'Handcuffed by policy': Fire crews watch man drown in neck deep water

Started by jimmy olsen, June 01, 2011, 07:31:59 AM

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jimmy olsen

Fucking Shameful :bleeding::bleeding::bleeding:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43233984/ns/us_news-life/

Quote'Handcuffed by policy': Fire crews watch man die
Budget cuts blamed after Calif. first responders look on as suicidal man stands in water for an hour

msnbc.com staff and news service reports
updated 6/1/2011 5:26:21 AM ET


SAN FRANCISCO — Fire crews and police could only watch after a man waded into San Francisco Bay, stood up to his neck and waited. They wanted to do something, but a policy strictly forbade them from trying to save the 50-year-old, officials said.

A witness finally pulled the apparently suicidal man's lifeless body from the 54-degree water.

The San Jose Mercury News reported that the man spent nearly an hour in the water before he drowned. The newspaper identified the man as Raymond Zack.

According to reports, first responders and about 75 people watched the incident from the shore.

Interim Alameda Fire Chief Mike D'Orazi said Monday's incident is troubling. He has directed staff to write a new policy that would allow water rescues in the city of about 75,000 people across the bay from San Francisco.

'Deeply regrettable'
The previous policy was implemented after budget cuts forced the department to discontinue water rescue training and stop maintaining wetsuits and other rescue gear, D'Orazi said Tuesday.

"The incident yesterday was deeply regrettable," he said. "But I can also see it from our firefighters' perspective. They're standing there wanting to do something, but they are handcuffed by policy at that point."
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A witness, Perry Smith, told a television station the man was visible from the shore of Crown Memorial State Beach and was looking at people.

"We expected to see at some point that there would be a concern for him," another witness, Gary Barlow, told KGO-TV.

Witness Sharon Brunetti told the Mercury News that Zack's stepmother stopped her on the beach and asked her to call 911, saying he was threatening to take his own life.

Zack "gradually inched out farther and farther" from the shore but occasionally glanced back over his shoulder at the beach, Brunetti said.

"The next thing he was floating face down," the Mercury News quoted her as saying.

Too shallow for a boat
The Coast Guard was called to the scene, but the water was too shallow for a boat, Alameda police Lt. Sean Lynch said. Police officers didn't have the gear for the cold water and couldn't risk being pulled under.

"Certainly this was tragic, but police officers are tasked with ensuring public safety, including the safety of personnel who are sent to try to resolve these kinds of situations," Lynch said.

"He was engaged in a deliberate act of taking his own life," Lynch told the Mercury News. "We did not know whether he was violent, whether drugs were involved. It's not a situation of a typical rescue."

D'Orazi said crews may have decided it was too risky to attempt the rescue, even if they had not been shackled by the restrictions on water rescues.

In addition to the new policy, Alameda fire personnel will receive training in water rescues, and rescue equipment will be inspected to make sure it is not damaged, D'Orazi said.

There are no lifeguards at the beach, said Isa Polt-Jones, a spokeswoman with the East Bay Regional Park District. Signs at the park advise swimmers to enter the water at their own risk.

"This just strikes me as not just a problem with funding, but a problem with the culture of what's going on in our city, that no one would take the time and help this drowning man," Alameda resident Adam Gillitt told KGO.

The Associated Press and msnbc.com staff contributed to this report.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

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Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
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garbon

"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Neil

What's wrong with this?  There's a policy, and if you don't follow it you get disciplined and bankrupted by lawsuits.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

Slargos

In a society crippled by lawsuits, this certainly shouldn't raise any eyebrows.

derspiess

When I first glanced at the story I figured with San Francisco's progressive attitude toward individual liberties, they were just respecting his wishes.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

garbon

Quote from: derspiess on June 01, 2011, 09:11:51 AM
When I first glanced at the story I figured with San Francisco's progressive attitude toward individual liberties, they were just respecting his wishes.

I'm thinking it didn't happen in SF because the Alameda police and fire department are mentioned. :contract:
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Ed Anger

Alameda was too busy at the range blowing shit up with the Mythbusters.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

Lucidor

Should have tased him from the beach. It's the only way to be sure

derspiess

Quote from: garbon on June 01, 2011, 09:54:54 AM
Quote from: derspiess on June 01, 2011, 09:11:51 AM
When I first glanced at the story I figured with San Francisco's progressive attitude toward individual liberties, they were just respecting his wishes.

I'm thinking it didn't happen in SF because the Alameda police and fire department are mentioned. :contract:

:blush:  Well then I change 'San Francisco' to 'California' in my post.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

DGuller

They were watching him die for an hour?  :wacko:  If they couldn't save him, they could've at least just shot him.  But I bet that's against a policy as well. :rolleyes:

Berkut

I bet the union demanded a bunch of overtime pay for water rescue training, did not get it, so now insist that nobody is allowed to go in the water.
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Eddie Teach

Water can't have been that cold if it took him an hour to die.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

garbon

Quote from: derspiess on June 01, 2011, 12:03:44 PM
Quote from: garbon on June 01, 2011, 09:54:54 AM
Quote from: derspiess on June 01, 2011, 09:11:51 AM
When I first glanced at the story I figured with San Francisco's progressive attitude toward individual liberties, they were just respecting his wishes.

I'm thinking it didn't happen in SF because the Alameda police and fire department are mentioned. :contract:

:blush:  Well then I change 'San Francisco' to 'California' in my post.

Then your statement becomes inaccurate. ;)
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Monoriu

We had a case where someone had a heart attack in a truck.  The driver drove him to the nearest hospital and asked for help at the reception.  He was told to call an ambulance even though he was already at the hospital.  The guy died.