Europa Universalis IV announced

[Syt]

Oof. I think people overlook that Paradox is no longer the scrappy little indie studio that gets shafted by their publisher on royalty payments.

They've grown very significantly, and are a publicly traded company with all the baggage that this growth and change brings. Part of it became visible when (ex-)employees dished out last year on some of the behind the scenes going on that seemed to hint at the "old guard's" mindset not adapting and trying to keep handling like when they were basically a startup and people expect better from a company there size.

Then again, the games industry is full of shitty corporations, so what do I know.

[Josquius]

What surprises me is that Paradox more or less blew every other historical game out of the water for me. I can't play things like Civ anymore, Total War I play just for the bling. I totally fell for the historical simulation and no other game has even come close since EU1.

I would guess that Paradox is responsible for 66-75% of all my computer gaming the last twenty years.

The surprise is that they didn't start a trend, they still have no serious competitor.

Same.

Though it does seem they started to become big and crack the mainstream at about the same time they started to become thoroughly Meh.

[Syt]

I'm disappointed that they've largely given up on trying to create reasonable historicity but fully embraced paint the map fantasies, with HoI4 probably being the most egregious.

[Tamas]

I'm disappointed that they've largely given up on trying to create reasonable historicity but fully embraced paint the map fantasies, with HoI4 probably being the most egregious.

Yes. My impression is, this escalated from the vocal EU4 community expecting all Steam achievements being achievable as a basic feature of the game. It seemed like more and more of the vocal people looked at EU4 as a sort of Advanced Risk, where non-Europeans being able to catch up to Europe should be the norm and not a rare exception. I think my low point was reading some complaint about how some change made it harder to get Vietnam westernise before 1600 or something along those lines.

To be fair though, there are mods to help, like preventing Europeans to declare war on non-coastal Africa. Plus I think there's one removing North American native states or I just wanted one like that?

And, on paper they have lots of great mechanics like the Estates and tech progression which should facilitate historical simulation, but they are clearly not allowed to put them in the way of map painting.

Oh, and the later DLCs "press button to win" features are just terrible, simulation or not.

[Zanza]

I agree. In addition, I never got their focus on multiplayer optimization. I have the impression that this is just a small, but vocal minority and most of their customers are casual single players.

[Tamas]

I agree. In addition, I never got their focus on multiplayer optimization. I have the impression that this is just a small, but vocal minority and most of their customers are casual single players.

Yeah but apparently Paradox office MP matches are a big deal and allegedly inform a lot of the design decisions.

[Syt]

I agree. In addition, I never got their focus on multiplayer optimization. I have the impression that this is just a small, but vocal minority and most of their customers are casual single players.

I agree.

MP is what kept EU2 going development going for so long, because the devs like to play the game themselves with forumites.

This led to the incredibly bland initial release of EU3 which basically gave every country a level playing field (with an aim towards fair MP), because it was designed with the idea of MP first. It wasn't before DLCs and patches that countries were getting unique flavor, etc.

I do agree that the focus seems strange, because I'm sure the vast majority of players run solo campaigns. Johan used to argue that they optimize for MP because if the AI can hold their own in MP, they're a good opponent for solo, but ... I'm not sure about that.

After the bland EU3 launch and the baffling HOI3 ("Yes, Stalingrad is hundreds of km from where it actually is, but it's for GAMEPLAY REASONS" ) I was ready to give up on Paradox games. The very enjoyable CK2 demo brought me back in, and I think the CK series and Stellaris have legs and are fun. EU4 was fun at launch but is now buried under an overgrowth of mechanics and "stuff". HoI4, which is still pretty popular because WW2, also seems to be limping along aimlessly. I'm starting to think CK2 was a fluke (not least because PDX for years claimed making a sequel made no sense because of the performance of CK1).

Speaking of geography - I've never understood why the Kiel Canal in HoI4 has been turned into a Flensburg Canal instead. Not to mention that where it exits into the North Sea makes no sense because this is part of the Wattensee which turns into mudflats every 6 hours due to the tides. I mean, this is the harbor of Husum (where the HoI4 canal ends) at low tide:



The below in red would be better but still not great (it would have to bisect a province to be more realistic).



I'm sure the canal was moved for "gameplay reasons", though.

[Syt]

Oh, and I installed EU3 yesterday. Started as England, moved the slider towards centralization ... BOOM, doomstack in London that my army can't beat and BOOM, France and Scotland declare war.

Uninstalled right after.

[Solmyr]

France and Scotland declare wear.

Were you about to be kilt?

[Syt]

France and Scotland declare wear.

Were you about to be kilt?

(stupid typo )

[Solmyr]

That's actually a big problem with most Paradox games, rebels getting massive doomstacks that are stronger than your entire army. Like, where were all those people (and guns, and horses, and cannons) hiding this entire time?

[Syt]

My first thought was that I had not paid attention to my stability, but I was at +1 after the slider move, so .... yeah.,

[Tamas]

That's actually a big problem with most Paradox games, rebels getting massive doomstacks that are stronger than your entire army. Like, where were all those people (and guns, and horses, and cannons) hiding this entire time?

That's one of the tiniest problems with Paradox games - they don't have mechanics to simulate quelling unrest so they spawn doomstacks. Would it be better if it was a more abstracted mechanic but people would probably lose their shit "omg why am I losing control of mah provinces there ain't no enemy armies around"

[Habbaku]

The stupid thing is that both Stellaris and EU IV have that mechanic already--stability/crime and local autonomy, respectively. Doomstack revolts should be limited to existential or near-enough threats, while everything else should just be punishing you with low/no production from the uncontrolled area.

[DGuller]

France and Scotland declare wear.

Were you about to be kilt?