Britain's First TV Election Debate

[Jacob]

Another British phrase that sounds incredibly grating.

98% of what you say is incredibly grating.

[grumbler]

Why wasn't the BNP allowed to participate? Shameful behavior on the part of the BBC. You can't silence the people!

ITV

Fate rule violation 

[grumbler]

Another British phrase that sounds incredibly grating.

98% of what you say is incredibly grating.

Stick to the point.   Whether Timmay is grating or not has nothing to do with the fact that the phrase "drink driving" is absurd and grates the ear.

I am not sure what it even means to drive a drink or what the drink is supposed to be driving.  Drink isn't an adjective (even in British English, according to Cambridge and Oxford dictionaries), it is a noun and a verb.  Thus, it cannot modify "driving." The phrase either lacks a subject or an object, and thus grates.

[Sheilbh]

A poll for tomorrow's Sun:

Lib Dems overtake Labour
Posted on April 16th, 2010 by Anthony Wells

For once I do not need to add a caveat about changes being inside the margin of error and not necessarily being significant – today's YouGov poll for the Sun shows a huge surge for the Liberal Democrats on the back of Nick Clegg's debate performance, putting the Lib Dems ahead of Labour and into second place. The topline figures are CON 33%(-4), LAB 28%(-3), LDEM 30%(+8). The surge in Lib Dem support therefore seems to have come pretty evenly at the expence of the Conservatives and Labour. This is the highest level of support YouGov have recorded for the Liberal Democrats since the aftermath of the Brent East by-election victory, way back in 2003.

On a uniform swing these figures would leave Labour the largest party, despite being in third place. The Lib Dems would have around about 100 seats. In reality though, it's almost impossible to say how this would translate into an election result. In 1983 when the SDP Liberal Alliance almost pushed Labour into third place UNS was actually a pretty good predictor of the result, but who knows how it would work in practice now. If the Lib Dems stay at this sort of figure I'm sure we'll eventually see some more detailled polling to see how the electoral plates are shifting, but till then it is speculation.

The questions now are firstly whether other polls show the same thing? Secondly how long this boost lasts. Is it mostly a publicity boost that will rapidly disappear, or will it stick around? Boosts after things like the Brent East by-election didn't last long, but in this case the Lib Dems will probably enjoy a further publicity boost from the very fact there are polls showing them in second place, and on top of that there are two more debates to go. Thirdly, how does this change the narrative – can the Lib Dems start painting themselves as a contender to actually win?

[Sheilbh]

I am not sure what it even means to drive a drink or what the drink is supposed to be driving.  Drink isn't an adjective (even in British English, according to Cambridge and Oxford dictionaries), it is a noun and a verb.  Thus, it cannot modify "driving." The phrase either lacks a subject or an object, and thus grates.

I've no idea where it comes from.  We've no legal phrase like DUI, I think we the crime is 'drunk-driving'.  My guess is that 'drink-driving' became the norm to reflect the growing unease (and illegality) to do with any drinking before driving rather than driving when leathered.  Or possibly an ad campaign 'is the drink driving?'  Sort of thing?

[alfred russel]

I'd be amused if Labor came in third. Based on that poll, it seems as though the Conservatives have a chance to come in third. That would amuse me even more. Unless the Lib Dems win, that would just concern me.

[Sahib]

I'd be amused if Labor came in third. Based on that poll, it seems as though the Conservatives have a chance to come in third. That would amuse me even more. Unless the Lib Dems win, that would just concern me.

Why would that concern you?

[alfred russel]

I'd be amused if Labor came in third. Based on that poll, it seems as though the Conservatives have a chance to come in third. That would amuse me even more. Unless the Lib Dems win, that would just concern me.

Why would that concern you?

It wouldn't keep me awake at night, but I wonder whether the third party in the UK has the depth to effectively run a government.

[garbon]

We elected Obama.

[Barrister]

I'd be amused if Labor came in third. Based on that poll, it seems as though the Conservatives have a chance to come in third. That would amuse me even more. Unless the Lib Dems win, that would just concern me.

Why would that concern you?

It wouldn't keep me awake at night, but I wonder whether the third party in the UK has the depth to effectively run a government.

It's never happened here on a national level, but provincially it happened in 1990 in Ontario.  Out of nowhere the perennial-third place NDP came out of nowhere and won a majority.  Bob Rae's government was universally panned at the time, and afterwards the NDP has returned to 3rd place status.

So yeah, I'd be worried.

[alfred russel]

We elected Obama.

Who had people like Hillary to fill out the cabinet.

You probably don't remember Perot's run. When we got the vice presidential debates, we realized the second best guy he could call on was some completely senile old guy that started wandering around the stage. If he couldn't find a decent VP, what kind of Secretary of the Interior would he have had?

[garbon]

Who had people like Hillary to fill out the cabinet.

It wasn't clear that such would be the case.

[Sheilbh]

It wouldn't keep me awake at night, but I wonder whether the third party in the UK has the depth to effectively run a government.

That's what the civil service is for

I think there's some truth to that.  We expect someone to be able to be Secretary of State for the Environment one day and the next Foreign Secretary.  And the sad truth is in terms of genuinely talented politicians all parties are working with a pretty small pool.  I mean Labour and the Tories have no more than 10 at most who are really big enough for the departments they manage.

[Barrister]

It wouldn't keep me awake at night, but I wonder whether the third party in the UK has the depth to effectively run a government.

That's what the civil service is for

I think there's some truth to that.  We expect someone to be able to be Secretary of State for the Environment one day and the next Foreign Secretary.  And the sad truth is in terms of genuinely talented politicians all parties are working with a pretty small pool.  I mean Labour and the Tories have no more than 10 at most who are really big enough for the departments they manage.

And how many do the Lib-Dems have?

[Sheilbh]

You probably don't remember Perot's run. When we got the vice presidential debates, we realized the second best guy he could call on was some completely senile old guy that started wandering around the stage. If he couldn't find a decent VP, what kind of Secretary of the Interior would he have had?

Well we also had a debate of the would-be chancellors which the Blessed Vince Cable won.  He's the most popular economic spokesman of any party, Chris Huhne at home is pretty decent but then the talent does thin out.

It's never happened here on a national level, but provincially it happened in 1990 in Ontario.  Out of nowhere the perennial-third place NDP came out of nowhere and won a majority.  Bob Rae's government was universally panned at the time, and afterwards the NDP has returned to 3rd place status.

So yeah, I'd be worried.

We had it once, Ramsay MacDonald wasn't great.