three colors meant Liberty Equality Fraternity. It was just the colors of Paris and the colors of the House of Bourbon together,
Surely Mississippi cannot choose a flag that somebody could not decide later meant something political :hmm: That's impossible.
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 08:31:49 PM
I suggest that flags should be as apolitical as possible. So just pick an animal or plant that is somewhat unique to Mississippi. Use the white, blue, red colour scheme, because those are the colours of the US flag.
No political messaging of any sort.
This is contradictory. A state is political. That is the nature of a state. And, no, Hong Kong civil service isn't any different.
Quote from: Monoriu on August 04, 2020, 08:05:29 PM
Why? In God We Trust, as far as I am concerned, mean US$ :contract:
Those are just anti-commie bucks. The official motto before the anti-communist Jesus freaks took over the US Congress was "e pluribus unum," first used in 1776.
Naturally, as someone who has no trust in gods, I like the old motto. Reading any religious tract from any religion will tell you that the last being one should trust is a god.
If there's one thing that's not political, it sure is a flag.
Quote from: Razgovory on August 04, 2020, 08:21:32 PM
Quote from: HisMajestyBOB on August 04, 2020, 01:58:52 PM
Does it specify font size our language? Make it microscopic, or in Sindarin.
I think that was the idea with the flag with Arabic writings.
Yup; that's "In God we Trust" in Arabic.
Quote from: The Larch on August 04, 2020, 05:04:58 AM
Laser Kiwi Flag, anyone?
(//)
Maybe they can put a Magnolia instead of the fern.
What would be the missisisisisisisipi version of the kiwi?
I fear something like a gollywog.
The mockingbird (Mimus polyglottos) apparently :
https://statesymbolsusa.org/symbol-official-item/mississippi/state-bird/mockingbird
Ok, laser mockingbird it is, then.
How many of the suggestions made use of SS runes?
Quote from: Richard Hakluyt on August 06, 2020, 02:33:13 AM
The mockingbird (Mimus polyglottos) apparently :
https://statesymbolsusa.org/symbol-official-item/mississippi/state-bird/mockingbird (https://statesymbolsusa.org/symbol-official-item/mississippi/state-bird/mockingbird)
I figured the state bird of Mississippi would be the possum.
Quote from: Tyr on August 06, 2020, 01:12:52 AM
What would be the missisisisisisisipi version of the kiwi?
I fear something like a gollywog.
The state bird of Mississippi is apparently the milkshake duck.
Quote from: The Brain on August 04, 2020, 09:45:59 AM
I don't think anyone doubts the evil of the Yankees.
I so so wish we had a "like" button.
Quote from: Barrister on August 06, 2020, 11:05:35 AM
Quote from: The Brain on August 04, 2020, 09:45:59 AM
I don't think anyone doubts the evil of the Yankees.
I so so wish we had a "like" button.
Also the name "Confederate Yankees" really just sounds like a way of saying "I'm from the North, but still racist!"
Or maybe someone who's still loyal to the Articles of Confederation.
Quote from: Sheilbh on August 06, 2020, 11:14:56 AM
Quote from: Barrister on August 06, 2020, 11:05:35 AM
Quote from: The Brain on August 04, 2020, 09:45:59 AM
I don't think anyone doubts the evil of the Yankees.
I so so wish we had a "like" button.
Also the name "Confederate Yankees" really just sounds like a way of saying "I'm from the North, but still racist!"
Because that's exactly what it is.
Quote from: Eddie Teach on August 06, 2020, 11:51:15 AM
Or maybe someone who's still loyal to the Articles of Confederation.
They have a confederate flag on the uniform.
I was talking about the phrase, not the actual team.
Quote from: merithyn on August 06, 2020, 11:52:25 AM
Because that's exactly what it is.
I think it was an attempt to attract Georgians to see a Yankees farm club.
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/8c93bf7f7202e425fc41fa211c62b201dfe5458b/0_0_1400_927/master/1400.jpg?width=620&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=002634450e8a9cb6d185e8600f9a9b2d)
QuoteBuzzkill: Mississippi rejects state flag featuring giant mosquito
Proposed design slipped through screening process and should not have been selected, state officials say
Quote from: The Larch on August 12, 2020, 08:50:19 AM
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/8c93bf7f7202e425fc41fa211c62b201dfe5458b/0_0_1400_927/master/1400.jpg?width=620&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=002634450e8a9cb6d185e8600f9a9b2d)
QuoteBuzzkill: Mississippi rejects state flag featuring giant mosquito
Proposed design slipped through screening process and should not have been selected, state officials say
As a kid I invented a flag for my grandparents cottage. I love my mom for going through and actually sowing the darn thing. It featured a giant fish fly in the middle, with alternating stripes of blue and green on the sides to reflect how the lake would alternate between being clear and having giant algae blooms. :lol:
Mississippi's new flag should pay homage to William Faulkner, by featuring a run on sentence that is virtually incomprehensible.
I am partial to having the flag feature the winner of the siege of Vicksburg...then Washington will not be alone in having the only flag with a human head on it.