Alex Salmond to let 16-year-olds vote in bid to secure independence

[jimmy olsen]

The Scots should be crushed with fire and sword.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/alex-salmond-to-let-16yearolds-vote-in-bid-to-secure-independence-2368105.html

Alex Salmond to let 16-year-olds vote in bid to secure independence

By Hamish Macdonell

Monday, 10 October 2011

Sixteen year-olds are going to be allowed to vote in the referendum on Scottish independence in an attempt to maximise nationalist support for the break-up of Britain, the Scottish Government confirmed last night.

The current age limit for voting in elections is 18, and it is controlled by Westminster. But the proposed referendum on Scottish independence is being organised by the Scottish Executive and it can set the rules for every part of it, including the franchise.

Alex Salmond has made it clear that he intends to use his majority in the Scottish Parliament to drive through a new, lower voting age for the referendum because he knows that younger Scots are generally more nationalistic than their older counterparts.

The plan to extend the franchise to potentially another 125,000 voters – adding 3 per cent to the Scottish electorate – is just one of a number of schemes the SNP leadership is working on to maximise their chances in the referendum. Other moves include the decision to appoint a senior civil servant in the Scottish Government to focus on the push for independence and demands for new powers from Westminster.

Critics have complained that the SNP's record on domestic issues has been marked by a lack of ambition but this approach just appears to be part of the Nationalist strategy of doing nothing potentially divisive ahead of the independence poll. Mr Salmond wants to go into the referendum having cultivated a reputation for sensible, uncontroversial management of the economy. So far at least, that strategy appears to have been successful with polls showing a rise in support for independence – a trend Mr Salmond is sure to highlight when his party gathers for its annual conference in Inverness later this month.

A year ago, independence was supported by about 30 per cent of the population. According to the most recent polls, independence now commands the support of between 35 per cent and 39 per cent of the population, while support for the Union is down to 39 or 38 per cent. Mr Salmond is confident that small gap can be closed by the time the referendum is held – probably in late 2014 or early 2015.

A recent TNS poll actually put independence ahead by just 1 percentage point, by 39 per cent to 38 per cent. Crucially, though, it showed support for independence running at 40 per cent among 18-24 year-olds, with just 32 per cent in favour of the Union. Mr Salmond's spokesman said: "All sections of Scottish society will come together to choose Scotland's future and independence in the referendum, and it is only right that young folk – who can legally marry and join the armed forces – should have their say."

A senior UK government source confirmed Westminster could do nothing to stop the SNP lowering the franchise. He said: "If the Scottish Government brings forward legislation to hold a referendum on independence then it would be for the Scottish Government to decide on the franchise."

Voting ages worldwide

* If 16- and 17-year-olds are allowed to participate in the referendum on Scottish independence, they will be among the youngest voters in the world. Three British dependencies – Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man – reduced their voting ages to 16 between 2006 and 2008, and 16-year-olds can also go to the polls in a handful of states including Austria, Brazil, Cuba, Ecuador and Nicaragua. A few more countries, including Indonesia, North Korea and Sudan, allow voting at 17. However, 18 remains by far the most common voting age. Young people in Malaysia, Lebanon, Oman, Singapore and Saudi Arabia are among those who wait longest for the franchise, which comes at 21.

[Sheilbh]

Alex Salmond

Also he'll campaign for independence but that's unlikely so he'll be aiming for 'independence-lite' which will call for Scotland to have total fiscal autonomy and basically be in charge of everything but defence and foreign policy.  I think the Lib Dems support it too, they rather historically, call it 'home rule'.

[Neil]

Also he'll campaign for independence but that's unlikely so he'll be aiming for 'independence-lite' which will call for Scotland to have total fiscal autonomy

Surely that doesn't mean what I think it means?  How can Scotland survive without English money?

[Viking]

Salmond needs the NEDs to win the referendum? My opinion of Scots just improved.

[Sheilbh]

Surely that doesn't mean what I think it means?  How can Scotland survive without English money?

I think he'd still want the Barnett formula.  Failing that they could raise taxes or cut spending as they saw fit and they'd almost certainly want all North Sea oil revenue, including the Chancellor's recent levy (which I think the SNP want to cancel).

[Neil]

Surely that doesn't mean what I think it means?  How can Scotland survive without English money?

I think he'd still want the Barnett formula.  Failing that they could raise taxes or cut spending as they saw fit and they'd almost certainly want all North Sea oil revenue, including the Chancellor's recent levy (which I think the SNP want to cancel).

So it's typical sovereigntist horseshit.  They want independence, but they'll be damned if they have to give up money from the productive parts of the country as well.

[Richard Hakluyt]

I think we should pre-empt him and gain English independence first, why should we be lumbered with the Welsh and Irish?

[Sheilbh]

So it's typical sovereigntist horseshit.  They want independence, but they'll be damned if they have to give up money from the productive parts of the country as well.

Not necessarily.  I think the SNP have suggested slashing corporate tax for example.  They're big on trying to compete with England by becoming more competitive rather than having to depend on the teat of Westminster which has been the Scottish Labour Party's strategy.

The SNP's models however were Ireland, Iceland and Norway.  They look a bit more shaky now...

[Ideologue]

The Scots should be crushed with fire and sword.

No.  Not sword.  Trident.

[Valmy]

Not necessarily.  I think the SNP have suggested slashing corporate tax for example.  They're big on trying to compete with England by becoming more competitive rather than having to depend on the teat of Westminster which has been the Scottish Labour Party's strategy.

The SNP's models however were Ireland, Iceland and Norway.  They look a bit more shaky now...

So their plan is to adopt a model that is a proven failure?

[Ideologue]

So it's typical sovereigntist horseshit.  They want independence, but they'll be damned if they have to give up money from the productive parts of the country as well.

Not necessarily.  I think the SNP have suggested slashing corporate tax for example.  They're big on trying to compete with England by becoming more competitive rather than having to depend on the teat of Westminster which has been the Scottish Labour Party's strategy.

The SNP's models however were Ireland, Iceland and Norway.  They look a bit more shaky now...

Britain's model for how to deal with the SNP should be Culloden Moor.

[Admiral Yi]

they'd almost certainly want all North Sea oil revenue

Suddenly everything makes more sense.

How much of a hole would that blow in the UK's finances if they got that?

[dps]

While the legal voting age is, after all, set at an arbitrary limit, it's really dodgy and a pretty distasteful to  manipulate the franchise with an eye towards getting a particular voting result.  Much worse than the gerrymandering that some of the Euros were giving us about in a recent thread.

[Siege]

Why would people want to vote for this?
It is crystal clear this dude wants power.

[Ideologue]

they'd almost certainly want all North Sea oil revenue

Suddenly everything makes more sense.

How much of a hole would that blow in the UK's finances if they got that?

And this is exactly why secession from a liberal democracy should never be allowed, and should be laughed off as a serious idea when broached and met with force if need be.  Secession in such a state has exactly zero philosophical underpinnings and is simply one segment of British nation seeking to profit at the expense of the whole.  It's a monstrous ideology, essentially a form of geopolitical anarchy and taken to its absurd conclusions any pissant political unit, down to an individual, could secede from a nation at will when it was no longer immediately advantageous to remain.  It is the end of Western civilization, and those who hold to it should be destroyed.