TV/Movies Megathread

[Malthus]

Agreed. Though it was a step up after the series before on the planet where the show really lost its way stretching out a thin few episodes long story to fill a series.

Yeah, I understand that the underlying theme of the show is that the danger to humanity is not the protomolecule/aliens more than humans themselves, but the colony conflict last season and the Inaros war in this one haven't felt that interesting.

I enjoyed it - the notion that our petty tribal grievances and jockeying for national and ethnic advantage, that we somehow cannot overcome, lead us to the brink of some sort of cosmic destruction.

I get that some people enjoyed the revelation of the cosmic forces at work more, but the series can't be just one such revelation after another. It had to be about the human impact of those revelations.

[mongers]

Bruce Willis's new film on netflix, 'Anti-Life' is truly astonishing.

In a good or bad way? 

I have a feeling Bruce will be attending a certain satirical awards ceremony. 

[Savonarola]

The Punisher (2004)

I take back anything bad I may have said about the Dolph Lundgren version of this film.  As compared to this version, Dolph's version is a Laurence Olivier Shakespearean tragedy brought to the big screen (though with a somewhat lower body count.)

There are many problems with this one.  The actions scenes are dull, (other than the one where he kills a man with a paper slicer, that seems to come straight from Arnold Schwarzenegger's "Commando"), and you never think for a moment that The Bad Guys are going to kill The Punisher.  There are many times where the plot doesn't make sense; why does The Punisher reveal to the police that he's still alive? and once the bodies start piling up where are the police?  The worst though, is that the film goes into light rom-com territory.  The Punisher moves into an apartment next door to a couple quirky neighbors and a fragile, yet resilient, single woman who sees through The Punisher's tough exterior to the vulnerable man within.  That really doesn't work in a nihilistic revenge movie.

Quick reminder 

Okay, there is some plot in there about the Yakuza kidnapping children, and Louis Gossett Jr. wanting to help Dolph, but for the most part this is an orgy of blood straight out of 80s America.  The budget is low, the acting is wooden (except for Gossett seems to be under the mistaken impression that he's in a real movie), the suits are Polo (or a reasonable knock off of such), the haircuts are yuppie and the Japanese are taking over everything.  There are explosion, there are ninjas and everyone is armed to the teeth with automatic weapons.  It might be the most 80s of 80s action movies.

To be fair the martial arts are remarkably good for a western film from that period.

Welcome back to 2004! That Punisher movie with Travolta has had a deserved horrendous reputation ever since.

Budget is indeed low for Dolph's Punisher, but it is all practical effects, Aussie stuntmen. Yes, acting leaves something to be desired but I have seen Dolph in far worse, not counting Kindergarten Cop 2, the HD Video sitcom photography was painful to look at. Arnie's original, of which Kindergarten Cop 2 is more of a remake as in cop goes undercover in hipster/woke/veggie lover land than a sequel, must be a masterpiece now.
Interestingly, the original was victim of cancel culture, for allegedly taking a pro-cop view.

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2020/08/kindergarten-cop-screening-portland

I probably shouldn't have called it the most 80s of 80s action movies; either Rambo with its Vietnam War revisionism or Rambo 3 with it's cold war jingoism deserves that title.  It is very 80s though.

The 2004 version fails the most basic rule of action cinema: don't make the explosion and shoot out scenes boring.  The Dolph version at least got that right.

[Valmy]

Bruce Willis's new film on netflix, 'Anti-Life' is truly astonishing.

In a good or bad way? 

I have a feeling Bruce will be attending a certain satirical awards ceremony. 

Willis stopped caring about acting some time ago so that assessment doesn't surprise me.

[celedhring]

Agreed. Though it was a step up after the series before on the planet where the show really lost its way stretching out a thin few episodes long story to fill a series.

Yeah, I understand that the underlying theme of the show is that the danger to humanity is not the protomolecule/aliens more than humans themselves, but the colony conflict last season and the Inaros war in this one haven't felt that interesting.

I enjoyed it - the notion that our petty tribal grievances and jockeying for national and ethnic advantage, that we somehow cannot overcome, lead us to the brink of some sort of cosmic destruction.

I get that some people enjoyed the revelation of the cosmic forces at work more, but the series can't be just one such revelation after another. It had to be about the human impact of those revelations.

I appreciate the concept, not the execution of it in the past two seasons. Both antagonists around which this conflict was created (Murtry and Inaros) were cardboard villains. The traitorous martian admiral seems at first glance a far more interesting figure.

I think the first seasons did an excellent job of weaving both aspects of the show, fwiw.

[Duque de Bragança]

I probably shouldn't have called it the most 80s of 80s action movies; either Rambo with its Vietnam War revisionism or Rambo 3 with it's cold war jingoism deserves that title.  It is very 80s though.

The 2004 version fails the most basic rule of action cinema: don't make the explosion and shoot out scenes boring.  The Dolph version at least got that right.

I was not criticizing you for saying it might be the most '80s of 80s action movies. 

Maybe slightly hyperbolic, but if you had never seen it, and/or forgot that Marvel movies were not always family-friendly CGI crap fests, then Dolph's Punisher is still a great '80s action herald .
Subjectively, you could always say it is your/the most 80s of 80s action movies, just after watching the movie without weighting the pros and cons, and assessing the other candidates.
For me, it's my favorite Marvel movie. 

Influence-wise, certainly Rambo II/First Blood part 2 but it is tough to watch nowadays with the MIA fantasy.

Rambo III is still a hoot to watch, with eminently quotable dialog. 

[Barrister]

I probably shouldn't have called it the most 80s of 80s action movies; either Rambo with its Vietnam War revisionism or Rambo 3 with it's cold war jingoism deserves that title.  It is very 80s though.

The 2004 version fails the most basic rule of action cinema: don't make the explosion and shoot out scenes boring.  The Dolph version at least got that right.

I was not criticizing you for saying it might be the most '80s of 80s action movies. 

Maybe slightly hyperbolic, but if you had never seen it, and/or forgot that Marvel movies were not always family-friendly CGI crap fests, then Dolph's Punisher is still a great '80s action herald .
Subjectively, you could always say it is your/the most 80s of 80s action movies, just after watching the movie without weighting the pros and cons, and assessing the other candidates.
For me, it's my favorite Marvel movie. 

Influence-wise, certainly Rambo II/First Blood part 2 but it is tough to watch nowadays with the MIA fantasy.

Rambo III is still a hoot to watch, with eminently quotable dialog. 

Most 80s of 80s action movies is some pretty tough competition though.

Which is the most 80s out of movies like:

The Terminator, Die Hard, They Live, RoboCop, Beverly Hills Cop, Lethal Weapon, Rocky IV, Raiders of the Lost Arc, Escape from New York, Aliens, Top Gun...

(and that's just giving only one movie per action star: Stallone and Schwarzenegger movies alone could fill up a list)

[Duque de Bragança]

All good candidates but Raiders of the Lost Ark as an action movie? Conan the Barbarian, if you need fantasy, another Schwarzenegger film but prior to Terminator.

Most importantly, not on '80s action Ruthless Reviews movie list. 

http://www.ruthlessreviews.com/the-ruthless-guide-to-80s-action/

[Tonitrus]

All good candidates but Raiders of the Lost Ark as an action movie? Conan the Barbarian, if you need fantasy, another Schwarzenegger film but prior to Terminator.

Most importantly, not on '80s action Ruthless Reviews movie list. 

http://www.ruthlessreviews.com/the-ruthless-guide-to-80s-action/

Yeah, I don't really consider Raiders an "action" movie.  More of an "adventure/quest" movie maybe.  I know that may be splitting hairs a bit, but I definitely would NOT consider akin to films like Commando, etc.

Even Conan I think goes more into the "Sword & Sorcery" genre.  Or maybe I am just being snooty, and these are more sub-genres. 

[Barrister]

All good candidates but Raiders of the Lost Ark as an action movie? Conan the Barbarian, if you need fantasy, another Schwarzenegger film but prior to Terminator.

Most importantly, not on '80s action Ruthless Reviews movie list. 

http://www.ruthlessreviews.com/the-ruthless-guide-to-80s-action/

I thought I might get grief over Beverly Hills Cop (more of an action-comedy), but sure Raiders is an action movie.  It has all kinds of action in it!  It's probably best classified as an action-adventure movie.

[celedhring]

Funnily, I have had the "Are Indiana Jones movies action films?" debate many times. I side with Barrister on this, they're certainly a different flavor of action than the Arnie, Stallone or Willis movies, but they are action movies. They have some of the most thrilling action scenes of the 1980s!

[Barrister]

Funnily, I have had the "Are Indiana Jones movies action films?" debate many times. I side with Barrister on this, they're certainly a different flavor of action than the Arnie, Stallone or Willis movies, but they are action movies. They have some of the most thrilling action scenes of the 1980s!

I hadn't really considered anyone would take the "con" side in this debate.

I mean what really is the difference... it's rated PG rather than R?

[celedhring]

Funnily, I have had the "Are Indiana Jones movies action films?" debate many times. I side with Barrister on this, they're certainly a different flavor of action than the Arnie, Stallone or Willis movies, but they are action movies. They have some of the most thrilling action scenes of the 1980s!

I hadn't really considered anyone would take the "con" side in this debate.

I mean what really is the difference... it's rated PG rather than R?

The more ellaborate con argument I've heard (which I still don't buy) is that the Indy films are build around mysterious quests in exotic settings ("adventure"), and the action in them is just a means to this end. OTOH, something like Commando or Die Hard is built with the purpose of showing Arnie/Willis going to town on people (each movie with a markedly different approach), but that's ultimately the primary purpose of the film.

The correct answer is that you can't put movies in a perfectly defined box, and every movie will have elements of several genres. Some will be more dominant than the others (there's a love story in Terminator, but we aren't calling it a romance film), but in the case of the Indy movies the ellaborate action pieces are a big part of what you're watching the movie for.

[Duque de Bragança]

Funnily, I have had the "Are Indiana Jones movies action films?" debate many times. I side with Barrister on this, they're certainly a different flavor of action than the Arnie, Stallone or Willis movies, but they are action movies. They have some of the most thrilling action scenes of the 1980s!

I hadn't really considered anyone would take the "con" side in this debate.

I mean what really is the difference... it's rated PG rather than R?

'80s action has a Reagan-era ideology side, they are not called Reaganian films without a reason, more so abroad. No such thing for the Indy movies.

With Milius behind Conan the Barbarian it fits the bill, besides inventing the modern Sword and Sorcery, and defining filmic Heroic Fantasy until the Lord of the Rings.

As a matter of fact, Red Dawn was the first PG-13 movie.

PS: the '80s action Ruthless Reviews is biased against Reagan and Republicans, tongue-in-cheek and misconstruing left and right but there is a part of truth in their "analysis" of the phenomenon in their '80s timeline. http://www.ruthlessreviews.com/the-ruthless-guide-to-80s-action-timeline/ Text is perhaps not exactly safe for work, but no graphic pictures.
PG means family-friendly in the '80s, with PG-13 more enough than not, not really fitting the bill, Red Dawn notwithstanding.

Otherwise, by the same logic, even Return of the Jedi is an action movie.  With some SF elements. 

[Sheilbh]

Yeah - I can sort of see both sides because the 80s had a very strong action movie aesthetic which Indiana Jones doesn't really fit into. In a way the Indy films are arguably closer to, say, the Goonies or Hook than Die Hard or the Terminator.