Canada to firmly re-assess its status as a British colony

[Grallon]

One wonders though, if you got your way (not the separatists but your particular brand of separatism) whether minorities would continue to prosper.

...

Why should any cultural community (other than the Anglo one for the reasons stated above) be encouraged to maintain its collective identity?  If individuals originating say from Haiti left their country to come over here it's because Haiti wasn't providing them with the security/prosperity/stability they were looking for.  Why then would they attempt to rebuild here a microcosm of the failed society they left behind?  More to the point why should the majority allow them to attempt it!?  So that we may indulge in a (false) sense of openness or enlightenment?  That may be the case for a while, that is until the toxic beliefs and behaviors imported by immigrants allowed to congregate and maintain *their* social cohesion start spreading and disrupting the host society. 

Case in point: Muslims and their attitudes towards women for instance.  I see examples of this every day - at work for once.  Recently a man of Moroccan origins was fired for dereliction of duties: he would systematically disregard instructions from his female supervisor.  Allow enough individuals of like mind to 'form a community' - cozen them - as a group - with legal protections and exceptions and that type behavior will spread, gaining momentum and legitimacy - thus negating the advances of equality of the sexes reached here through historical evolution. 

No there is no reasonable argument to protect and promote micro societies within the larger one.  All individuals should be equal before the Law but there can be only one collective - the one whose contours and borders and substance is defined by the majority - until the assimilation process is complete.





G.

[Grallon]

... See the present for what it is. If you view it from the view of the past no measure will ever seem satisfactory.

And the present, for what it is, is that you can't get served in French by a company that is legally mandated to do so.  We don't need to rehash 200 yo grievances to be faced with the truth of prejudices - we're still faced with it. 




G.

[Razgovory]

Why should any cultural community (other than the Anglo one for the reasons stated above) be encouraged to maintain its collective identity? 

Repeat again, why the Anglo community should do this again?

[Neil]

And the present, for what it is, is that you can't get served in French by a company that is legally mandated to do so.  We don't need to rehash 200 yo grievances to be faced with the truth of prejudices - we're still faced with it. 

Don't be ridiculous.

[Valmy]

Not to diminish the past, Viper, but at some point you gotta let it go. In the 1800's france attacked Portugal. That mean I can five zoupa a hard time? You don't have to forget, but why dwell. See the present for what it is. If you view it from the view of the past no measure will ever seem satisfactory. 

Sure the Spanish and French posters on Paradox had awesome arguements about that.

But you can hardly hold the French responsible.  They didn't force you to be allies of the perfidious Albion.

[dps]

The fact is that historically, French-speaking Canadian were looked down on, treated as second-class citizens, often coerced into using English, and generally kept from positions of political power, even in Quebec.  But now that they have the political power within Quebec, they seem to want to treat Anglos within Quebec the same way the French speakers used to be treated.  The problem for them is that for the most part, they are limited to mostly symbolic things because of modern notions of human and civil rights--but that's not really a problem for them, because it means that they can (correctly) say that English speakers in Quebec don't have it nearly as bad as French speakers throughout Canada used to have it.  Basically, they appear to want to take revenge for past mistreatment and some current slights.  That's understandable, but being understandable doesn't make it admirable, or morally or ethically defensible.  And to an outside observer, the insistance that in the rest of Canada, French and English must be equal, but within Quebec, French must predominate, can hardly been seen as anything but hypocrisy.

[Oexmelin]

But now that they have the political power within Quebec, they seem to want to treat Anglos within Quebec the same way the French speakers used to be treated.

This is really, really, really far from any sort of actual reality.

[dps]

But now that they have the political power within Quebec, they seem to want to treat Anglos within Quebec the same way the French speakers used to be treated.

This is really, really, really far from any sort of actual reality.

Not surprising--I'm pretty far away from Quebec.  It's why I itialicized "seem" and "appear" in my post.  It sure looks that way from a distance, especially when filtered through the prism of some of the things that Grallon posts.

[jimmy olsen]

Could be malice, or could just be they figure quebecers would just go to the .fr site. Corporations on a whole rarely work on malice. Unless all the IT guys and Baard of directors really hate quebec and veto'd the implementation or something. Oversite and stupidty is often a more accurate theory.

Er... No. If I want to buy the product in Canadian dollars, with Canadian service, why would I go to the .fr site - especially when the site adjusts to the IP adress?

Just in case it was oversight, I wrote an email (in English) asking why this was the case. Twice. Over a year ago. I have yet to receive an answer. I also asked in person, when I needed customer service, to have someone who spoke French talk to me. It never happened.

And, yes, this was but a single example. But when you multiply these examples in your personal life, you get frustrated - or you get the message that to get service in any kind, you should learn English. Which is what people here seem to be championing anyway - yet this is a different form of coercion. But since it is from the market, it is all alright.

Natural language evolution and death is a positive. Languages change, adapt and die due to the needs of it's speakers. The fact that 90% of languages will die (many at the hands of French in Africa) in that next century is something to be celebrated. This will greatly enhance the ability of people around the world to communicate with each other, greatly enhancing their ability to do business and negotiate, doing much to promote peace.

[jimmy olsen]

I mean I suppose it may be inevitable that one day we'll all be... speaking Anglo-Cantonese, but that doesn't mean we should welcome it.

Anglo-Mandarin.

And why shouldn't we welcome it? If everyone on Earth spoke the same language it would be a wonderful thing.

[Barrister]

I mean I suppose it may be inevitable that one day we'll all be... speaking Anglo-Cantonese, but that doesn't mean we should welcome it.

Anglo-Mandarin.

And why shouldn't we welcome it? If everyone on Earth spoke the same language it would be a wonderful thing.

Sometimes I understand why people hate you so much.

[Neil]

I mean I suppose it may be inevitable that one day we'll all be... speaking Anglo-Cantonese, but that doesn't mean we should welcome it.

Anglo-Mandarin.

And why shouldn't we welcome it? If everyone on Earth spoke the same language it would be a wonderful thing.

They're not compatible.  Also, Chinese is an evil language, spoken by evil people.  The only way forward is their physical destruction.  English is the only proper language for a civilized person to speak.

[Ideologue]

I mean I suppose it may be inevitable that one day we'll all be... speaking Anglo-Cantonese, but that doesn't mean we should welcome it.

Anglo-Mandarin.

And why shouldn't we welcome it? If everyone on Earth spoke the same language it would be a wonderful thing.

Sometimes I understand why people hate you so much.

This is the statement you choose to turn against Tim on?  That's ridiculous.  Of course there should be a world language.

It should be English, but I only say so because it's the language of the best societies on Earth, and I already speak it.

[ulmont]

This is the statement you choose to turn against Tim on?  That's ridiculous.  Of course there should be a world language.

It should be English, but I only say so because it's the language of the best societies on Earth, and I already speak it.

I really don't give a shit.  I swear to learn a standard version of Icelandic and only use GMT if everyone else will agree to do the same and I never have to fuck around with languages, locales, and time zones again.

[jimmy olsen]

This is the statement you choose to turn against Tim on?  That's ridiculous.  Of course there should be a world language.

An article on why language death shouldn't be feared.
http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/articles/2009-Fall/full-McWhorter-Fall-2009.html