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This Evenings State Of The Union Address.

Started by mongers, February 12, 2013, 06:04:51 PM

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derspiess

Quote from: Valmy on February 13, 2013, 10:17:45 AM
Quote from: derspiess on February 13, 2013, 10:14:55 AM
It's a wasteful program that needs to be cut.  It has been shown to have zero long-term benefits to kids' educational development.

Really?  Please show me these stats that show it is better to have had no education at all than Head Start.  That would be hilarious if true.

Well I didn't say Head Start makes them worse off.  Just that it doesn't really show any benefits once kids reach third grade.

Let's see what HHS has to say...

http://www.acf.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/opre/head_start_executive_summary.pdf

QuoteLooking across the full study period, from the beginning of Head Start through 3rd grade, the evidence is clear that access to Head Start improved children's preschool outcomes across developmental domains, but had few impacts on children in kindergarten through 3rd grade. Providing access to Head Start was found to have a positive impact on the types and quality of preschool programs that children attended, with the study finding statistically significant differences between the Head Start group and the control group on every measure of children's preschool experiences in the first year of the study. In contrast, there was little evidence of systematic differences in children's elementary school experiences through 3rd grade, between children provided access to Head Start and their counterparts in the control group.
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CountDeMoney

If they were all aborted, you wouldn't have to worry about Head Start.  You can't have it both ways, derfetuss.

Admiral Yi

I thought it was common knowledge that the positive impact of Head Start disappears in a few years.

derspiess

Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 13, 2013, 10:41:18 AM
I thought it was common knowledge that the positive impact of Head Start disappears in a few years.

It's one of those "inconvenient truths", if you will.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

derspiess

Quote from: CountDeMoney on February 13, 2013, 10:40:52 AM
If they were all aborted, you wouldn't have to worry about Head Start.  You can't have it both ways, derfetuss.

Why not?
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Valmy

Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 13, 2013, 10:41:18 AM
I thought it was common knowledge that the positive impact of Head Start disappears in a few years.

Just Head Start or preschools in general?  Anyway I am happily surprised to hear the impact of obscure preschool programs is common knowledge.
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Admiral Yi

Quote from: Valmy on February 13, 2013, 10:46:29 AM
Just Head Start or preschools in general?  Anyway I am happily surprised to hear the impact of obscure preschool programs is common knowledge.

As I am surprised to hear that Head Start is obscure.

The results are for Head Start only.

Valmy

#127
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 13, 2013, 10:49:32 AM
As I am surprised to hear that Head Start is obscure.

Um it is a program that only impacts families in poverty that comprises a miniscule portion of the federal budget.  So...a program that impacts very few people with a tiny budget?  How is that not obscure?  If I were to poll random people on the street a huge number of them are going to be familiar with the program and be well informed about its impact or lack thereof?  I mean I just assume these programs have low impact because of the population involved and the massive organization responsible but also:

QuoteThe results are for Head Start only.

I think preschool is just glorified day care in my mind anyway so it would not surprise me if it had pretty little long term impact overall.  The kids brains just cannot do things until they are developementally ready.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Admiral Yi

Quote from: Valmy on February 13, 2013, 10:57:58 AM
If I were to poll random people on the street a huge number of them are going to be familiar with the program and be well informed about its impact or lack thereof?

Is that what you consider to be the antithesis of obscure?

By that definition virtually all government programs are obscure.

Valmy

Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 13, 2013, 11:02:09 AM
Is that what you consider to be the antithesis of obscure?

By that definition virtually all government programs are obscure.

Social Security and medicare are not obcure.  Americorps?  Yes.

But anyway I didn't know so I asked about it, clearly the common knowledge never got to me.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

jimmy olsen

Quote from: derspiess on February 13, 2013, 10:14:55 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on February 13, 2013, 09:04:46 AM
Head Start made up 00.0022% of the Federal Budget in 2011. It's a miniscule drop in the bucket and it has obvious benefits to society. There are literally a hundred other programs to get upset about and slash their spending, before Head Start even comes on the radar. 

It's a wasteful program that needs to be cut.  It has been shown to have zero long-term benefits to kids' educational development.

I do enjoy the screeching from you types whenever someone suggests it be cut or eliminated.
Teachers? :unsure:
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Barrister

Quote from: Valmy on February 13, 2013, 10:46:29 AM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on February 13, 2013, 10:41:18 AM
I thought it was common knowledge that the positive impact of Head Start disappears in a few years.

Just Head Start or preschools in general?  Anyway I am happily surprised to hear the impact of obscure preschool programs is common knowledge.

Pre-schools in general.  At least for your typical middle-class family.
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