Bachmann running neck and neck with Romney in Iowa

[alfred russel]

What do they need to do to show you they're serious?

Is this a joke?

Have a plan of some sort to balance the budget.  That plan needs to include cutting both entitlements and defense spending.  I mean common sense Spicey.  Do you really need to ask this?

Didn't they basically do this with the Ryan plan?

[Valmy]

Didn't they basically do this with the Ryan plan?

No.

Well ok it speculated that with their plan the budget would be balanced in 50 years.  I was not impressed.

Of course even that lame plan was waaaay to radical for the douchebags in the legislature.

[alfred russel]

No.

Well ok it speculated that with their plan the budget would be balanced in 50 years.  I was not impressed.

A deficit is sustainable if it is offset by GDP growth and inflation. A deficit that is 2%-3% of GDP should be sustainable. The plan would be there in 2022 according to the CBO review, at least as the plan is written (which really isn't implementable).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Path_to_Prosperity

[Razgovory]

I suspect nutty fiscal conservatives believe you can balance the budget simply by cutting foreign aid or something equally trivial.

Every little bit helps.  When you need to start cutting things from your budget, the small stuff like NPR funding and Harry Reid's Cowboy Poetry Festival are the easiest to cut first. things you don't like are the easiest to cut fist

Fixed your post.  If they want a place to start, cut pork in their own districts.  If they want to be taken seriously, gore their own oxen first.

[Razgovory]

It makes me think they do not actually give a shit about the deficit and just want to use this as an excuse to attack Democrat backed programs.  Not that there is anything wrong with that but please...show me you are serious first and not just jerking us around.

What do they need to do to show you they're serious?

Cause otherwise it's just cheap demagoguery.

[derspiess]

If they want to be taken seriously, gore their own oxen first.

Yeah, you'd like that, wouldn't you.

[Razgovory]

If they want to be taken seriously, gore their own oxen first.

Yeah, you'd like that, wouldn't you.

I'd like them to put up or shut up.  So far all I see is, "Times are bad, we think the burden should be born by someone who is not us.", type thinking.

[The Minsky Moment]

The republicans did roll out a plan that would effectively end medicare.

Not precisely.  It proposed to replace medicare with a voucher system that a number of years out would actually cost more.

[The Minsky Moment]

Didn't they basically do this with the Ryan plan?

The Ryan plan didn't IIRC specify cuts in defense spending, although if you analyze out its implications, it would involve cutting defense spending to approximately zero some 20 years out.

The plan has some interest as a concept release or discussion point, but not as an actual budgetary proposal.

[alfred russel]

The republicans did roll out a plan that would effectively end medicare.

Not precisely.  It proposed to replace medicare with a voucher system that a number of years out would actually cost more.

If you replace medicare with a voucher system tied to CPI, you have effectively ended the program imo. Providing vouchers for private insurance, and then tying the vouchers to an inflation index that is much less than the increase rate for health care costs, ends the government's insurance that the elderly have access to decent health care.

I don't know whether the overall costs would be higher or lower (beneficiaries would likely be paying more out of pocket), but I think the cost to the government would be going down long term. 

The Ryan plan didn't IIRC specify cuts in defense spending, although if you analyze out its implications, it would involve cutting defense spending to approximately zero some 20 years out.

The plan has some interest as a concept release or discussion point, but not as an actual budgetary proposal.

Yes--defense spending was included in a bucket that would be cut very (and unrealistically) deeply.

[MadImmortalMan]

We have 700 overseas bases, yet we can make bombing runs over Afghanistan from a base in Missouri. That might be a good place to start.

[Razgovory]

We have 700 overseas bases, yet we can make bombing runs over Afghanistan from a base in Missouri. That might be a good place to start.

Go ahead.  I've never seen the utility of a bomber base in the middle of Rat's Ass Missouri.

[grumbler]

oh well, it sounded too unbelievable for even the most extreme poe.

At least she just said, "oops!" rather than trying to argue it wasn't a mistake, like Palin does.

[KRonn]

I assume this is a new idea, by a Dem and Repub together, not a rehash of a rehash. But it seems difficult lately to keep track of what the Dems and Repubs are proposing, counter proposing, or else bashing each over the heads with for political gains.   
But at least it's another proposal, the concepts of which can added to debate by Congress, to try and get some changes going.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/06/28/lieberman-coburn-to-pitch-plan-to-stabilize-medicare-save-500-billion-over-10/?test=latestnews

Lieberman, Coburn to Pitch Plan to Stabilize Medicare, Save $500 Billion Over 10 Years

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/06/28/lieberman-coburn-to-pitch-plan-to-stabilize-medicare-save-500-billion-over-10/#ixzz1QZcq41YF

Sens. Joe Lieberman, I-Conn., and Tom Coburn, R-Mont, an unlikely duo, are joining forces in an attempt to save Medicare -- one of the key points of debate in the fight over deficit reduction.

The pair plan to unveil their Medicare plan Tuesday as White House and congressional negotiators struggle to nail down an agreement to cut spending and raise the debt ceiling before the Obama administration's emergency measures run out in early August.

Coburn is an original member of the Senate's "Gang of Six," which had been trying to negotiate a compromise deal on raising the debt ceiling. He is on a self-described "sabbatical," in part because of a disagreement with Democrats in the group over entitlement reform. Coburn is also planning to introduce a plan as early as next week that he says would slash the debt by $9 trillion.

Lieberman and Coburn describe their Medicare plan as "a bipartisan proposal to save Medicare and reduce the debt."

A Lieberman source asked to remain anonymous in order to reveal, in advance, the following information about the senators' legislation:

• According to Congressional Budget Office estimates, the Lieberman/Coburn proposal would save approximately $500 billion over 10 years and reduce Medicare spending in the out years.

• It would extend the solvency of Medicare Part A by allocating $250 billion of savings found through this proposal to the Medicare Part A Trust Fund, almost doubling the size of the fund.

• It would reduce Medicare's 75-year unfunded liabilities by $10 trillion.

• It would significantly reduce the fiscal impact of the Medicare Part B program on the federal budget.

• For the first time in the history of the Medicare program, it would offer seniors catastrophic medical coverage to protect them from bankruptcy or massive health care debt due to an unplanned medical emergency or a long-term illness.

• It would contain a three-year "doc fix" that is paid for and will bring stability to Medicare's provider system.

• It would preserve Medicare for current and future enrollees.

In the broader debt negotiations, Republicans are demanding steep spending cuts as a condition for supporting an increase in the debt ceiling. They claim Democratic negotiators in the talks led by Vice President Biden have been pushing too hard for tax increases as part of that deal -- kicking it up to President Obama and party leaders to figure out the next step.

[Admiral Yi]

I'd like them to put up or shut up.  So far all I see is, "Times are bad, we think the burden should be born by someone who is not us.", type thinking.

  Retirees are all Democrats?