Guild Wars 2 Roll Call

[Martinus]

Here's a chart showing effects of various finishers applied to various fields. Btw, they mesh together - so e.g. an Elementalist casts a Geyser spell (a Water-attunement Staff dps AoE spell) and then a Mesmer runs into it and casts the Prestige spell (a Torch spell that creates a ring of burning fire) - presto, every ally in the area is healed!

Code Select Expand

Field  Blast Finisher  Leap Finisher  Projectile Finisher  Whirl Finisher 
Dark  Area Blindness  Blindness  Life stealing  Leeching Bolts[nb 1] 
Ethereal  Area Chaos Armor  Chaos Armor  Confusion  Confusing Bolts 
Fire  Area Might (x3)  Fire Armor  Burning  Burning Bolts 
Ice  Area Frost Armor  Frost Armor  Chilled  Chilling Bolts 
Light  Area Retaliation  Retaliation  Remove Condition  Cleansing Bolts[nb 2] 
Lightning  Area Swiftness  Dazing Strike  Vulnerability  Brutal Bolts[nb 3] 
Poison  Area Weakness  Weakness  Poison  Poison Bolts 
Smoke  Area Stealth  Stealth  Blindness  Blinding Bolts 
Water  Area Healing  Healing  Regeneration  Healing Bolts

[katmai]

Still betting Marti will be bored with game come next thur.

[Martinus]

Still betting Marti will be bored with game come next thur.

I played WoW since its release until July 2012 - that's longer than any of you fucks. So why would I get bored with a game that is better?

[Martinus]

I am wondering what build to go for my mesmer, with dungeoning in mind. I'm thinking a control role (so essentially a GW2 equivalent of a tank) could be an interesting thing to try.

Apparently, that's Staff / Scepter/Sword build, with heavy investment into Chaos and Illusions trees.

[Berkut]

The game is certianly pretty damn interesting and different.

However, in some ways it seems almost obtusely so. The combat mechanics are certainly different, but also ridiculously complex, and I am not sure in a good way.

Does every class really need 456 different possible combinations of weapons and stances, none of which are at all intuitive? I was playing my Elementalist, and trying to get all the skill combinations unlocked. So I have a two handed staff. That is 5 skills times 4 stances, so twenty skills. Twenty skills that I have to be able to remember which skill goes with which stance, so that I can remember in the middle of a fight what stance I should switch to in order to access a particular skill. Not to mention understanding WHY I would want to use skill X as opposed to skill Y.

Then lets throw in the fact that I can use multiple weapons, so now I am not looking at 20 skills, but 40, or even 60. Do I want to be in Staff/Fire right now, or Staff/Water or Dagger/Fire or Dagger/torch/Earth? And why?

This is a bit silly, not only because it is way too much to expect anyone to remember, but because you know that with that many possible combinations, the reality is that good play will indicate that the majority of them are not optimal anyway, and will probably never be used once you understand what actually works.

There is a lot of depth here, but I suspect a lot of it is just complexity for its own sake.

[frunk]

The game is certianly pretty damn interesting and different.

However, in some ways it seems almost obtusely so. The combat mechanics are certainly different, but also ridiculously complex, and I am not sure in a good way.

Does every class really need 456 different possible combinations of weapons and stances, none of which are at all intuitive? I was playing my Elementalist, and trying to get all the skill combinations unlocked. So I have a two handed staff. That is 5 skills times 4 stances, so twenty skills. Twenty skills that I have to be able to remember which skill goes with which stance, so that I can remember in the middle of a fight what stance I should switch to in order to access a particular skill. Not to mention understanding WHY I would want to use skill X as opposed to skill Y.

Then lets throw in the fact that I can use multiple weapons, so now I am not looking at 20 skills, but 40, or even 60. Do I want to be in Staff/Fire right now, or Staff/Water or Dagger/Fire or Dagger/torch/Earth? And why?

This is a bit silly, not only because it is way too much to expect anyone to remember, but because you know that with that many possible combinations, the reality is that good play will indicate that the majority of them are not optimal anyway, and will probably never be used once you understand what actually works.

There is a lot of depth here, but I suspect a lot of it is just complexity for its own sake.

For the most part the 5 skills of a weapon set will have some natural synergies, and early on it's best to worry about those rather than figuring out inter-set combinations.  Once you get familiar with those combos then you can delve into other possibilities.  Trust me, early on you'll see immediate improvement when you learn the skills on one bar right first, rather than trying to do complicated switching.

Here are two of the weapons I have with ranger:

Longbow - long ranged attack, multishot, vulnerability, push away, AoE attack
Greatsword - local area attack, weakness, flying attack, block/sword throw, stun

For attacking a single melee opponent I prefer Longbow, since I can avoid them while peppering with arrows.  For a group of melee opponents I prefer Greatsword since I can wade in and beat the hell out of them.  I can do some cool things with switching between the two, but unless I'm in a tougher fight it isn't really necessary.

[Martinus]

The game is certianly pretty damn interesting and different.

However, in some ways it seems almost obtusely so. The combat mechanics are certainly different, but also ridiculously complex, and I am not sure in a good way.

Does every class really need 456 different possible combinations of weapons and stances, none of which are at all intuitive? I was playing my Elementalist, and trying to get all the skill combinations unlocked. So I have a two handed staff. That is 5 skills times 4 stances, so twenty skills. Twenty skills that I have to be able to remember which skill goes with which stance, so that I can remember in the middle of a fight what stance I should switch to in order to access a particular skill. Not to mention understanding WHY I would want to use skill X as opposed to skill Y.

Then lets throw in the fact that I can use multiple weapons, so now I am not looking at 20 skills, but 40, or even 60. Do I want to be in Staff/Fire right now, or Staff/Water or Dagger/Fire or Dagger/torch/Earth? And why?

This is a bit silly, not only because it is way too much to expect anyone to remember, but because you know that with that many possible combinations, the reality is that good play will indicate that the majority of them are not optimal anyway, and will probably never be used once you understand what actually works.

There is a lot of depth here, but I suspect a lot of it is just complexity for its own sake.

Well, Elementalist is the most complex class I think (remember that they are the only one with twenty skills per weapon - everyone else is only 5) - that's why I dropped it because I don't think I know the game well enough yet to play it.

The developers say they deliberately created classes with different learning curves in order to accomodate different players and give veterans something to dig into. Elementalists and Thieves are apparently at the top of the curve. Guardians and Warriors are easiest to learn and master.

[Martinus]

That being said, here's a cool website I found which offers skill and weapon suggestions for different playstyles for different professions:

http://www.noxxic.com/gw2/

[crazy canuck]

However, in some ways it seems almost obtusely so. The combat mechanics are certainly different, but also ridiculously complex, and I am not sure in a good way.

Naw, it is pretty easy once you learn the mechanics.  Its just that you picked the class with the most steep learning curve.  When I went back to my ele after learning the game mechanics on other classes it was a lot more enjoyable.

Also, what Funk said.  Stick with the basics for now.  You dont have to be able to master switches in the eary areas.  If you do it in the early game you will be OP so its not necessary.

You will have already noticed though that when you switch attunements you get a fresh set of cooldowns so even if you just switch it with that in mind and only concentrate on two of the four attunements you will still probably feel OP.

[Razgovory]

So, what if Raz wants to get in on this action?

[Grey Fox]

So, what if Raz wants to get in on this action?

You give NcSoft 60$, they'll throw ~10gb of data your way & BOOM! GW2.

[Berkut]

You will have already noticed though that when you switch attunements you get a fresh set of cooldowns so even if you just switch it with that in mind and only concentrate on two of the four attunements you will still probably feel OP.

One thing I've noticed is that there seems to be a consistency to the 2 handed skills at least.

The first few skills seem to have fast cool down, the last 2 long.

So at a very basic level, there seems to be kind of a suggestion that you use your first three skills routinely, use your 4/5 when they come up, then swap to another set, use their 4 and 5, then bounce back, so that you are really cycling between 6 "use over and over skills", and 3 or 4 (assuming one is situational) "long" skills.

But like I said, my suspicion is that in the long run, many of these skills will simply never be used. For a given profession there will be a set of viable builds, and those will encompass some fraction of the total skills. The trick will be figuring them out.

[crazy canuck]

You will have already noticed though that when you switch attunements you get a fresh set of cooldowns so even if you just switch it with that in mind and only concentrate on two of the four attunements you will still probably feel OP.

One thing I've noticed is that there seems to be a consistency to the 2 handed skills at least.

The first few skills seem to have fast cool down, the last 2 long.

So at a very basic level, there seems to be kind of a suggestion that you use your first three skills routinely, use your 4/5 when they come up, then swap to another set, use their 4 and 5, then bounce back, so that you are really cycling between 6 "use over and over skills", and 3 or 4 (assuming one is situational) "long" skills.

But like I said, my suspicion is that in the long run, many of these skills will simply never be used. For a given profession there will be a set of viable builds, and those will encompass some fraction of the total skills. The trick will be figuring them out.

Naw, you are playing it wrong then.  All skills attached to the equiped and switch weapons are used routinely because of the cooldowns.  You should rarely if ever hit the 1 button, unless everything else is on a CD.  That is effectively your autoattack skill.

Also keep an eye on the red line at the bottom of the skills.  Red means no enemy in range.  No red = fire away.

To get a better feel for how it all works try a one handed off hand combo and mix and match those. 

[frunk]

So, what if Raz wants to get in on this action?

You give NcSoft 60$, they'll throw ~10gb of data your way & BOOM! GW2.

I'm on Henge of Denravi, although we're still in the free world switch period.  My username is frunkee.3962 for those that want to friend.

[Richard Hakluyt]

The game is certianly pretty damn interesting and different.

However, in some ways it seems almost obtusely so. The combat mechanics are certainly different, but also ridiculously complex, and I am not sure in a good way.

Does every class really need 456 different possible combinations of weapons and stances, none of which are at all intuitive? I was playing my Elementalist, and trying to get all the skill combinations unlocked. So I have a two handed staff. That is 5 skills times 4 stances, so twenty skills. Twenty skills that I have to be able to remember which skill goes with which stance, so that I can remember in the middle of a fight what stance I should switch to in order to access a particular skill. Not to mention understanding WHY I would want to use skill X as opposed to skill Y.

Then lets throw in the fact that I can use multiple weapons, so now I am not looking at 20 skills, but 40, or even 60. Do I want to be in Staff/Fire right now, or Staff/Water or Dagger/Fire or Dagger/torch/Earth? And why?

This is a bit silly, not only because it is way too much to expect anyone to remember, but because you know that with that many possible combinations, the reality is that good play will indicate that the majority of them are not optimal anyway, and will probably never be used once you understand what actually works.

There is a lot of depth here, but I suspect a lot of it is just complexity for its own sake.

Well, Elementalist is the most complex class I think (remember that they are the only one with twenty skills per weapon - everyone else is only 5) - that's why I dropped it because I don't think I know the game well enough yet to play it.

The developers say they deliberately created classes with different learning curves in order to accomodate different players and give veterans something to dig into. Elementalists and Thieves are apparently at the top of the curve. Guardians and Warriors are easiest to learn and master.

Indeed, which is why I am now a warrior 

I've been using a rifle and greatsword and attempting to master my use of them. Since doing that I've become far more effective. I'm theorising that learning one role really well is better than trying to master all the roles at once, so I will only expand from this dps build when I'm ready to learn more.

I think it's excellent that they have actually made some classes easier to play, makes the game more inclusive for people who are old or whatever. I would imagine that a well-played Elementalist is going to be absolutely awesome though, which is a suitable reward for those with the reflexes and other skills that are probably needed to master that class.